News

0718...

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by 134282, Mar 29, 2004.

  1. 134282

    134282 Four Time F1 World Champ
    BANNED

    Aug 3, 2002
    40,647
    California
    Full Name:
    Carbon McCoy
    So i was looking at an old photo of this car and my friend noticed something weird about the bonnet... Off to one side, towards the front, it looks like there's some kind of hatch/door that lifts up... i know it sounds weird, but that's exactly what it looks like... Unfortunately, i don't have a digital copy of the picture that i could post (maybe i could get one, not sure), but was wondering if anyone knows anything about this car that would tell us why the hood had some weird contraption on it...

    For what it's worth, the picture was taken while the car was racing (many years ago, i guess)... It's a black and white photo...
     
  2. Boudewijn

    Boudewijn Moderator
    Moderator

    May 15, 2003
    4,123
    The Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Boudewijn Berkhoff
    #2 Boudewijn, Mar 29, 2004
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  3. 134282

    134282 Four Time F1 World Champ
    BANNED

    Aug 3, 2002
    40,647
    California
    Full Name:
    Carbon McCoy
    Boudewijn, hi, thanks for replying... Unfortunately, because of the angle of the picture you've posted, there's no clear view of the hood... i'll see what i can do about posting a copy of the picture i'm talking about...
     
  4. Sfumato

    Sfumato F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 1, 2003
    9,718
    Llanfairpwllgwyngyll, Anglesey, Wales
    Full Name:
    Angus Podgorney
    NNO, I believe it was a remote access oil hatch. Depending on time, car may have had a chevy in it. I helped reunite this chassis with it's original motor back in the 80's, from Mr. Lovely. Nice chassis, pretty unscathed. If you find a better pic, post away...my archives of this car are all analog.
    LK
     
  5. 134282

    134282 Four Time F1 World Champ
    BANNED

    Aug 3, 2002
    40,647
    California
    Full Name:
    Carbon McCoy
    Are you serious...? A Chevy engine...? The picture i saw was old... Very old... Why would someone have put a Chevy engine in this car so long ago, while it was racing...? Who modified the body to make the "trap door" for the oil hatch...?

    Sorry for the delay in responding, i was out of town... Thanks for the reply...
     
  6. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

    Nov 20, 2002
    17,673
    Tauranga, NZ
    Full Name:
    Pete
    NNO,

    This was a common thing to do as these race cars got old and uncompetitive. In NZ even the Alfa Romeo P3 ended up with all sorts of engines as the original failed, etc.

    It is great that these mods can be undone, but we have to remember not to blame anyone, as they were just trying to keep it racing with the tools they knew ... ie. heaps more tuners of Chevy v8's than Ferrari engines, etc.

    Pete
     
  7. 134282

    134282 Four Time F1 World Champ
    BANNED

    Aug 3, 2002
    40,647
    California
    Full Name:
    Carbon McCoy
    Pete, thank you... :)
    i wasn't blaming anyone for anything, rather just curious as to why it had a Chevy in it... That seems kind of odd since Ferraris engines seem to have been superior to Chevy's...
     
  8. Gerald Roush

    Gerald Roush Karting
    Honorary

    Apr 2, 2004
    225
    Atlanta, GA
    Full Name:
    Gerald L. Roush
    #8 Gerald Roush, Apr 3, 2004
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  9. Gerald Roush

    Gerald Roush Karting
    Honorary

    Apr 2, 2004
    225
    Atlanta, GA
    Full Name:
    Gerald L. Roush
    Guess I should have mentioned the photo was taken at the 24 Hours of Le Mans in 1958. It shows the car driven by Mairesse and Bianchi for Equipe National Belge. They were a DNF after a crash. The reference books differ as to what car this was. Finn's Testa Rossa book says it was 0718 while Rogliatti's Francorchamps book says it was 0724.
     
  10. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

    Nov 20, 2002
    17,673
    Tauranga, NZ
    Full Name:
    Pete
    Yes they may be but there is heaps more knowledge on how to get reliable hp out of the Chevy ... and when a Chevy goes bang, easy fix. When a Ferrari engine goes bang ... sometimes never put back together again.

    That is why they were replaced, as back in those days not many people knew about rebuilding Ferrari engines and also the Chevy probably produces MORE hp (as large sized engine).

