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$9/mile

Discussion in 'Ferrari Discussion (not model specific)' started by sjb509, May 30, 2004.

  1. sjb509

    sjb509 Guest

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=6212&item=2480051637&rd=1

    Sometimes I have to shock myself back to reality concerning the true cost of driving a car like a Ferrari. Granted, anyone who can afford to buy a 456 new may not be concerned about such trivial things as dollars per mile. This was just an example, however, of just how expensive these cars can be to drive (or not drive).

    Tires = $1200
    Oil changes: 9 x $200 = $1800
    Fuel: 1400 gallons @ $2/gal = $2800
    Depreciation = $139100 ($209k to 69.9k)

    Total $144900
    Mileage: 15924
    Cost per mile: 144900/15924 = $9.10/mile (w/o taking into account the Tubi or any servicing)

    Think about that for a minute. Trip to the movies, $91. To the corner for milk, $18. Weekend trip to B&B, $2700. Cruise with friends, $910.

    Why would anyone, ANYONE, buy a brand-new Ferrari? Most that purchase Ferraris are hard working, successful people. To succeed in business you ned to understand the value of your money, why would anyone willingly take a $140k hit on depreciation?
     
  2. Bryan

    Bryan Formula 3

    I don't disagree that buying a new car (ANY new car) is a decision, primarily based on other factors besides economics, but I also think that care is needed in selecting data.

    The biggest factor that impacts the cost per distance is the depreciation (96% of total depreciation in this case) and what impacts that is the expected SELLING price of the car.

    FML Average Asking price on a 456 is $99kUS. I doubt the owner of the car on E-Bay will sell it for $69kUS. Using the FML AAP in the calculation results in a cost per distance of $7US / mile. Still very high, so your overall point is still valid.

    But if the driver had driven the car 30k instead of 15k, then the cost per mile drops in half. Now you are getting down to levels that might not "hurt" many people.

    The point is that cost per distance is SUBSTANTIALLY controlled by miles driven and the price at which the owner sells the car.
     
  3. 96cobrakid

    96cobrakid Formula Junior

    May 24, 2004
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    still a cool breakdown to read. just goes to show you have to drive it:) i think it was a porsche ad that I saw it read "at a dollar a mile, its free after 70,000 miles"
     
  4. Tomf-1

    Tomf-1 F1 Rookie
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    LOL....that's pretty good, Chris.
    I have to remember this one.
     
  5. henryk

    henryk Formula Junior

    Dec 9, 2003
    479
    Door County, WI
    I too, am surprised on how much people are paying for new cars.........just to be the first on the block!......and then to loose SOOOOOOO much on resale, with few miles. It seems, that as the prices of new cars keep going up, the depreciation is just that much more, for the buyer of a new car.

    My Ferraris are bought used (greater than 10 years old), and I maintain them myself.........my hobby.......I have had 8. If it wasn't a hobby, I really doubt that I would own a Ferrari. The closest dealer is 250 miles away!

    I just bought a MINT 1997 MB SL320 convetible (with hard top) with 34K miles on it, as my daily driver.........paid $26K, while the original owner paid $81K!!!!!!!!!!

    The nice thing, where I live, is that I can buy a 10-20 year old Ferrari, and STILL be the first on the block!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Of course, I still loose money, but NOTHING like $7-9/ mile!!!!!...........I think it is closer to being well under $1/mile.
     
  6. Gary(SF)

    Gary(SF) F1 Rookie

    Oct 13, 2003
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    Well, to highlight the obvious, not all new Ferraris depreciate like the 456. I think those who bought their 360s new have not too much to complain about in the resale value.

    Gary
     
  7. JBsZ06

    JBsZ06 Formula Junior

    Dec 6, 2003
    758
    The cost of ownership as far as involving depreciation is valid yet look at the pleasure you get from ownership.

    Sounds like a solid and fair exchange.

    Not bad to own a second hand one though especially if you do the labor yourself.

    Congrats on that for sure.

    Very cool.
     
