Adventures of a 95 Verde Mugello GT

Update for the moment.... manifold is stripped down. Still trying to plan my path for treatment and paint. Everything came apart relatively easy.

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Coolant sensors are also in the car now. Old ones likely have been in there for quite some time.

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I thought I previously read that there should be some thread sealant on these, but not too much as to interfere with the connection. Old ones didn't leak and came off without any signs of old sealant. I used just a little thread tape on each and it currently is dry around them, but is this correct procedure or should I go in naked thread?

More to come later

 

As I go thru my top end refresh, I have found this to be very solid advice again and again. Even with a good plan, I keep finding 'something else' or have to adapt or undo some previous repair, or decide to order another part and extend the time frame. And now finding out some of the diagrams aren't the most accurate (huge shocker, right) and getting the correct part re-ordered. Its a labor of love for sure! Can't wait to fire it back up, hopefully soon.

 

In the meantime.... the last few weeks have been productive. Intake manifold was powder coated.
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Rebuilt the charcoal cannister with new activated charcoal, and new hoses for the purge valves
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As i have struggled with the hot starts, I happened to notice both, but especially my right side cam sensor was pretty much destroyed at the plug. So those got ordered. I'm actually hopefull this may be my solution. Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login

Injectors came back from Mr Injector with a good report.

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nice job and interesting. My car is devoid of the charcoal system; I was debating putting it back in but not sure it would make a huge difference or not. That being said I know absolutely nothing about charcoal systems! Anyway nice job on the refresh!

 

I detail more about the cannister and purge valves in this thread.... and I may be off on my full understanding of the system

https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/posts/149999707/

 

My manifold as it waits to be reinstalled.

 

Gorgeous

 

Nice work Nick!

 

Still finishing up my winter overhaul, some delays... some unplanned, some user induced, but I'm on the home stretch to get driving again... but also in the middle of spring break travel with the family so not much getting done the rest of the month.

Came back from one trip last night to find my new to me 1/18 model arrived. It makes me smile! A very nice Mini-me
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shoot that's really cool! did you have that made? or find somewhere that can do them for order?
I will say...you have quite the Spirit! ; )

 

Its a Burango brand model. All over Ebay... just wanted it in green, and preferred an unboxed one, so I dont feel bad for opening 'using' it

 

There is no black 456M 1:18 model so I had to buy a Grigio and paint it black

This was made by Hotwheels and I found it on EBay

 

Anyone else read that in a Mick Jagger rhythm? "I see a Tan car and I want it painted Black, no more repairs I just want my fixed car back"

 

Excellent!
I got my mini-me a couple of weeks ago. Turns out the only Burago 456 GTs in Canna di Fucile (Sonderlackierung in German) were manufactured in celebration of the 90th anniversary of the German toy store Vedes, and there's only some 2000 or so in existence, so it took about 2 months to find one and have it shipped from the Netherlands!
The very cool thing is that the box included a 1994 Burago catalog showing a 456 GT on the cover, so both the 1:18 and the 1:1 cars were produced around the same time!

 

@C-Ray62 photo please

 

Oh, was the post broken? I thought I had fixed it immediately after posting and seeing the photos stayed inside the quoted previous post..
Sorry, here are the photos again!

 

Driving this spring has been unfortunately sparse... Work, vacation, kids sports and lots of thunderstorms has kept me in the garage more than I hoped.

On a cool day yesterday, I did finally turn 28k miles! Which I am extremely happy about... 30k here i come....

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I added a set of 575 rims and New Continental tires, and absolutely love the look now. Pictured with all the other 3 pedals cars we have, truck included! Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

However not all is perfectly rosy.... if you read back a page or 2, I did a big winter overhaul to repaint my manifold, and swap over the coolant sensors underneath. Found both Cam sensors were cracked. All along, i have been fighting a persistent and increasingly worse hot start issue. Well unfortunately I am still dealing with this. After my drive yesterday, car didn't want to start for 30 mins. I am running out of ideas or where to troubleshoot or revisit... quick summary of repairs and modifications...

Belts done spring 2022, lock and swap only, previous full cam timing done in 2019 (prior to my ownership). Car idles, runs and drives beautifly. Fuel mileage has been consistent thru ownership. When cold it start right up.

This started last year, what began as a slightly longer turn of the key before the car would fire off. Progressively getting worse

At the time, I had put in a new AGM group 48 battery.
Upgraded to the COP system, initially with generic COP, but now with Denso, same problem either way, worse with the generics.
The starter cranks like a fighter jet, so motor is turning over just fine.

Have a Guido Fuseboard
Have overhauled the Fuel pump supports and filters
Checked and swapped relays
Inspected plugs at the board
Have changed crank sensors
Cleaned grounds where I can locate them
Tested fuel pressure at the rails.
Had injectors sent out for cleaning.
Have cleaned and re-seated ecu plugs.

I have talked to Cribbj if anything on a 2.7 system and his ignition kit could be causing this, and nothing logical comes back, but that is certainly an unknown and time of this problem beginning is very coincidental.

I will revisit fuel pressure when warm, but wouldn't it seems like a longshot that BOTH sides are having issues to cause a full not hint of starting? Same for injector wiring, you would think I would run or at least try to start on 1 bank? Same for a gross vacuum leak, which doesn't seem to be happening either.

Even if timing were starting to shift, I should still get some light off or same symptoms when cold, right?


Im still biased this is electrical somewhere. I dont know where to check next

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And I REALLY dont want to put the stock ignition back on the car, but perhaps need to.

Is there anything about an AGM battery that this could be rooted to? Voltage when running is all normal.

 

Love this thread and the "group brainstorming" to get at a solution. Thanks

 

So what i realize i can do but haven't yet when this happens....

Pull a coil and ground a sparkplug to check for spark while having someone crank..

Put my noid light on an injector plug and look for pulse.

Followed by starter fluid in the intakes

Once it does eventually start I dont get any rich fuel smell or backfiring, so im believing fuel may not be getting into motor, but why.... both pumps not operating properly seems like a longshot.

Does this sound like a logical chain of testing

 

Couple things I’m thinking of (and I’ll preface my comments with - I do not know a lot about ‘engine’ issues… yet):
- are there any ‘old’ rubber lines in the fuel system that may be expanding when hot, such that they can’t deliver fuel to the rail effectively while dilated?
- is there a backflow valve, or fuel pressure regulator, that usually holds fuel in the rail that is failing?
- is the starter getting ‘heat soaked’
- just read online (generically) could be coolant temp sensor?
- maybe the battery is getting too hot?

Good luck!

 

Does it run normally after a hot start (at all rpms)? If it does, why would it be a pump issue? (EDIT) Unless it was a priming issue)

Cranking is strong and the coolant temp sensors have already been replaced.

 

How long do you have to crank the car to get it to start? If you even get a hint that it’s not going to start, can you check to see if there is a vacuum in the fuel tank by opening the filler cap?