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91 Testarossa turns over but won't start

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by Shamile, Mar 7, 2004.

  1. Shamile

    Shamile F1 Veteran

    Dec 31, 2002
    6,563
    Lakeland FL
    Full Name:
    Shamile
    Dear Ferraristi,

    I just bought a 91 Testarossa ( Yay, my dream car ) but....won't start. I have had it for two days. It ran fine the 200 miles from Fort Myers back to my house. The next day, it would crank but would not fire up. I used to have a 308 and got to know it quite well. This car is new to me so I reallllly need your help. I did get a gas smell but not even a hint of starting.
     
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  3. Diablo

    Diablo Formula Junior

    check the distributor caps and rotors. Maybe there will be an indication of something there..

    Good Luck
     
  4. ghost

    ghost F1 Veteran
    Lifetime Rossa

    Dec 10, 2003
    9,837
    Singapore
    Did you check the battery. Could something have been inadvertantly left on overnight that drained it (door light, headlight, etc.)?
     
  5. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson F1 World Champ
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    Jan 11, 2001
    19,283
    Texas
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    If you're sure that there's no ignition spark at all during starter cranking (and I'm not sure that you're sure about that ;)) -- the simple things to try are reseating the small round connector and 9-pin? square connector sort of under the coolant expansion tank on the LH side of the engine bay, reseating the C12 (large round) and C13 (small round) connectors on the triangular box under the RH rear fender in the engine bay, and reseating the connections at the coils.

    Are you multi-meter equipped?

    (US version? -- update your Profile!)
     
  6. richard_wallace

    richard_wallace Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 6, 2004
    1,950
    Cincinnati, Ohio
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    Richard Wallace
    I assume it is cranking but not turning over...

    1.) Do you smell any gas... Could be that it is flooded.
    2.) Bad Gas - was it setting for a long time and you are about empty in the tank from your drive from Ft. Meyers... If you are low and it was sitting for a long period - could be the bad gas now working into the engine. (Had this happen on 2 F-cars). Ran absolutely fine for a few hundred - then wam - won't even turn over...
    3.) Plugs - Take out the spark plugs and see if they are good - could also be the problem..

    Just some easy looks...

    Rich
     
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  8. Boxer12

    Boxer12 Formula 3

    Jun 1, 2003
    1,672
    So, the car ran great, you turned it off one day and the next day it cranks but wouldn't start? PRob something very simple. Poss vopor lock from water in fuel (add some dry gas additive)...or poss flooding. Pull a plug to check if you are getting spark just to be sure, and if it is flooded. We need more info to diagnose anything more detailed than that. IMHO-Don't start pulling stuff until you check the basics. YOu might loosen something that isn't the problem and compound it. Things don't usu loosen up in the garage. Or parts go bad overnight. Jim
     
  9. colo348

    colo348 Karting

    Nov 1, 2003
    141
    Colorado
    Full Name:
    Jim
    Shamile,
    Have you tried to jump start it? It might be the battery, like some one suggested. I just went throught this. Jump starting is the easiest thing to try (watch the connections) then go to the next step(s) as suggested by the recent posts. Good luck.
    Jim
     
  10. REM9

    REM9 Karting

    Jun 17, 2001
    175
    Finger Lakes NY, USA
    Full Name:
    Russ Moore
    I had a similar episode. Steve Magnusson offered some splendid guidance. This is all documented and can be searched. I was able to resolve the issue without radical expense. If you still have a problem, I suggest you check those threads out. Gives diagnostics as well.
     
  11. vref

    vref Karting

    Dec 18, 2003
    214
    1 Hr North of Housto
    Full Name:
    Jim
    TR's are known for coil problems.
     
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  13. Shamile

    Shamile F1 Veteran

    Dec 31, 2002
    6,563
    Lakeland FL
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    Shamile
    Dear Ferraristi,

    I guess I wasn't very detailed. The TR is a 91 US version. It is a local Florida car. The previous owner drove it occasionally and it was serviced at Shelton Ferrari. It also has fresh gas, it was near 1 /4 so I filled it up and added some Techtron. ( might as well start things off right.) I got it home no problem. I drove to work and back and out to lunch no problem. The second day at the house it would not start. I will crank over fine and has lots of battery power. (Optima Red-Top ) It just seems strange that it won't fire up so suddenly like. ( The 308 never failed to start) :) I really don't have much experience with a multimeter but am willing to follow this sites' guidance.
     
  14. henryk

    henryk Formula Junior

    Dec 9, 2003
    479
    Door County, WI
    The first step is to find out if it is either a no-spark, or no-fuel issue.

    Remove a spark plug wire, and hold it near a ground..........if it sparks, while cranking the engine over, then the problem is fuel. You will have to use some wire (bare, ONLY on the ends.....NOT where you will be holding it), to shove into the sparkplug boot, since the metal is deep inside. You could also use a screw driver. The idea is to contact the metal in the sparkplug boot, and hold it next to a ground source. The other end of the wire is placed about 1/8 inch from any ground.......use an engine bolt.
     
  15. Shamile

    Shamile F1 Veteran

    Dec 31, 2002
    6,563
    Lakeland FL
    Full Name:
    Shamile
    Dear Ferraristi,

    Dear Hyndrk,

    Great Idea on doing that. I will try after work tomorrow and let ya'll know. : )

    I least I have a great piece of artwork to look at for now.

