250 GTO 4399 Crashed at Goodwood Revival.

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by miurasv, Sep 9, 2017.

  1. ATTENTION: http/https Bug Fix! Most of us have been experiencing problems staying logged in as we navigate the site. That is simply the result of links varying between http and https, which each require different logons. To resolve we are going to force https starting sometime Wednesday. However, you may have problems accessing FerrariChat until after you log out, clear cookies/browser cache, and log back on. Keep in mind my email is admin@ferrarichat.com if you do have access problems after Wednesday. Thanks!
  1. bigodino

    bigodino F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 29, 2004
    10,244
    The Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Peter den Biggelaar
  2. bigodino

    bigodino F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 29, 2004
    10,244
    The Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Peter den Biggelaar
  3. bigodino

    bigodino F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 29, 2004
    10,244
    The Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Peter den Biggelaar
    By the way I don't have any problems with replicas participating in races like Goodwood Revival, they should just be upfront about it. There's one downside: owners with real cars will probably think twice about entering their precious car in such an event. Too bad the Trofeo Nastro Rosso hasn't really taken over from the Shell Historic as I hoped it would. Real gentleman "racing" with real cars.

    Just my 2 Eurocents.
     
    lgs and Daytonafan like this.
  4. Daytonafan

    Daytonafan Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Oct 18, 2003
    2,479
    Surrey, England
    Full Name:
    Matthew
    +1 I'm pretty sure none of the top 10 runners in the revival TT are original cars. If I was lucky enough to own a 250GTO I wouldn't want to enter it in a race were the day jobs of a good number of the drivers is the British Touring Car Championship!
     
    lgs likes this.
  5. sperry

    sperry Karting

    Aug 6, 2013
    92
    Awesome information in this thread. Thanks for all the great pictures!
     
  6. malcolmjl

    malcolmjl Rookie

    Mar 27, 2014
    31
    Its become a victim of its own success.
     
  7. Tired of seeing this ad? Upgrade now
  8. Tobi

    Tobi Rookie

    Jun 24, 2011
    31
    I think the wiper issue mentioned by P.Singhof is interesting, because the wipers should not toggle from show to show and race to race. But it still contradicts to bigodino's differences above. However, even the real car could undergo such changes like the rivets or different wiper arrangement.
    In case there is a replica, I don't understand why Bamford (or other owners) doesn't disclose this. It's not a shame. It's understandable if he doesn't want to race the original. On the other hand, this replica is not a plastic body on a beetle chassis. It's a converted 250 or a completely rebuilt 1:1 copy. It would still cost a few millions then. And the effort for fixing a crashed replica is the same than fixing a crashed original. This would make a replica nonsense again since the original has also been rebuilt several times already.
    I see, the more I think about it, the more opinions I have for myself :)
     
  9. bigodino

    bigodino F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 29, 2004
    10,244
    The Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Peter den Biggelaar
    I don't think so. The real one always has the wipers parked to the right hand side, the replica always to the left.
     
  10. Tobi

    Tobi Rookie

    Jun 24, 2011
    31
    OK, but then your post #101 shows not the real one.
     
  11. GBTR6

    GBTR6 Karting

    Dec 29, 2011
    230
    Titletown, USA
    Full Name:
    Perry Rondou
    Does that mean the wipers can only be parked one way?

    Perry
     
  12. Tobi

    Tobi Rookie

    Jun 24, 2011
    31
  13. Tobi

    Tobi Rookie

    Jun 24, 2011
    31
    The wipers are either flat on the windshield bottom to the right or the left in idle position. In return position, they are more vertical aligned to the windshield side. So, this is a clear differentiation.
     
  14. Tired of seeing this ad? Upgrade now
  15. bigodino

    bigodino F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 29, 2004
    10,244
    The Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Peter den Biggelaar
    I know it might look that way in the picture but they really do park to the right hand side.
     
