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Accessing F1 clutch wear and PIS with Launch or Autel

Discussion in '360/430' started by OnlyaLadd, Dec 31, 2020.

  1. OnlyaLadd

    OnlyaLadd Rookie

    Aug 9, 2020
    7
    Burbank, CA
    Full Name:
    Troy Ladd
    I am having a terrible time finding a scan tool to access my TCU (something in the DIY category, NOT a SD or Leonardo).
    I am hoping somebody can point me in the right direction, before posting this I have spent many hours and reviewed MANY threads on the topic and still can't seem to get a clear answer. At this point I am wondering if there even may be something wrong with the car... I have purchased and tested 3 devices...to no avail...

    I am working with a 2002 360 Spider, TCU: CFC201F.05 (runs drives, shifts perfectly)
    Here is the breakdown of the 3 I have tried:
    1. Launch X431 mini pro: this device will connect to the car, I was able to access the engine ECU's although they appeared on the screen as "recovery", I could do actuator tests, it would not access the TCU showed "communication error with ECU", would not communicate with Airbag module also "communication error with ECU"...
    2. Autel Maxi-pro: this device does connect to the engine ECU's and also the Airbag module, but almost identical error when trying to access the TCU "communication error"
    3. Launch X431 Torque: this is pretty much identical to the results with the mini, I get left and right engine ECU (although they show as "recovery"), same error when trying to access the TCU or Airbag module. This is the version that Ricambi offers as a rental when doing a DIY clutch replacement, which gave me pretty high hopes for this unit, but still not working on my car.
    My next move is to purchase the Auto Enginuity unit, but my concern is that from what I have read and researched, quite a few guys on here have successfully used a variety of versions of the Launch tools, including the Torque version that Ricambi rents... so it should work, and simply purchasing another tool that also may not work, might not be the best move...

    I am starting to think it could be my car?? Seems unlikely, but I am at a loss...
    Any thoughts?

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  3. mello

    mello F1 Rookie
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    Jul 12, 2013
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    Steve
    I can tell you for a fact that AutoEnginuity works. That's one reason why I bought it, didn't want to waste my time dicking with other brands that supposed to work. My understanding is that there are a lot of fake units out there, so why waste the money and time trying to sort it out?
     
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  4. OnlyaLadd

    OnlyaLadd Rookie

    Aug 9, 2020
    7
    Burbank, CA
    Full Name:
    Troy Ladd
    Thanks for the re-assurance on the AutoEnginuity, I may end up going that route. Just seems odd that the x431 isn't working considering the numerous posts of people using them and that Ricambi loans one out specifically for clutch setup.
    Again, thanks for the reply! Gives me some hope, AE is still in a reasonable price zone compared to SD or Leonardo or even Texa..
     
  5. mello

    mello F1 Rookie
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    Like I said, there are lots of fake x431 floating out there, or OBD2 readers that claim to support exotics. I wrench my own cars so AE is a worthwhile investment for me. If you just want to set the PIS on your F1 for example, and nothing else, then I would suggest that you rent it from Ricambi instead. Saves you a lot of money in the long run.
     
  6. mello

    mello F1 Rookie
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    ... I see that you're in CA. I'm about 4-5 hours away. Maybe you can drop by and use my AE. Just a thought.
     
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  8. tstuli

    tstuli Karting

    Jun 12, 2018
    113
    #6 tstuli, Dec 31, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2020
    Launch X431 should work perfectly fine.

    Are you choosing first or second version?

    Try the cfc231 option as well. The protocol are the same for both for just reading the clutch.

    I ended up building my own tool just for this, but there isn't anything special that should preclude it working. Only other possibility I can think of is that the K-line signal isn't making it from your TCU to the OBD connector. I haven't checked the 360 but if its like others, there's likely a relay as well that swaps the K line between conn and the engine ECU. Possibly this has gone bad in which case no scan tool will work till you correct this.