  8. henryk

    henryk Formula Junior

    Dec 9, 2003
    479
    Door County, WI
    Qoute by JB: "The cost of ownership as far as involving depreciation is valid yet look at the pleasure you get from ownership.

    Sounds like a solid and fair exchange."

    Generally, I would agree with JB. The problem is that, while new car costs keep rising, so does the depreciation for the new owner. To loose over $100K, to drive a car 10K miles, is NOT valid, in my mind.......as in the 456's and the 550's.

    The 360 is an exception, only due to the demand. But, the prices of these are steadily dropping. This will also happen to the Ford GT, and the Bentley GT, in time. I will enjoy my Ferraris, for the next few years, and then buy one, or two, of the above.

    As JB points out, the secret is being able to work on the cars oneself!!!!!!!!!
     
  9. 96cobrakid

    96cobrakid Formula Junior

    May 24, 2004
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    they are so expensive, but ho wmany of you are thinking of that when that italian v8 or v12 is screaming behind your head? ;)
     
  10. sjb509

    sjb509 Guest

    At 80 mph, a mile takes 45 seconds. Imagine every ten seconds on the interstate you throw two bucks out of the window.

    BTW, $69.9k was the buy it now price, not the bid price on Ebay.

    As for the 360, we need to wait until 2014 to see what a 10 year old '04 360 Spyder sells for. While they may be holding their own today at around $200k, what are they going to be like ten years from now?

    Ferrari will have replaced the replacement for the 360. There is a good chance it will be lower maintenance than the 360. Based on the competition coming up in the next few years, low maintenance and high horsepower will rule the day. Add that most will have an F1 transmission which may or may not be desirable. The 456 has its leaky windows, the 360 may have its F1 tranny. Working on a 360 at home may not be a viable option as with a 328 or 308 today. Think of the BMW850 and their resale.

    Don't get me wrong, they are awesome cars, but just wanted to add some perspective.
     
  11. mbarr

    mbarr Karting

    Jan 11, 2004
    220
    That depreciation has probably been shared by more than one owner, maybe 20 - 30 k per owner. I also would assume that the majority of people that buy these cars could care less about the hit.
     
  12. steve f

    steve f F1 World Champ

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    how much will the wife cost after 30years clothes. holidays. make up. silicon.
    and if you try get ride of her early it costs you a mint you look forward to getting home and looking at the ferrari not the wife and you dont mind taking the ferrari out and when other women look and you can smile back do that with the wife and you are in the **** so stop moaning and use the car **** the cost of running it
     
  13. Gary(SF)

    Gary(SF) F1 Rookie

    Oct 13, 2003
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    Sure, no argument. But I seriously doubt it is going to depreciate to the tune of $9/mile or anything like that.

    Gary
     
  14. mighty

    mighty Karting

    Nov 2, 2003
    231
    The majority of the people are dumb
     
  15. 6.0 se

    6.0 se F1 Rookie
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    Hey,I resemble that remark!!!
     
  16. 6.0 se

    6.0 se F1 Rookie
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    This post got me to thinking about the point here.So I started doing some figuring on some cars I have owned.I bought a 94 viper new in 94,and sold it recently.It had 109,000k miles when I sold it.


    Tires 5x 1200=6000
    oil changes 30x30=900
    fuel 14400
    depreciation 29,000
    Bought it for 54,000,sold it for 25,000

    total expenses 50,300

    That equals 46 cents per mile.


    HEY,I DID GOOD!!!!!!

    Im sure my Lambo's or F cars wont fare as well.Maybe I should drive the hell out of them too!!
     
  17. TestShoot

    TestShoot F1 World Champ
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    These are not the only cars we own you fool. I have a Ducati a p1800 and up until a week ago, a Dodge Ram.

    The Ferrari may cost $9/mile by your calculations, but you are not taking into account what the median income of a Ferrari owner is. I am in the low 6 digits, and burning your cost of ownership does not bother me. Some people make concessions, others do need to. I burned $25k in restoring a $5k Volvo. Is that insane or love?

