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612 Scaglietti steering rack rebuild

Discussion in '612/599' started by Soto Veloce, May 17, 2019.

  1. Soto Veloce

    Soto Veloce Karting

    Aug 7, 2005
    81
    Spokane, WA
    Full Name:
    Chris Heller
    https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/forums/northwest.30/

    I’m posting the link to a thread on the Northwest Region forum because I want this to be easily found if anyone has similar trouble in the future.

    I recently found out during spring inspection that I have power steering fluid leaking from the steering rack and power steering fluid pump on my 2007 612 Scaglietti.

    As you will see in the linked thread, I was given a repair estimate of $15,000, and that was just to replace the rack, as the pump was not initially recognized to be failing as well. Total job could be nearly $20K.

    I have found a potential solution to the problem for considerably less, though it has not yet been fixed, so I still don’t know for certain how this will end.

    As always, any additional advice is appreciated.

    -Chris
     
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  2. Soto Veloce

    Soto Veloce Karting

    Aug 7, 2005
    81
    Spokane, WA
    Full Name:
    Chris Heller
    I got the cost estimate for the steering rack rebuild from ADCO: $3200 + shipping.

    With the $4260 I’ve been quoted to get the rack out of the car and back in and to replace the power steering pump, it looks like I am looking at roughly $8000.

    Not cheap, but better than the original estimate to replace rather than rebuild.
     
  3. brogenville

    brogenville Karting

    Apr 24, 2012
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    Robin
  4. Soto Veloce

    Soto Veloce Karting

    Aug 7, 2005
    81
    Spokane, WA
    Full Name:
    Chris Heller
    Alright. The steering rack rebuild with new power steering fluid pump is finally finished. It took 24 days from the time I dropped it off at the shop to accomplish the following:

    1) remove the rack and steering fluid pump

    2) pack up the rack and ship it from Spokane to Houston

    3) rack rebuilt by ADCO in Houston (thanks Taz for the recommendation. They were completely unphased at the prospect of rebuilding a Ferrari steering rack and had the job done in less than 3 days.)

    4) ship rack from Houston to Spokane

    5) reinstall rack with new pump

    6) perform alignment


    I can’t speak highly enough of Hank Moore and his team at Advanced Auto Fabrication in Spokane Valley, WA. They diagnosed the problem, provided an accurate estimate, sourced all appropriate parts, coordinated shipping the rack to and from Houston, and got everything back together better than ever in a timely fashion.

    Recalling my original post, I was initially quoted approximately $15,000 by the Alfa Romeo/Maserati dealership in Coeur d’Alene, Idaho for parts and labor to replace the leaking steering rack. They didn’t offer a rebuild as an option and didn’t recognize that the power steering fluid pump had failed as well. With the pump I would have been staring down the business end of $20,000

    I’ve attached by final invoice so that 612 owners facing the same problem in the future will have at least some idea of how this can be fixed. I’m sure there are other acceptable ways of addressing this problem and I may even find out from other F-Chatters that I paid too much. Keep in mind that any other solution would have required shipping my car to Portland or Seattle in addition to repair costs.

    -Chris


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  5. Nospinzone

    Nospinzone F1 Rookie

    Jul 1, 2013
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    Thanks for posting that info here!
     
  6. Alcav5

    Alcav5 Formula 3
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    Jul 28, 2012
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    Awesome information. imo you did very good.

    Thanks,
    From another 612 owner.
     
  7. montegoblue

    montegoblue Formula Junior

    Aug 7, 2009
    338
    Chattanooga, TN
    Excellent info -- thank you. Begs the question for those technically capable :) to start a "catch all" folder for "cheap" fixes / alternate part numbers etc for common problems afflicting our beautiful but aging cars. This fix alone saved you $10k flat just because the dealer wanted to go the easy way out and didn't consider any more cost sensitive options.
     
  8. Soto Veloce

    Soto Veloce Karting

    Aug 7, 2005
    81
    Spokane, WA
    Full Name:
    Chris Heller
    In fairness to all of the authorized Ferrari dealership service centers out there, my experience was with a Maserati and Alfa Romeo dealership. They have done some simple things for me in the past like an oil change and repair of a faulty oil pressure sensor, but on something like this they were a little over their skis.

    While they correctly identified the leaking rack during spring inspection, they missed the leaking pump and, as previously stated, had only one suggestion: replace.

    Fortunately, I was able to find another option by reading posts and advice on this forum!
     
