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0302 found in Venezuela

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by elmotorizado, Dec 16, 2009.

  1. Aardy

    Aardy F1 Rookie
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    The badge on the Ferrari-Mercedes in the background ??
     
  2. tongascrew

    tongascrew F1 Rookie

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    Yes there is and I will get back to you. tongascrew
     
  3. elmotorizado

    elmotorizado Formula Junior

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    #253 elmotorizado, May 25, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  4. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    At this point what is your guess as to which car this is and which car the car in Europe is?
     
  5. elmotorizado

    elmotorizado Formula Junior

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    When I first red your question i thought it was an easy one, it is not.
    The car that is in Venezuela has been in discussion since December, I beleive it is a 625TF chassis we can see 2 serial numbers and the specialists have not concluded anything yet.
    The car in Europe has been recognized as 0304/TF, some people have doubts, would be nice to have them participating in the thread.

    branko
     
  6. tongascrew

    tongascrew F1 Rookie

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    Hi, I have one picture of the repro. Date, location, owner unknown.I don't think this car will help you in any way as it is only a reproduction and not a very accurate one .My suggestion is to see if you can locate Juan Quintano in Spain. From what I can gather he is a major Ferrari collecter and according to the Barchetta listing for 0304TF is the owner of this 625TF. I have tried to locate him thru Google without luck but there are references to him as a Ferrari collecter and show participant. I will have to leave it to you to try and contact him. If his car is the original 0404TF he should be able to give you details of the chassis. From what I have seen of your car the rear of the chassis comes up over the rear axle, not in a curve but in several straight tube sections finishing off in a high straight level tube to the end of the frame. This is similar to how it is shown in the cutaway. The first thing we need to know from Quintano is if the frame on his car is similar. I have my boubts about this as 0304TF is a barchetta and not a berlinetta..It is possible the Quintano may not be aware of this project. If he was we should have heard from him by now. I will make a post on this thread to see what we can com up with about Mr Quintano.Good luck. just one man's opinion tongascrew
     
  7. elmotorizado

    elmotorizado Formula Junior

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    #257 elmotorizado, May 27, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Hi will you please post it or give a link so I can know what it looks like and make my desition about how accurate or not it is.

    I already tried getting in contact with him, and am sure he knows about this find and thread.

    His car is a 625 TF, that is for sure.


    It has been discussed before, the CUTAWAY is wrong, please forget it.

    Please see posts
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  8. Athanase

    Athanase Formula Junior

    Jan 27, 2007
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    In the book " Triumph and Tragedy, the 1955 world sports car season" of Yves Kaltenbach, there is page 184 a small photo showing the rear of this car at the Venezuelan Grand Prix 1955.The rear wings are strangely 500TR Scaglietti 56 type (!) and the gas cap is located approximately 10 centimetres ahead than on a 500MD/750M.
     
  9. tongascrew

    tongascrew F1 Rookie

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  10. elmotorizado

    elmotorizado Formula Junior

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    Tongascrew, please read message 225.
    branko
    PS and please dont say you have something if it can not be shared in a 21st century way.
     
  11. tongascrew

    tongascrew F1 Rookie

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    I am sorry you feel that way. A friend of mine was hauled into court for posting[on another subject] a copyrighted photo. I am a member of the "retro club" and plan to stay out of court.Remember, the cars we are dealing with are from long before the internet. I am sure you'r not living on the lamb or in a witness protection program so just send me your address and I will send you what ever you request. I have received correspondence from place like Cairo,Egypt, Thailand an others. I am sure I can get something to you. just one man's opinion tongascrew
     
  12. elmotorizado

    elmotorizado Formula Junior

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    I would understand you if you show me someone taken to court for emailing a copyrighted photo, e mail arrives a second later not months later or perhaps never.
    branko
     
  13. jsalgatti

    jsalgatti Karting

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    #263 jsalgatti, May 29, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    After a close look to Branko's photographs and based on some of the GILCO drawings and blueprints, found at www.gilcodesign.com (166 MM, 250 MM, 500 S) and some other sources, I came up with this rough sketch (no dimensional accuracy) which in my opinion (far from beeing a Ferrari expert!) could be a real Ferrari chassis frame, whatever its real serial number is.

    Of course, a more deeper research and "in situs" inspection could bring more light as to its authenticity...

    Cheers
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  14. tongascrew

    tongascrew F1 Rookie

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    E-mail is a completely different thing. Send me your e-mail address and I will send you the picture. tongascrew
     
  15. elmotorizado

    elmotorizado Formula Junior

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    #265 elmotorizado, Jun 4, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Thanks, you are refering to car number 42 driven by Julio Pola that for some reason was referred as "Bastard" by the Scuderias documents.
    A couple of pictures of car number 42.
    I am looking for better pictures of this car.
    branko
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  16. elmotorizado

    elmotorizado Formula Junior

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    #266 elmotorizado, Jun 7, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Lets see if someone has more info about the description of Pola's car, the only meaning I could find find for "BAST" is BASTARDA, meaning it was some kind of a hybrid.
    Can someone bring more info about it?
    Does someone have a picture of a a 625 or 735 engine with just one distribuitor.
    Branko
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  17. Aardy

    Aardy F1 Rookie
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    I'm sure I have read somewhere that s/n 0562 was the Scaglietti Spyder crashed by Ascari at Monza (Ascari killed), repaired and called by the factory "Bastardo" before being sold to Dos Santos. Can't remember more. Who knows more ?? For sure "Bastardo" has a connection with the Ascari's crash...
     
  18. elmotorizado

    elmotorizado Formula Junior

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    #268 elmotorizado, Jun 7, 2010
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  19. Aardy

    Aardy F1 Rookie
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    Branko,

    I'm sure the car called "Bastardo" is 0562 but, as you showed, #42 (Pola) is not the same car than the one owned by Dos Santos (0562). Who can help ??
     
  20. elmotorizado

    elmotorizado Formula Junior

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    I wonder how many car were called bastarda I have only on other example when Mauro Forghieri called 0846 bastard.

    As the "TECHNICAL DATA SHEET" of "330 P3/P4 Chassis n.0846" clearly states, the P3 wheelbase
    of 0846 was 2412mm and was changed in December 1967 to 2400mm when 0846 was converted
    by Ferrari from a P3 to a P 3/4, the "bastard 330 P3/P4" Mauro referred to in his answer #6.


    Besides 0562 was fitted with a 2 liter engine after Ascari's crash I understand, why was it entered as a 3 liter? IMHO because it was not a Monza chassis nor engine, hence the description.
    branko
     
  21. Boudewijn

    Boudewijn Moderator
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    At the Buenos Aires 1000km in January 1956 both cars, 0440MD and 0562M, showed up and the photos show these identical painted cars with resp. racenumbers 30 and 20 with the distinct different sideducts as you mentioned. I think the Pola-car at Caracas was 0440MD.
     
  22. Boudewijn

    Boudewijn Moderator
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    #272 Boudewijn, Jun 7, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    This little photo shows the abandoned car of Pola/Muro with number 34 at Sebring in March 1956 with the wider sideduct, so 0462M this time.
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  23. elmotorizado

    elmotorizado Formula Junior

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    #273 elmotorizado, Jun 7, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    To many differences between Pola's car and 0440 at Buenos Aires.
    Does anyone have a good picture of car number 42 from different angles?
    Thanks
    branko
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  24. arnoux40

    arnoux40 Rookie

    Mar 25, 2010
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    Some times it seems instead of clarifying everything about this car everything gets more confused....
     
  25. Boudewijn

    Boudewijn Moderator
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    #275 Boudewijn, Jun 8, 2010
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