  16. tomgt

    tomgt F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 22, 2004
    5,483
    Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Tom Wiggers
    #114 tomgt, Sep 17, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2017
    Replica's / Continuations / Tribute cars are NOT allowed at GR
    https://www.markevans.co.uk/television/inside-jaguar-making-a-million-pound-car/

    "I caught up with Lord March, master of this particular motoring Mecca, to ask him if he would allow any of the six new Lightweights to race at the iconic Revival or the even more exclusive Members’ Meeting. His answer was immediate. It was clear he didn’t need to think about it. ‘No’, left little room for doubt. He sees these new cars as replicas and replicas simply don’t make the grid at Goodwood"

    Someone must open Mr March' s eyes and disprove :)
    But in the end: money rulezz
     
  17. Daytonafan

    Daytonafan Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Oct 18, 2003
    2,479
    Surrey, England
    Full Name:
    Matthew
    miurasv likes this.
  18. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 19, 2008
    5,487
    Cardiff, UK
    Full Name:
    Steven Robertson
  19. tomgt

    tomgt F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 22, 2004
    5,483
    Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Tom Wiggers
    So it is all incorrect what is written in this thread and is Chris Harris.
    Jaguar E_-Type comp. continuation cars are not allowed so all cars racing at Goodwood are the real McCoy then.

    All 250lm, gto, swb are REAL.
    We have to believe the respected Lord March.
     
  20. torquespeak

    torquespeak Formula Junior
    Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 24, 2010
    452
    UK
    Full Name:
    Ed
    Am I the only one that thinks that "not a completely original LM" makes it sound like it's *mostly* an original LM? Because it really isn't...

    I have no problem with replicas running at Goodwood, providing they start marking them in the programme very clearly as replicas.

    A family of four with two teenagers pays ~£500 for a weekend ticket. They should know without equivocation what they are actually looking at.

    -Ed
     
    miurasv likes this.
  21. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 19, 2008
    5,487
    Cardiff, UK
    Full Name:
    Steven Robertson
    +1.

    The first sentence "The car is not a completely original LM" makes it sounds like it's mostly an original LM as you said but the second sentence "It has some original bits, but it is an exact recreation" makes it sound like it's mostly a recreation.
     
  22. malcolmjl

    malcolmjl Rookie

    Mar 27, 2014
    31
    I think there may be a bit of a "ship of theseus" situation going on where original parts are fitted to replica cars in order for them to race. Its entirely possible that it was a replica of 4399 that crashed with a few of the original bits stuck on for the race. That way the owners and GR are both satisfied and they can tell the half truth that its "original."
     
  23. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 19, 2008
    5,487
    Cardiff, UK
    Full Name:
    Steven Robertson
    Isn't there an entry list with chassis numbers of the cars declared for each of the races? How are the cars scrutinized?
     
  24. torquespeak

    torquespeak Formula Junior
    Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 24, 2010
    452
    UK
    Full Name:
    Ed
    It doesn't include chassis numbers. And the Revival isn't an official FIA event, so it's not covered by FIA rules (i.e. you can be in breach of your HTP and there's no requirement for any action to be taken against you).

    This, from Motor Sport, after the 2007 event:
    http://www.motorsportmagazine.com/archive/article/november-2007/11/play-game

    -Ed
     
    tomgt and miurasv like this.
  25. Daytonafan

    Daytonafan Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Oct 18, 2003
    2,479
    Surrey, England
    Full Name:
    Matthew
    My suspicion is the continuation Jags were not allowed in as there are already more than enough E Types competing as it is. It's probably easier to get an entry with the rep GTO and LM as otherwise there would have been be almost no Ferraris competing in the TT this year. If there were four or five real GTO's, 330LMB's, LM's competing you probably wouldn't see the reps on the entry list.

    At the end of the day Goodwood is primarily about entertainment and of the 50,000 or so people watching on the Sunday I suspect 90% don't care if the cars are real or not. Of then 10% that do care very few would say I'm not going to go because the cars are replicas.
     
  26. TTR

    TTR Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 29, 2007
    1,326
    Riverside, CA
    Full Name:
    Timo
    Well stated.
    I at times wonder (but not that hard) how many owners of this caliber cars loose sleep over worrying what some interweb experts consider appropriate for them to do with their cars.
     
    Daytonafan likes this.
  27. ferrarip4

    ferrarip4 Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    May 8, 2008
    1,189
    Sydney, Australia
    Full Name:
    Chanh Lê Huy
    Actual nose detail of 4399GT at Le Mans 1964. You can see that there's work to be done on the car to look like it was then...
     

    Attached Files:

Share This Page