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288GTO, F40, F50, ENZO how long does it take

Discussion in '288GTO/F40/F50/Enzo/LaFerrari' started by Mark(study), Nov 12, 2003.

  1. Mark(study)

    Mark(study) F1 Veteran
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    How long does it take for a normal production Ferrari to pass a special edition Ferrari?


    Does the 1995 355 out perform the 1984 288GTO?
    Does the 2003 360CS beat the 1989 F40?
    How many years till the normal street Ferrari beats the F50?
    Someday the entry level Ferrari will beat the Enzo? How many years will that take?

    For you stat guys. Is there an average number of years?
     
  2. allanlambo

    allanlambo F1 Rookie

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    The answer to all your questions is "NO", and it will be a very very long time.
     
  3. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    I doubt anything but an extremely limited edition and very expensive car will ever surpass the Carrera, Enzo, Pagnoni, Knonisberg, McLaren, or Bug. I doubt ANY street legal car will ever beat a Dauer (street legal) 962.
     
  4. amenasce

    amenasce Two Time F1 World Champ
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    The 355 already can take the 288 GTO.
    The CS is faster around Fiorano than an F40.
     
  5. Mark(study)

    Mark(study) F1 Veteran
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    so it took 11 years for the 355 vs 288

    and it took 14 years for the 360CS vs F40

    Seems its taken longer each time if this is a trend.


    At some point, light weight materials might make some gains over HP but that's all I can think of ???
     
  6. Mark(study)

    Mark(study) F1 Veteran
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    Would you rather have a F40 or a 360CS ?
     
  7. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Andrew
    That's quite true but what are we going to use as benchmarks? An F1 won LeMans, as did a 962. There are factory street legal versions of those cars. An Enzo's 0-100-0 is pretty much at the limit of streatable tires. A Bug's top speed (remember the tires must be able to run at max speed until the car runs's out of gas to be street legal) is at the limit of tire technology. At some point you reach the limit of human beings and the laws of physics. CART race cars on one track were so fast that the drivers were blacking out. An Enzo is much faster than most drivers. What's the point in making a car faster than most drivers can drive. The 917-30 CanAm was so fast it killed the seris. If anything F1 cars are slowed down today by regs as if they didn't the cars would achieve speeds that would scare even you.
    Best
     
  8. Aircon

    Aircon Seven Time F1 World Champ

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    With all due respect to the 360CS, Fiorano has been resurfaced and the tyres on it are MUCH better (seconds per lap) than the days when the F40 was tested. It's POSSIBLE that it's as fast, but I seriously doubt it.
     
  9. F1racer

    F1racer F1 Rookie

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    I would take the Ferrari F40 because its one of the greatest supercar ever made.
    Okay the 360 CS sounds unbelieveable and maybe its faster than the F40 but I would still take the legendary F40.
     
  10. richard

    richard Formula 3

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    Whaaa?? Sorry to be a nazi about it, but you're seriously slaughtering the names of those cars!

    Pagani Zonda C12
    Koenigsegg CC8S
     
  11. allanlambo

    allanlambo F1 Rookie

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    Well lets see, i will never run a car on Fiorano, so out on the street, the older cars will beat the newer ones...easily.
     
  12. allanlambo

    allanlambo F1 Rookie

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    Im sorry, but a 360 CS is not faster than a F40. In terms of outright speed, an F40 will chew up and spit out a 360 CS.
     
  13. Mark(study)

    Mark(study) F1 Veteran
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    What's the HP on the F40? 400ph? Back in 1989?

    How is it faster then the 360CS ? What difference does the turbo make?
     
  14. Jay GT4

    Jay GT4 F1 Rookie

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    I'm sorry but a 360 even a 360CS is boring compared to an F40. An F40 is 2 seats afixed to a motor and nothing else!

    amenasce, you're right. If Formula 1 cars had all out slicks without the grooves and no restrictions imagine how fast it would go. It would be undrivable. A slightly "updated" F40 (brakes, turbos, tires) would run circles around a CS. Not taking anything away from the CS, that's just the way it is. I would even put money on a slightly updated GTO over the CS.
     
  15. F1racer

    F1racer F1 Rookie

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    When I said the 360 CS is maybe faster than the F40 I was tinking of the laptime of the 360 CS at Fiorano , which is 1 sec faster than the F40.
     
  16. allanlambo

    allanlambo F1 Rookie

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    If f40 is rated at 478hp, which is underrated.
     
  17. F40

    F40 F1 Rookie

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    "What this car is, is a 3.0L V8 engine, 2 turbo chargers the size of barn doors, a petrol tank, 2 seats, and that's it." -Jeremy Clarkson.
     
