Dear all, first of all I apologize for starting another thread on one of the most discussed subjects of the millennium. I just wanted to ask, now that the 348s are approaching their 30s, what are the experiences of their owners with regard to service. I am about to inspect with a pro and possibly buy a '91 348TB with an odd service story: the current owner got her in 2001 with 10.000 km without knowing about the belt replacement! So he drove it, quite gently I must say, until 2016 adding around 8-9.000 km and finally having his first major after 15 years! Now we are on the fifth year and he's suggesting to wait a bit longer, while I am even doubtful if to drive it home from his place, 200 km from me. So my questions are: - Is there anyone here who put more than 5 years between 348 major services? How many years? How was the car used? - Now that the 348 cars are 30 years old, can we finally find any owner to write about his engine failure because of waiting for too long between major services (and I say service because I quite understood that there are a number of parts that can fail)? Please, only owner-witnesses, and not somebody-I-know-witnesses. - Is it really worth to accept the official workshop suggestion saying to do the valve timing together with the service? Why should the valves loose their timing? I am very sorry to annoy you again on this subject, but I will appreciate any fresh feedback because I am at -6 days from the possible purchase.
I'm a believer in every 5 years or 15k miles. I drive my 73k mile'd '93 speciale about 3k miles a year. Valves? Why not look at them you are in there. Would you rather spend 5-7k on the major service or have a catastrophic engine failure and spend 25k? Insist on all records and if the history isn't there you'll need to invest. Also include the oil pickup chain and tensioner... figure another 3k for that.... Get a good rshp with your independent Ferrari mechanic and check things at pil changes. I DIY most stuff but major service i don't. Btw example... i caught what is now a confirmed water pump leak at ~12k miles... major was due next year. Good luck. Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
I would not wait until next year to address your 348 waterpump. It is acting as an idler pulley for the single timing belt driving both banks. If it freezes up, you are going to have 32 bent valves. Do it ... now.
Yelcab. .. I'm in no way waiting - sorry if my post implied that... it was more to the point that diligence and inspection is causing me to do my major now - a year early. Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
The esteem Ernie went for 9 years without a belt change and when he did it, he swore to never do it again. Other things broke, bad. I believe, preach, and practice 5 years cycles. Water pumps go to 10 years as well as tensioner bearings of the Hill Engineering types. The valves lose their timing because the belt stretch, or the last mechanic did a sloppy job at lock-swap, or the factory did a lousy job at cam timing. Until you have it done by someone you trust, or by yourself, you do not know where the engine is. You are buying this car. Why would you "buy" into anything less than recommended intervals (which was 3 years and now is 5 years). At least negotiate a service cost in with the price.
I do every 5 years regardless of mileage. I drive the crap out of my car and push it hard but I also maintain it to a very high degree. I have a work hard/play hard mentality, otherwise why do you own the car if your just gonna look at it.
The 348 is a definite max 5 year belt change car. Way to many failure points in that single belt set up. Even just the fact that a defelction shoe could come loose and cause a major issue.
Imo service records mean nothing. At best it means car was good at that point in time. I do not think latest and service factors into price at all because I see zero value in records or service. I have worked a good bit on these cars. In 348 world I was the 1st diy'er to rebuild the gearbox as an example. All I can say is with any used car going through the car sorting everything (and if that means major serivice in your mind go for it.) There is not definition of major service from Ferrari. Some call swapping belts "major.". IMO that's just the beginning. I know people stretching to get into their next Ferrari don't like to factor in another $10k but I think everyone really should as a minimum. For the DIY guy there is no better way to learn the new to them car than taking it apart and massaging it. My best times with a new used car are the hours spent learning by taking it apart. I get more joy there than a brand new car that is under warrantee and runs perfectly.
Agreed. My "major" last time had the lovely addition of the oil tensioner. To this day, based on your advice, every oil change i do involves a sample sent to Blackstone Labs for analysis. I do all my own work on the car learning about and fixing stuff... the timing belt and tensioners, etc (the "major") while I'm confident i could do... it's one service i choose not to. But you are right.. budget $10k. In my case, I'm also probably selling my car so the buyer will have a fresh major done so no haggling... Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
Ehi, thank you all for so many replies! It really looks that there is a wide consensus about the 5 year threshold now. All the best. Nic
Do you think that eventually the prices will go down in the future? I've been looking for my first Ferrari since 2011 and in ten years the 308/328/TR/348/F355 have more than doubled, now slightly falling. But I ask myself: - With all the new riches and billionnaires that are created everyday in the world - With the more and more cash that our governments (EU as well as the USA) are injecting in the markets, allowing for continuous speculation on anything (stocks, housing market, artworks, etc.) - And above all with the stick gearshift - aspirated engines - less power steering models being all discontinued by Ferrari FOREVER why should ever the prices fall drastically more than in the last couple of years? I think that they will eventually lower a bit more, but not too much, and that in any case in 2031 I'd be very very surprised to see prices much lower than these - if not double than these.