    Shamile
     
  16. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    19,283
    Texas
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    Shamile -- this thread describes those multi-meter tests that can be useful in troubleshooting a TR "starter cranks but no-start" condition:

    http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3937&highlight=tachyometric

    but Henry's right -- the first, first step is to confirm/deny spark directly at the plugs during stater cranking (I prefer just using a timing light).
     
  17. henryk

    henryk Formula Junior

    Dec 9, 2003
    479
    Door County, WI
    Hi Steve: Your idea of using a timing light is better..........but, since he doesn't know very much on how to use a VOM meter, I assumed he wouldn't have a timing light.
     
  18. wpdent

    wpdent Rookie

    Feb 13, 2004
    28
    Birmingham, AL
    Full Name:
    Patrick
    HEY! I had the exact smae problem with mine. I have an 85 US. I started a thread titled 85 TR Starting Problem. Steve Magnussen (username 91TR) and numerous others helped out. It could be several things such as coil problems etc. My problem was the tachyometric relay. It is located behind the front fuse panel. I replaced it with the Bosch part from Importech and it started on the first attempt.

    Good luck!!


    Patrick
     
  19. fletch62

    fletch62 Formula Junior

    Mar 8, 2004
    333
    Fairhope, AL
    Full Name:
    Larry Fletcher
    #16 fletch62, Mar 8, 2004
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I am in the business of rebuilding Fuel Distributors. Gas additives can destroy the o-rings and diaphgram in the fuel distributor. The worst thing to put in your tank is the stuff that makes water and gas mix. I have attached a picture of a fuel distributor sent in for warrenty that was on the car about 2 weeks. All the brown and white crystal looking stuff is caused by these additives, also the o-rings were swollen to about twice the normal size.

    Larry Fletcher
    CIS Flow Tech Llc
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  20. 308GTS

    308GTS Formula 3

    Dec 27, 2001
    2,220
    TN
    Great info. Even Techron is bad for the FD? I didn't know that. So no gas additives at all? Thanks for sharing.
     
  21. henryk

    henryk Formula Junior

    Dec 9, 2003
    479
    Door County, WI
    fletch: Can you list your website? I am looking for the O-rings, that go between the fuel distributors, and bases, on my TR CIS system. I am also interested in getting the fuel washers, used on the banjo fittings. Can't seem to get these in bulk, with a reasonable price. Can you help?

    Thanks.
     
  22. fletch62

    fletch62 Formula Junior

    Mar 8, 2004
    333
    Fairhope, AL
    Full Name:
    Larry Fletcher
    The o-rings are Buna-n aka Nitrile aka black o-rings from the hardware store. The size for the one that seals the FD to the air flow meter is 28mm x 1.5mm, metric o-rings may be hard to find so sae size is 1/16 x 1 1/16 +- 1/16. This will work you can get the copper seal rings at NAPA tell them to look it up it is for K-jetronic, KE-jetronic aka CIS. I don't know what Techron will do I think it was an additive called B&G that did the damage in the picture. If you have some you want to test put it in a jar and put one o-ring in it and the next day compare it to one that was not in the chemical, just use common black o-rings. I supply FD's to wholesale parts distributors and don't do any ads. I do the rebuilding and tech support and let sales people handle sales all I do is FD's so I don't have other parts.

    Larry Fletcher
    CIS Flow Tech Llc
    251-929-3771
    fletch62@bellsouth.net
     
  23. henryk

    henryk Formula Junior

    Dec 9, 2003
    479
    Door County, WI
    Thanks Fletch!
     
  24. Shamile

    Shamile F1 Veteran

    Dec 31, 2002
    6,563
    Lakeland FL
    Full Name:
    Shamile
    Dear Ferraristi,

    Hey Ya'll !

    OK, I did the wire in the spark plug connector and held it ( with gloves :) ) to the block. I did not get any spark on # 6 or # 7

    When I look at the relay board, all the fuses are OK and the "under-key" relay works. I put the Key in POS 2 and pulled the relay. Everything clicked off then on when the relay was put back.

    That tachometric relay thread I read on 85 TR not starting... Wpent, how did you jump it for a quick test?

    If I haven't said,,,I really appreciate all your advice
     
  25. henryk

    henryk Formula Junior

    Dec 9, 2003
    479
    Door County, WI
    All fuses are OK.........that is because the problem is in the ignition, for which there are no fuses.

    Since both banks (1-6 and 7-12) are out, the problem must be something that is common to both.

    I believe that the power going to one of the coils, supplies the other coil. So, to rule out the coils, switch them around..........and repeat the spark test. If one bank fires, and the other does not, then the problem is a coil.
     
  26. vref

    vref Karting

    Dec 18, 2003
    214
    1 Hr North of Housto
    Full Name:
    Jim
    I'll say it again.

     
  27. Tomf-1

    Tomf-1 F1 Rookie
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    Jan 17, 2004
    4,475
    Leawood KS/ South FL
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    Thomas

    vref--- are these coil problems prevelant in the 512TR series as well?
     
  28. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    19,283
    Texas
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    Steve Magnusson

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