  18. Aircon

    Aircon Seven Time F1 World Champ

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    Does anybody here actually KNOW anything? DO they read all the posts before they post? Amazing!

    The F40 has 480hp and weighs 1230kg soaking wet. The torque figure is HUGE (can't remember it, sorry) and has a huge wing and 335 wide rear tyres. I can tell you without hesitation that if you put the CS and an F40 on a track with the same tyres that the F40 would eat it....yep, even 15 years later! That's how far above anything else the F40 was when it came out.
     
  19. amenasce

    amenasce Two Time F1 World Champ
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    I really dunno about that ! I would love it to be true but in september i was at the Ferrari days in Magny Cours , and there were quite afew F40 among which a slithgly tuned one with around 520 hp and 6 Stradales , and the Stradales were eating the F40.
    Dunno if the F40's guys were taking it easy which i dont think so, judging by their cars not so fresh look or if the Stradale is much easier ...
     
  20. Aircon

    Aircon Seven Time F1 World Champ

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    Yes, well, we have a guy in AUS with an F40LM. I beat him at every track day by many seconds a lap in my 355CH. According to you, then, my 380hp 1450kg car on DOT tyres and with no wing is therefore faster than a 750hp 1000kg full race spec F40LM. Excellent, that should do wonders for my resale!
     
  21. manu

    manu Formula Junior

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    If you look at a 1989 F40, it does not have the benefit of the latest modern tyres, brakes and aerodynamics...
    That's one of the reasons why the 360 CS may be quicker in certain scenarios.
    However mildy modify an F40 by bringing it up to date and the car is pretty much unbeatable *IN THE RIGHT HANDS*

    Bear in mind with ASR and ABS and Launch Control blah blah the average guy would probably be quicker in a CS than an F40... But get a top level drive in an updated F40 and he will walk away from a CS... no doubt about it.

    THAT is the reason why you 360 guys were lapping F40s wherever... The very nature of the F40 demands a quality driver just to stay with a stock 360 - to be quicker than a 360 you need someone with an even higher skill level.

    F40 is the greatest Ferrari they've ever built IMO.
     
  22. Aircon

    Aircon Seven Time F1 World Champ

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    Manu, I've driven a 360 Modena and 360CH and I've owned an F40, and I can assure you that, if the CS is ANYTHING like a Modena or CH, the F40 is a much easier car to drive fast than a 360. The 360s get very nervous during high speed cornering...and F40 does not!
     
  23. manu

    manu Formula Junior

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    Totally agree with you AIRCON about the nervous handling of the 360...... You're exactly right.
    But where your experience differs from mine is that I found I can drive an 360 WAY closer to the limit than an F40, even though the F40 gives more warning of impending breakaway..

    My point is (and where I may disagree with you) is that I think that most people coming out of 360s who have had no experience with the F40 would undoubtedly struggle with sudden potentially mid-corner boost, lack of ABS, no power assisted steering and no traction control.
     
  24. Mark(study)

    Mark(study) F1 Veteran
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    ___________________________________________________________
    Originally Posted by Mark(study)

    What's the HP on the F40? 400ph? Back in 1989?
    What difference does the turbo make? ____________________________________________________________


    ----------------------------------------------------------------------
    Aircon- "Does anybody here actually KNOW anything? DO they read all the posts before they post? Amazing!"
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------

    Aircon,
    I wanted to hear this debate because I never followed the F40 when it came out. Now I'm interested ( I couldn't read the post till I started the post and debate). So chill ... people have a right to ask questions.

    to ask my question again, and clarify.... Is the F40 using a 400hp engine and then the turbo brings it up to 478hp? Couldn't you add a tubo to the 360CS and beat the F40 and F50?

    What HP does the trubo add to the F40's engine?
     
  25. Garretto

    Garretto F1 Rookie

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    I say, get a standard F40 and a standard Challenge Stradale, fit the same street tires on both (same tire type, not same size, I mean) take them to Fiorano and fit the same experienced driver in both cars, one at a time.

    Any other comparison (updated F40, slick tires) is nonsense.

    Which one is fastest? I don't know which one laps Fiorano fastest but if the CS does (and I wouldn't be surprised) there's the point of this thread, 15 years later.

    It's 478 HP vs. 425 HP, steel brakes vs. carbon brakes, 15 years of F1 experience which includes suspension technology, aerodynamics, etc...

    I wouldn't be at all surprised if the CS beats the F40 in Fiorano.
     

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