    Pete
     
  11. 134282

    134282 Four Time F1 World Champ
    BANNED

    Aug 3, 2002
    40,647
    California
    Full Name:
    Carbon McCoy
    Pete, that certainly makes sense...

    But how about what Gerald posted...? The engine in the car was still a Ferrari engine, so why the remote oil hatch...?
     
  12. Aardy

    Aardy F1 Rookie
    Consultant

    Feb 21, 2004
    3,691
    France
    Full Name:
    Cyril TESTE
    #12 Aardy, Apr 3, 2004
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I think you can see clearly on this picture the reason of this panel.

    After a stop and refueling, mechanics must have forgotten to screw in, this is why you see the trap-door opened on the Gerald picture.

    Note that the same detail was also visible on 0736TR N°21 at 1958 Le Mans so we can say that it was a "Ecurie Nationale Belge" special arrangement.

    I have also a pic of 0736TR at 1958 Leopoldville GP on 7 sept 1958 with N°10 with the same panel on hood.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  13. Aardy

    Aardy F1 Rookie
    Consultant

    Feb 21, 2004
    3,691
    France
    Full Name:
    Cyril TESTE
    The trap was still there on 0736TR at 1959 Le Mans race N° 10.
     
  14. Bryanp

    Bryanp F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 13, 2002
    3,713
    Santa Fe, NM
    My guess is that the trap door - just about over the radiator cap - enabled one person to top off the radiator a lot more quickly. With the unaltered hood arrangement, either one guy would have to run around both sides of the car to undo the bonnet clips, pull the bonnet's 2 tongues out of their holes (and if you don't pull it absolutely straight back, the tongues bind in their holes) and THEN fill the radiator. I know pit stops in the 1950s were leisurely affairs by today's standards, but the trap door would have still been a time-saver.
     
  15. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

    Nov 20, 2002
    17,673
    Tauranga, NZ
    Full Name:
    Pete
    Agree.

    Pete
     
  16. Sfumato

    Sfumato F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 1, 2003
    9,718
    Llanfairpwllgwyngyll, Anglesey, Wales
    Full Name:
    Angus Podgorney
    That was an oil/rad access panel. The oil access was probably most important then, as rings/ seals were 50's tech, and the pits were on right side, ergo easiest to get to that filler neck on the 168. Also, open flap may have given some more airflow thru radiator if it was running hot, incidental, but relevant. After all, they'd take tin snips to cars back then for cooling. Prob did it for LM, as oil comsumption would be greatest on long races.
    Glad to see Gerald here, I think we met many moons ago...don't remember where, PB perhaps? Long ago.
    FWIW
    Lee
     
  17. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
    Honorary Owner

    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
    Full Name:
    Jim Glickenhaus
    At LeMans you can't add water untill the car has gone I believe 400 miles. The flap could be sealed by an official to insure you didn't. You were only allowed to add fluids in the pit's not on the course. The seals monitored this as well.
     
  18. Sfumato

    Sfumato F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 1, 2003
    9,718
    Llanfairpwllgwyngyll, Anglesey, Wales
    Full Name:
    Angus Podgorney
    Left oil cap seal visible on the filler in open hood pic below as well, about 5 o'clock on the L. Esoterica much appreciated, Jim, I couldn't remember how long/far they had to refrain from fluid replentishment. Rad and R filler likely used since sealed, ergo no inspection sticker? Different race, but rules same, I assume, apart from vagaries of the ACO.
    Lee
     
  19. Miura Jota

    Miura Jota F1 Rookie

    May 26, 2004
    3,610
    Toluca , Mexico
    Full Name:
    Martin
  20. michael platzer

    michael platzer F1 Veteran

    Nov 12, 2003
    5,181
    Austria
    Full Name:
    Michael Platzer
    Silver with red stripe today - i took pics at the Cavallino Classic some years ago. Have to resize them and then i will post it!
     
  21. michael platzer

    michael platzer F1 Veteran

    Nov 12, 2003
    5,181
    Austria
    Full Name:
    Michael Platzer
    #21 michael platzer, Sep 23, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  22. tongascrew

    tongascrew F1 Rookie

    Jan 3, 2006
    2,989
    tewksbury
    Full Name:
    george burgess
    Pascal's book identifys the car as0724. just one man's opinion tongascrew
     

Share This Page