430 vs. mini-van

Discussion in '360/430' started by JV's89, Jul 4, 2009.

  1. JV's89

    JV's89 F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Jul 18, 2006
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Full Name:
    While browsing thru the 300+ F-cars on ebay a question came to mind. Will the performance of cars like 360's and 430's (or any other "high performance" car for that matter) be eclipsed by the sports cars (not to mention mini vans) of the future, or will gains in performance level off ? I wonder if there will be discussions here twenty years from now to the effect that someone with a "classic" 430 was dusted by a mini-van full of kids ; a frequent claim of some 3x8 owners :).
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    WILLIAM H Three Time F1 World Champ

    Nov 1, 2003
    Victory Circle
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    Right now we are back in the 70s when HP died and the govt and insurance companies killed performance

    Maybe in 20 years if minivans are made w carbon fiber tubs they could handle great but you dont want huge acceleration when moving the kiddies around
  4. Bullfighter

    Bullfighter Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jan 26, 2005
    Fullerton, California
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    #3 Bullfighter, Jul 4, 2009
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2009
    A proper fuel cell/electric car will have torque that will make our current cars quaint. We may end up with performance stats pre-set/limited by the electronics of the vehicle -- i.e., every car may be capable of 0-60 in 3 seconds, but that would be governed by internal circuitry.

    I don't think you'll see a billion new IC-engine cars on the road in China -- something has to change.

    WILLIAM H Three Time F1 World Champ

    Nov 1, 2003
    Victory Circle
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    BMW had a great idea.

    Take the IC engines we have now and make them run on hydrogen

    They have a fully functional prototype now

    That would be an easier fix since it doesnt require swapping every IC engine in the world
  6. hardtop

    hardtop F1 World Champ

    Jan 31, 2002
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    For those of us old enough to remember there are a lot of similarities with the early 70's. Today's cars are, by far, the best ever made in every way but I think politics is about to kill them off just like 40 years ago. We are about to face another automotive dark ages like 1975-95.

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  8. The Ape

    The Ape Formula 3

    Feb 28, 2007
    Los Angeles
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    Sadly I agree!
  9. FandLcars

    FandLcars F1 Rookie

    Aug 6, 2006
    Tempe, Az
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    Rick Schumm
    #7 FandLcars, Jul 4, 2009
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2009

    Arizona Public Service here in Phoenix has a hydrogen fueling station (basically a fuel cell in reverse to take electric power and convert water into hydrogen and oxygen). The station allows CNG (compressed natural gas) to be mixed with the hydrogen in various mixtures to test in IC Natural Gas vehicles. Typically the several IC vehicles they have and test run OK on 50% or less of hydrogen, but I don't believe they work well on over 50% hydrogen. The exception is the Mercedes vehicle that is designed for 100% hydrogen.

    Here's a link to their website with fact sheets on these vehicles, and their program. Most of this info is around 5yrs old, though. Bottom line: Current IC vehicles that have been converted to run on CNG can probably be set up to run on up to 50% hydrogen, but it's probably much more difficult and expensive to get IC engines to run 100% H2.

    Edit: Using electricity to recharge batteries in an electric vehicle or plugin hybrid (Chevy Volt), is a LOT more energy efficient that using the electricity to generate hydrogen and burning it in an IC engine. ;)

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