I do not Blackstone every oil change I do it more strategically For example when I started racing my Mustang GT I would do the Blackstone at every oil change for a while to try to get a baseline for what my oil change interval should be based on my usage. If I change something I'll test for a while to make sure I'm OK like using diesel oil in gas motors.
All the points you mentioned are good. However. With the governments pushing hard to reduce the amount of gas cars on the roads, and with the introduction of the electric car, I honestly think we may be the last generation who will even want one. Prices will continue to go up..but there will be a crash and it will be a big one.
I think there will be a crash ; then a boom in prices. Electric cars are a “middle class solution”. Synthetics will take off. We already have all the infrastructure needed; unlike electric. It just needs logic rather than media and political hype to find its place; which will come, but slightly belatedly like most logical solutions. Supply of petrol and diesel won’t disappear for some 15-20 years yet; by which time common sense will prevail with synthetics. Do you really think the heavy haulage, agriculture, construction industry vehicles will all be swapped for the “magic” of electric in those time scales? Off course not. Not to mention aviation. So….back to common sense then!
I am also slightly concerned by restrictions, and I can easily say how I would love to have already a BEV as my business car. Still, for fun, nothing can beat the gas, I think.
For you, maybe. I find them very dull in every way. The instant acceleration is a novelty which quickly becomes no big deal. And that's all they have going for them.
Going thought the gears is indeed fun. But it seems 100% of Ferrari buyers do not want such a chore.. which is why you cannot buy a manual Ferrari as i said. We are the last generation to really appreciate these old cars. The bottom is going to fall out.
I'm not so sure about that. I think there are quite a few of us left who like to actually drive their cars. Maybe not the majority, but still a meaningful number of buyers. Porsche is illustrative as there remains a strong demand for their manual gearbox cars.
I fully agree with it! Noise and vibrations, plus that fact that you can get a vintage model of the '70s while BEVs are only contemporary toys. I really don't know what will happen if one day Ferrari and Lamborghini will be forced to go 100% BEV.
I think that with the always growing number of riches and billionnaires in the world, two trends will be growing: - Hypercars, because they are meant to show off (in the mating market) - Classic and vintage cars used for speculation (confused with investment) or as collectibles or furniture, kept in a large living room instead of the garage. With the stronger and stronger restrictions to ICEs in the urban areas, the safety concerns, the prices of vintage making them scary to damage, I don't know how many will keep driving these cars on the streets. It would be very interesting to see a chart showing the cumulated mileage by model year over year, but I can easily imagine that it is approaching zero simply because I never see any around! I spent the last 3 months looking for an entry-level classic Ferrari to drive, and most of those I found were just sitting all the time at the dealers or in some elderly's garage. Just a couple were regularly used for few km per week. Of the 20-30 calls I made for a 208/308/348, I talked to a 40 something like me only once (but the owner was his dead!). But this is "poor" Italy, while I imagine that the rest of the world might be different, faster, richer - even if I still love here! All this said, I don't really care too much because I value fun more than money. If I look forward, I would much prefer for the market to collapse, even seeing mine to loose value but becoming able to buy more Ferraris of the past, than seeing it go up and become more and more scared to go out with mine if her value will become higher and higher. P.s. I say mine but I still have to buy it, btw. Have you all a nice day! Nic
Also look at what lotus are doing with the Emira, offering a manual variant. I don’t know how many are being ordered in manual variant but there were lots of deposits at Goodwood alone.
Similar thing with the Dallara Stradale, do you know it? I don't know what to think. Now that cars look like spaceships we are missing those of the Renaissance. But I don't know if remaking the renaissance now would make sense, like remaking the Middle Ages fine arts in 2021. I am very puzzled. But on one thing I am sure: nowadays not a single designer is styling cars for beauty, being aerodynamics and the 0-100 and efficiency everybody's goal. Lamborghinis have lots of character, but I don't think you can say they are beautiful, sexy. And for all my love for Ferrari, not a single one after the Testarossa was an iconic or timeless beauty - imho, just the 550 and 360 but very partially.