  9. donv

    donv F1 World Champ
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    Jan 5, 2002
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    Thank you for posting this! I'm glad everything worked out.
     
  10. Soto Veloce

    Soto Veloce Karting

    Aug 7, 2005
    81
    Spokane, WA
    Full Name:
    Chris Heller
    Good idea. Not to hijack my own thread, but...

    In the process of disassembling my head rest pillars to have the sticky bits refinished over the winter I ended up needing to replace the passenger seatbelt retractor mechanism (don’t ask).

    Most parts websites said it was unobtainable, while others suggested it could be had, but it would cost upward of $1200.

    As I was taking the seat apart, however, I discovered a couple of BMW logos and, upon further research, discovered that the 612 Scaglietti has the exact same front seats as the mid-2000s BMW 6-Series convertible. They are both sourced from an American seat company called Lear.

    I was ultimately able to buy the exact same seatbelt assembly from a 650i Convertible for $80 on eBay and then just fed my Couio colored seatbelts into the retractor mechanism.

    I agree with montegoblue. There are all kinds of life hacks out there for various Ferrari parts and repair issues. It would be nice to consolidate them into one searchable database.

    Not it!

    Chris
     
  11. Cribbj

    Cribbj Formula 3
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    Jan 1, 2011
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    Wow Chris, I'm shocked at ADCO's price for that! I was probably the first to use & recommend them as I'm local to them and had them rebuild my 550's rack. Mine was puking fluid from the right side seal, so they had to build up the inner rod, then polish both sides, fit new seals, and replaced the outer rods, and IIRC, it was well under $500. In fact, I seem to remember they rebuilt my pump too and the whole job was less than $500......
     
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  12. Soto Veloce

    Soto Veloce Karting

    Aug 7, 2005
    81
    Spokane, WA
    Full Name:
    Chris Heller
    I have to admit that I was not expecting their portion of the job to be so expensive, but I really had no basis for comparison. Everything related to Ferrari service always seems to be more expensive than you would expect it to be. How long ago did they do the work on your 550?

    Even if I paid too much, I hope that putting this sort of information on F-Chat will help other owners know what is reasonable and customary for this sort of thing.
     
  13. Cribbj

    Cribbj Formula 3
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    Jan 1, 2011
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    Chris, I checked my maintenance records and found they did my rack & pump back in November of 2013. They charged $425 to rebuild the rack and $150 to rebuild the pump, and another $75 to test both of them together, under load.

    Again, I was probably the first to use & recommend them, so I'm thinking they charged a "normal" rate for my job, then as more FChat folks have sent their racks/pumps to them, it's become inflated with the usual "Ferrari Tax" that we all suffer. Since it's a ZF system, similar to those found on German cars, maybe we shouldn't disclose to them that the parts came off a Ferrari......
     
  14. Soto Veloce

    Soto Veloce Karting

    Aug 7, 2005
    81
    Spokane, WA
    Full Name:
    Chris Heller
    A list of OEM Ferrari parts that are also found in more common vehicles (e.g. the above mentioned ZF steering rack and my front seats) would certainly be an important part of the sort of database that montegoblue suggested earlier in this thread.

    ADCO did specifically ask me what kind of car the rack was from. If I were to make something up to avoid the Ferrari Tax, it would be nice to be able to give them a believable answer. I just wonder if there might be anything unique in the way that Ferrari uses the rack versus another manufacturer, and whether that would have any implications for the rebuild process. Probably not, but it wouldn’t be the first time that Ferrari had an unorthodox approach to an otherwise common engineering solution.
     
  15. donv

    donv F1 World Champ
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    Jan 5, 2002
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    Don
    Just pay the price, be glad it's done right, and that it's much cheaper than buying a new rack from Ferrari. Don't cheap out on this sort of stuff.
     
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  16. tazandjan

    tazandjan Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Lifetime Rossa

    Jul 19, 2008
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    Terry H Phillips
    I had no idea the price had risen so much when I recommended them based on John's experience. At least the job was done correctly.
     
  17. Soto Veloce

    Soto Veloce Karting

    Aug 7, 2005
    81
    Spokane, WA
    Full Name:
    Chris Heller
    I certainly don’t want to come across as belly aching about the cost of repairs. In fact, up until John’s post about the same job costing $500 instead of $3800, I was feeling like I’d really dodged a bullet.

    Ultimately though, I would echo DonV’s sentiment that you’re better off getting it done right regardless of the cost.