    Maybe you should think about this. I have a bike, called the Bursford Ultimate "Lola" one of 8 made at a cost of $75k new. I got it used with 300 miles on it for $36k. Now I have ridden it just about 500 miles. My cost of ownership, on a USED BIKE, is $72 per mile. I have a custom made fram from a guy in Arizona, it is very ornate, the cost to build the frame was $7500, with all the gear it is worth $12k. I have ridden it 100 miles, and will probably never ride it again. Because it was made for me, nobody else will fit it.
     
  18. UroTrash

    UroTrash Three Time F1 World Champ
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    $9 per mile!?! A screaming deal at 10 times that price, thusly...

    Let's compare to some other pleasurable experience...say... your standard second date orgasm.

    Now, we will ignore the cost of the first date which was considerable and certainly contributed to the likelihood of success on the second date.

    Nonetheless, only considering the second date the cost is considerable:

    Dinner at a nice restuarant, including parking and tips: $145

    A movie or similar time filler: $35

    Wear on car, laundry, insurance, etc., etc. :$30

    Total: $210.

    Now, let us suppose that you were lucky enough to get a home run on the second date (unlikely for anyone who has enough time to waste to read this post), it would result in a 15 second orgasm (yeah, yeah, I know your are a real stud muffin, so lets say 20 second orgasm).

    Now, thats $210/20 seconds or around $10 per second....


    You'd have to drive over 500 miles per hour for the Ferrari to cost that much!!!!!

    So, like I said, a SCREAMING deal at 10 times the price.
     
  19. 6.0 se

    6.0 se F1 Rookie
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    Lighten up Timothy.And I could give a rats azz how much money you make.Did you really need to tell us that?The guy just made a post,he didnt insult your family.He was asking a question.
     
  20. TestShoot

    TestShoot F1 World Champ
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    I was saying I was over extended myself financially to get my car, probably the poorest owner (sic former owner) here. Coulda bought a new or used car, I chose new. I would be a fool to be offended by words on an opinion topic. I respect the poster, not the question.

    Regardless of the hit one takes on selling/buying the car, sometimes people spoil themselves. Sometimes it is worth all the nuts you store up for winter and live in a shack if the car in this case makes you happy. Sometimes the only way to satisfy that is to know you are not getting a hand-me-down.

    "The cynic knows the price of everything and the value of nothing." Oscar Wilde

    On that thought, what is the value of driving a new car, any make or model?

    "Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." -Einstein

    Does anybody but you know you are driving a new car? No
    Does it matter? No
    Does it effect your self image? Most definately
     
  21. UroTrash

    UroTrash Three Time F1 World Champ
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    I would respectfully disagree. I drive old cars and ride old motorcycles. I, oddly, get a lot of pleasure from driving inexpensive cars. It most definitely does not affect my self-image.

    I, respectfully, would say that if ones self-esteem is affected by an object that can be owned (or leased!), it can be affected adversely by the loss of that object, and might be a sign of a somewhat fragile ego.

    I think that self image should instead be a reflection of a person's treatment of others.
     
  22. 6.0 se

    6.0 se F1 Rookie
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    Excellent analysis.I too love driving old beaters.Well,maybe like is a better word.

    PS. Love the mathematical equation on your profile.Most excellent!!I copied it,hope you dont mind.
     
  23. 6.0 se

    6.0 se F1 Rookie
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    I follow better now.Its all good.
     
  24. TestShoot

    TestShoot F1 World Champ
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    I was applying to Ferraris, late models, not cars in general. I love old classics too, this is not that thread. Ever think of the cost of a rebuild or service and how it costs compared to the depreciation. Used cars are that much closer to scheduled maint than new ones? The thread is not on rationale, because used is the way to go if you look only on paper, not inside.

    Objectifying the car is not a bad thing. Yes if you take the loss to heart it is a problem personally. When I saw the hulk of my car unsder a tarp, I did not drink turpentine and cry. I simply said "This sucks" and went home.

    When/if my show hits the air, I will go out and buy another Fcar. By the time that check clears, my only option may be used, not on price but availaility of what I want.
     
  25. sjb509

    sjb509 Guest

    And you're calling me a fool?
     

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