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365 GT 2+2 hard start

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by jww427, Apr 8, 2019.

  1. jww427

    jww427 Karting
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    Oct 31, 2016
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    john w. warner IV
    Hello all!
    Happy spring!

    My 1968 365 has 50K miles and the rings are fairly bad.
    That said, once going it runs nice.

    After sitting for 2 weeks or so, it takes a lot of cranking to start.
    I run the fuel pump for 60 seconds before I give it 2 pumps of fuel.
    Should I replace the spark plugs more often if she's burning oil?
    1 quart per 100 miles.

    I know, I know...I need a rebuild.
    But until that day I need advice.
    I drive her often and fast.
    Thanks
    KWW
     
  2. jww427

    jww427 Karting
    Silver Subscribed

    Oct 31, 2016
    146
    White Post Virginia
    Full Name:
    john w. warner IV
    Hello all!
    Happy spring!

    My 1968 365 has 50K miles and the rings are fairly bad.
    That said, once going it runs nice.

    After sitting for 2 weeks or so, it takes a lot of cranking to start.
    I run the fuel pump for 60 seconds before I give it 2 pumps of fuel.
    Should I replace the spark plugs more often if she's burning oil?
    1 quart per 100 miles.

    I know, I know...I need a rebuild.
    But until that day I need advice.
    I drive her often.
    Thanks
    KWW
     
  3. 12659

    12659 Formula Junior

    Oct 6, 2005
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    Seattle WA. USA
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    mark
    Hi John:

    Yes, you should probably change the plugs, and perhaps thicker oil. But if it is the rings you might be dealing with low compression too.
     
  4. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran
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    Apr 6, 2008
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    romano schwabel
    1 qt on 100 miles? that is too much
    as mark mentioned, try thicker oil and may be use "wynns for oil", if still available? it is like honey and the oil consumption will get reduced when it is a problem of the rings.
    when you need so much oil then the engine will smoke blue. you see this? or may be you have somewhere a leak?
    check the compression. I think it will come from the valve seals.

    but why you created for this 1 problem just 2 new threads and not only 1?

    so to the mods: please delete the other thread before more will answer at the other
     
  5. TTR

    TTR Formula 3
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    Timo
    Romano, did you clicked on the "Report" button of the 2nd thread and requested its delete ?
     
  6. donv

    donv F1 World Champ
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    Jan 5, 2002
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    Mine takes more than two pumps of the throttle, even if I drove it the day before. Of course, my car had the choke removed, so maybe that's an issue.
     
  7. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran
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    no, not, but I will do now
     
  8. TTR

    TTR Formula 3
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    :)

    While I think mods may not have much time for life outside this huge 24hr daycare center called FChat, I doubt they’re able to read every thread or post, but “Reporting” seem to make them aware of any associated issue or problem and allows them to do deal with it accordingly.
     
  9. BMWairhead

    BMWairhead Formula Junior

    Sep 11, 2009
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    Ted
    I had an old BMW motorcycle that was worn out and took forever to cold start (be thankful you have a starter...mine was kick-start only)...

    There is no *good* answer to your problem...other than the one you already know you need. The longer you put off the inevitable, the more damage and wear will happen in the meantime.
     
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  10. 12659

    12659 Formula Junior

    Oct 6, 2005
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    mark
    My start sequence is similar to Don's Let the starter motor turn over a few spins: fire in the hole, then a couple of taps on the accelerator pump jets.
    Voila instant hydrocarbon....
     
  11. TTR

    TTR Formula 3
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    I agree with Ted “BMWairhead”.
    With all that and at 50K miles, even though it may seem OK once running, there's a likely chance your engine has other underlying issues, which if left unattended too much longer might develop into major problems in a hurry and end up extending the cost of rebuilding beyond that of basic (but thorough) overhaul.
     
  12. afwrench

    afwrench Formula Junior

    Nov 24, 2004
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    Mike
    Don't discount your battery in the mix.With a less efficient motor the starter may draw enough current to starve the spark at the plugs a bit.Those old heavy units draw some juice.Make sure the ignition system is working to the max and I think 3or4 pumps on the go pedal rather than just 2 might help. Mike
     
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  13. SCantera

    SCantera Formula 3
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    Aug 4, 2004
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    If I am not mistaken the GT has an electric fuel pump. Only a few seconds should pressurize the fuel lines. My GTC had a full engine rebuild...top and bottom. Carbs were re-worked by Pierce. The 330 type 209 has a mechanical fuel pump with an electric back up pump. Even though everything is "right" with my GTC two pumps of the pedal to prime the system is not enough. I generally hit the pedal 5-6 times to get a fire in the hole when I turn the key. By doing so it doesn't take much cranking. Sure it might take a couple of tries to get 8-10 cylinders running to insure start-up. But the system need heavy priming. Of course every car is different including every set of carbs.

    Now my BB512 is even more fun to start.....lol!!
     
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  14. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran
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    after wintertime I have to pump at my BB minimum 6-8 times, but never use the chockes
     
  15. donv

    donv F1 World Champ
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    The 365GT has a mechanical pump with an electric backup. Normal starting procedure is to turn the electric pump on, listen as it pressurizes the lines (the tick-tick-tick becomes tick.... tick........ tick), pump the throttle a few times, and start cranking. If I've driven my car in the last day or two, it generally starts on the first crank. If ti's been a few weeks, then it does take some cranking.
     
  16. John Vardanian

    John Vardanian F1 Rookie

    Jul 1, 2004
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    Worn rings typically mean grimy plugs. My advice, give it an Italian tune-up. Just before you bring it home, drive it a bit at high rev to get the plugs hot to burn off the soot. This should hopefully have the plugs in a better shape for the next start-up.

    john
     
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  17. BMWairhead

    BMWairhead Formula Junior

    Sep 11, 2009
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    Ted
    The original poster is going through a quart of oil every hundred miles. The starting technique might be a bit off, but the engine NEEDS a rebuild.
     
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  18. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran
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    before rebuilt check the compression, then the bank account and then decide ;)
     
  19. TTR

    TTR Formula 3
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    Exactly !
    Changing plugs, oil or starting techniques is not going to make it burn any less oil which could very well be just one of its many(?) problems.
    Besides, with 50K miles already (and assuming since engine was last time internally attended to) its basic overhaul is likely past due anyway.
     
  20. SCantera

    SCantera Formula 3
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    Aug 4, 2004
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    Question for the OP......can I assume you see a fair amount of blue smoke billowing from the tailpipes? Whether worn rings or valve guides the oil must be burning enough to be visible. Another question.......how much oil is dropped on your garage floor after a drive where the engine gets hot. The GT is a hot running engine. And there are plenty of seals that if old will leak a fair amount of oil. I agree with the concept of using heavy oil. Straight 50w dinosaur oil is a possible.

    In my years of owning vintage Ferraris the valve guides were often more of a problem than worn rings. Of course if the engine has a lot of years and miles there is a good chance it's both.

    I like the concept of using the Italian tune up before parking. That will reduce the oil build up when you restart. Even well-tuned but over-carburated Ferraris spit and bang if they are subjected to low rev-low speed driving. My BB is a perfect example. It cries for the Italian tune-up!
     

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