    That is an undeniably steep price increase over the last 5-6 years, though!
     
  18. Cribbj

    Cribbj Formula 3
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    Jan 1, 2011
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    Chris, someone in your 612/599 community should consider starting a new thread for Cross Referenced & Interchangeable OEM Parts as we've done for the 456/550/575 cars, and others have done for earlier generations. These threads have become a valuable resource when "genuine" Ferrari parts are NLA or are commanding eye watering prices.

    IMO, it's ridiculous to pay 5x or 10x the OEM price for the same part just because it comes in a yellow box with the horsey on it. Plus, as the cars age, and more parts become NLA from Ferrari, by necessity we then have to source them from the OEM or another car manufacturer who provides longer term parts support than Ferrari.
     
  19. TrojanFan

    TrojanFan F1 Rookie
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    Nov 17, 2008
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    Great Idea. We also have this on the 355 and 328 threads. Can save a lot of $$$. Good tip on the seat belts a few posts above.
     
  20. Soto Veloce

    Soto Veloce Karting

    Aug 7, 2005
    81
    Spokane, WA
    Full Name:
    Chris Heller
    What is the format in the other model forums? Is there some kind of list organized by model, or is it simply a collection of posts that people can browse through or use the search function?
     
  21. tazandjan

    tazandjan Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Jul 19, 2008
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    Look in the 456/550/575 forum for one example
     
  22. Cribbj

    Cribbj Formula 3
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    Jan 1, 2011
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    For the 456/550/575 thread we try to minimize/discourage Q&A type chatter, and limit the posts to include a description of the part, the Ferrari part number, and the equivalent OEM or other car manufacturer part number. If photos are available of the Ferrari part and the equivalent replacement those are welcome also. This "format" makes it easy to use the FChat Search function for the Ferrari P/N's and/or Descriptions if the P/N is unknown.

    I suspect there are more than a few common parts shared between our generation of cars (456/550/575) and yours, so it might be a good project for someone in this section to take a look at our thread and compile a list of the parts we've already researched, then compare the Ferrari P/N's to the equivalent parts for your 599/612 cars to see if they're the same. That way your community can benefit from the hands on research we've already done.
     
  23. MRY

    MRY Karting

    May 14, 2015
    209
    Monterey Peninsula
    I’m curious why the rack is so expensive to rebuild in the first place.

    A ZF rack on several cars can be rebuilt for quite a bit less.

    Are the seals in the rack made from unobtanium rubber?

    Or dies it need special bits?

    Just curious...


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  24. Cribbj

    Cribbj Formula 3
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    It's really not - the extra charge is what we refer to as the "Ferrari" tax, and it's the additional amount that vendors charge us because they can. They believe if we're willing to pay the exorbitant price that Ferrari demands for the car then we're also willing and able to pay the exorbitant prices for parts and labor after the sale.

    Exactly......

    Most Bosch/ZF "systems" on our cars are the same or very similar as those found on high end German cars, and use the same or similar parts. It's only because our parts come in yellow boxes with the black horsey on the outside, that some feel justified in paying 2x or 5x what the same part costs for other cars. Once the part comes out of the yellow box however, it's indistinguishable from the same part that gets installed on a Mercedes/BMW/Porsche, etc.

    It would be interesting to know what percentage of our cars are actually Ferrari or Italian, and what percentage is German (Bosch/ZF, etc.) I know a very high percentage is probably actually Chinese masquerading as German, but that's another story altogether..... My guess would be the only parts in the car that are actually Ferrari would be the engine, body & frame, and probably the fuse/relay boards that are so prone to failure :)
     
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  25. MRY

    MRY Karting

    May 14, 2015
    209
    Monterey Peninsula
    This is my suspicion as well. As it relates to the steering rack, I’m curious what is actually getting rebuilt. If they’re just changing out the rubber seals, cleaning the whole thing in an ultrasonic tank and re-assembling the rack, then it should not cost several thousand dollars when a ZF rack is less than that by miles.

    It would be interesting to get a parts list of the seals and consumables and obtain the specifications of the parts.

    For example, if there are O-Rings, then what size diameter and thickness and material. I’m sure Mc Master or Grainger or some supply house even Omega would have them in stock.

    Or maybe find a technician who knows how to rebuild a rack, or get the parts list and diagram from someone and make a list?

    Granted this is just a thought, in other forums there are some people who just love chasing down these details and posting them up.! I wish I had the time to get these details and post them here.


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