    Sent from my SM-A515W using Tapatalk
     
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  9. eric355

    eric355 Formula Junior
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    Nov 30, 2005
    978
    Toulouse (France)
    Full Name:
    Eric DECOUX
    Nothing wrong with your car.
    As far as I have experimented, for the 360, these "cheap" diag tools are not able to connect to TCUs with a reference lower than 196986 (CS). The "First version" option does not work. So it's pretty normal they do not connect to your 2002 TCU. Starting with CS, the TCU software architecture has changed. Your diag tools are only able to connect to this new S/W architecture (ie. CS TCU 196986, 360 TCU 197533 & 211023).

    Texa and AutoEnginuity are the cheapest tools I know which will connect OK to your TCU.
    A cheaper option would be to have your TCU reflashed to CS spec, then you would be able to use X431 and Autel to connect to it.
     
    flash32 likes this.
  10. OnlyaLadd

    OnlyaLadd Rookie

    Aug 9, 2020
    7
    Burbank, CA
    Full Name:
    Troy Ladd
    Thanks again for the feedback and the very kind offer to use your AE! I own a company the designs, modifies and coach builds custom high end vintage American cars, you could probably guess I also wrench on my own cars. The 360 is a personal project I have been working on at home.... I think some of my colleagues would even disown me if they knew I owned an "import":)
    But I really like the car, and enjoy working on it, love driving it, so I am definitely willing to invest in a permanent solution. I am sure this wont be my first... :D
    Pleasure meeting you.
     
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  11. OnlyaLadd

    OnlyaLadd Rookie

    Aug 9, 2020
    7
    Burbank, CA
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    Troy Ladd
    Fantastic info! It looks like my TCU is 191701, so that makes sense. Funny you should mention reflashing to CS specs, that was the reason I began the tool search to begin with, I wanted to be able to reset PIS when I got the TCU reflashed and back in the car. But of course, since I work on my own cars I also needed something for future repairs, clutch changes etc. So it looks like my plan will be to move forward with the reflash, and try again... I probably buy the AE anyway, it appears to be a far superior tool.
    Thanks for your help!!
     
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  13. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 19, 2008
    33,086
    Clarksville, Tennessee
    Full Name:
    Terry H Phillips
    My techs have used AE for years with excellent results on Ferraris, Porsches, Mercedes, etc.
     
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  14. Michael39GGT

    Michael39GGT Rookie

    Jan 1, 2021
    2
    Full Name:
    Michael Baganz
    Hello Eric355,

    i registered here to ask you if you can update my TCU from Ferrari 360 to CS or that it **** faster. my tcu is
    Magnetti Marelli:

    17.05.99

    176552 62000.0008.01
    F0L00C01

    X00R1H59 137 99

    CFC201F.01


    sorry i did not found the option here to write by PN

    Thank you,

    Michael
     
  15. spider348

    spider348 Formula 3
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    Nov 3, 2003
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    Went to the AutoEnginuity website. Appears you need the EI18 Ferrari/Maserati module plus what for a base? Looks like a pro quality tool for reasonable money.
    Currently use a Diagzone based tool that sometimes works, sometimes doesn't! Difficult to trust a tool that does not provide consistent data.
     
  16. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Jul 19, 2008
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    Clarksville, Tennessee
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    Terry H Phillips
    Last time I looked, it was about $3500 all in for AE because you had to buy a bunch of other stuff to get the Ferrari/Maserati package.
     
  17. EastMemphis

    EastMemphis Formula Junior
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    May 25, 2019
    823
    Memphis, TN
    Full Name:
    John
    #14 EastMemphis, Jan 2, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2021
    If you've got one car and are willing to spend big money on an AE, you might as well go all the way. For $5k, you can have a Galileo.

    https://www.accinni.com/galileo-supercar-diagnostic-tool/

    The downside to the Galileo is that it covers only one car for that $5k and if you want to add another, it's about $2500 more. The upside is the unit comes with 2 years of warranty and free tech support so might be worth it. I almost bought one myself but the F tech I work with talked me into buying an Autel MS906 (~$1k) instead. I have a gated so not concerned with PIS.
     
  18. OnlyaLadd

    OnlyaLadd Rookie

    Aug 9, 2020
    7
    Burbank, CA
    Full Name:
    Troy Ladd
    I found them here:
    https://ktperformance.net/search.html?q=st06
    https://ktperformance.net/i-23896142-autoenginuity-scan-tool-ferrari-and-maserati-enhanced-interface-expansion-ei18-1995-2015.html?CATARGETID=120173980000089117&cadevice=c&gclid=Cj0KCQiA0MD_BRCTARIsADXoopaGN--bQ0cVRQGndSwxGU1posnQMsjNWMrSYVjq_BkKr_M5w771iEgaAlECEALw_wcB

    It appears you need to buy the base unit (hardware), approx: $250 then add whatever modules (software) you require for specific vehicle coverage, the Ferrari module is $1,800.
    So, all in, for Ferrari it looks like its a bit over $2k and of course you can add modules or bundles for other cars... I don't think that sounds bad for a quality reliable tool...
     
  19. OnlyaLadd

    OnlyaLadd Rookie

    Aug 9, 2020
    7
    Burbank, CA
    Full Name:
    Troy Ladd

    I found them here:

    the Ferrari module:
    https://ktperformance.net/i-23896142-autoenginuity-scan-tool-ferrari-and-maserati-enhanced-interface-expansion-ei18-1995-2015.html?CATARGETID=120173980000089117&cadevice=c&gclid=Cj0KCQiA0MD_BRCTARIsADXoopaGN--bQ0cVRQGndSwxGU1posnQMsjNWMrSYVjq_BkKr_M5w771iEgaAlECEALw_wcB

    the base unit:
    https://ktperformance.net/search.html?q=st06

    I believe those are the 2 essential items to get up and running on Ferrari... of course to use it on any other car more modules would be required.
     
  20. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 19, 2008
    33,086
    Clarksville, Tennessee
    Full Name:
    Terry H Phillips
    You have to have SP02 to use the Ferrari package, ST06 will not work with it, but those are pretty good prices. Catch 22.
     
  21. eric355

    eric355 Formula Junior
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    Nov 30, 2005
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    Toulouse (France)
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    Eric DECOUX

    Hello Michael.
    I can't PM you. Have you, in your profile, authorized PM from members ?
     
  22. OnlyaLadd

    OnlyaLadd Rookie

    Aug 9, 2020
    7
    Burbank, CA
    Full Name:
    Troy Ladd

    Soooo, I thought I would wrap up this thread with what I have learned in order to help anybody else trying to find a decent scan tool:

    1. Eric nailed it with his information: Re-flashing my TCU to CS spec solved my communication issue! Before ditching the Launch tool for an AE I had the TCU flashed to the CS software. Now the Launch X431 accesses the transmission information and I can read and write PIS and other info, as well as various actuator tests and bleeding functions.

    2. Although I have not gone back and tested the Launch mini pro or the Autel, that I previously tested (I no longer have those machines), I am VERY confident that they will also be able to access the re-flashed TCU.

    3. Terry is absolutely correct regarding the purchase of the AE system... after a conversation with AE, although you only need the ST06 and the Ferrari expansion EI18... they will absolutely NOT let you purchase the Ferrari expansion until you have first purchased all of the other expansions which are bundled under part #SP02... which all together runs about $3500

    4. The CS TCU upgrade is awesome.

    I hope this information is helpful to somebody else out there...
    I want to thank you guys that responded to this thread, you guys solved my problem!
     
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  23. lkstaack

    lkstaack Rookie
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    Dec 9, 2020
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    San Diego
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    Lars
    Where did you get your TCU reflashed?
     
  24. Michael39GGT

    Michael39GGT Rookie

    Jan 1, 2021
    2
    Full Name:
    Michael Baganz
  25. Chon360

    Chon360 Rookie

    Jan 11, 2021
    5
    Hong Kong
    Full Name:
    Jeremy
    Eric,

    This is Jeremy. My email is engdjeremychon@gmail.com. Drop me a line please as I need a TCU with CS firmware in it badly.

    Jeremy
     
  26. eric355

    eric355 Formula Junior
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    Nov 30, 2005
    978
    Toulouse (France)
    Full Name:
    Eric DECOUX
    email sent !
     

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