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Advice sought for exhaust install (77 308GTB)

Discussion in '308/328' started by decampos, Feb 9, 2008.

  1. decampos

    decampos Formula Junior

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    #1 decampos, Feb 9, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Bought one of those Superformance exhausts, sure looks shiny and sweet but it appears to require (possible) significant adjustment to fit.

    Before I get fully stuck in I thought I'd ask if anyone here bought one of these and can offer advice. Did you have to fabricate brackets? (For a US spec 'B with stock spring mounts).

    Cheers.
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  3. jimshadow

    jimshadow F1 Rookie
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    Some have had to have brackets fab'd up. I just (last night) installed my X-OST on my GT4 and it fit perfect. Everything lined up thought it was a hair tight at one point.

    The pic looks like they will line up. How far off are they?

    JIM
     
  4. decampos

    decampos Formula Junior

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    Hi Jim. Thanks for your reply. They're quite far off, about 100mm or so, even without the springs and with stubbier bolts it would still hang too low.

    I looked at a 76 glass car the other day and noticed it had no springs or bushes at all. I considered that an option but surely my headers would be shattered in no time. What's the consensus on that?
     
  5. 8valve

    8valve Formula 3

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    Your 308 is a US model, which could be the clue to this Superformance exhaust not fitting right. I would contact Superformance to find out if their's is specifically made for Euro cars.
     
  6. Nuvolari

    Nuvolari F1 Veteran
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    On the top right of your second photo you can see the spring mechanism that holds the exhaust to the chassis. Right below the spring is a u-shaped yolk onto which there is a 90 degree bracket. This yolk will unscrew leaving behind a threadded stud that protrudes off of the spring. By removing the yolk and 'L' bracket you may pick up the space you need. To install the exhaust just run the stud through one of the holes in the exhaust mounting tab and secure it with a nut on each side. That way you maintain the spring mount and not risk damaging the headers. I have this on my car that is fitted with an ANSA muffler and it works great.

    I will say, however, that the mounts on the muffler 'look' to be too tall for the application. The ones on my ANSA are much shorter. Just an observation. I may be wrong on this one
     
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  8. 308 GTB

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    #6 308 GTB, Feb 9, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Robert,

    Our ANSA Sport mufflers are probably mounted similarly. When I had the muffler off five years ago to have it painted, I seem to remember it mounted as you described. The best I could do is post these details of the muffler mounting points.


    Ben,

    I hope this helps.

    Barry
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  9. decampos

    decampos Formula Junior

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    #7 decampos, Feb 9, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Thanks for the responses guys, I appreciate it.

    I asked Ron (at Superformance) when I picked it up and he said they've sold most of them to the US and he's never heard anything back so he assumed they'd be a straightforward install.

    I did dry that but even without the yolk and the L bracket it would still hang too low (probably difficult to see in the photograph). I also think the mounts on the muffler itself are too high, as you suspect. I did think the Euro 308s had the same type and same position of those lantern style springs as the US cars but I must be wrong.
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  10. Nuvolari

    Nuvolari F1 Veteran
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    You need to remember that the whole back section of a Euro car is different to a US car. The trunk on a Euro car is deeper and the way the whole back is welded is different to accomodate for this and the different mounts that the Euro bumpers use. As a result I would assume that the spring mounts are in a different place. Buying exhausts for these cars can be a nightmare as there are many variations from year to year.

    BTW The images posted by Barry are exactly like what is on my car now.
     
  11. 308 GTB

    308 GTB F1 World Champ
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    #9 308 GTB, Feb 9, 2008
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    I found this picture of an older ANSA Sport muffler like mine (FE 1940) in my computer archives. The mounts on the ANSA muffler are completely different than those on the Superformance unit.
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  13. decampos

    decampos Formula Junior

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    Barry, thanks for posting those pics. It's looking like those Ansas are more sympathetic to the US cars.

    Robert, you're absolutely right. I now recall reading in Newman's 308 thread (I think) that there's a good extra couple of inches depth in the Euro boot/trunk. I imagine some of that is lost on the girth of that damned Thermal-reactor, hence the different position of the mounts. D'oh.

    I'll have another bash tomorrow but it looks like I will have to make something. Maybe I can cut the springs in half.
     
  14. decampos

    decampos Formula Junior

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    That is pretty strange looking. Surely that's too wide!! Apart from the mounts that looks as though Superformance were certainly inspired by the design. Were they the stock Euro mufflers?
     
  15. Artvonne

    Artvonne F1 Veteran

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    I currently have an Ansa 1940. I spoke to someone at Ansa about two years ago who told me it was a long out of production muffler for a GT4. But he also told me they supplied it to early GTB/S cars for a while. It fits, but only with the rear valance removed as there is no clearance.

    That Superformance muffler looks like a Larini. Anyone confirm??
     
  16. 76Steel

    76Steel Formula 3

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    Artvonne,

    So, do you think that early 308's came with ANSA exhaust as "stock: OEM exhausts? I just found out that my 308 has an ANSA and was wondering ... thanks, Mike
     
  17. 308 GTB

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    My ANSA 1940 had to be modified to clear the rear valance. Fitment was difficult for the early North American version GTBs.
     
  18. 308 GTB

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    #15 308 GTB, Feb 10, 2008
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    OEM exhausts were the thermal reactor type:
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  19. 308 GTB

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    #16 308 GTB, Feb 10, 2008
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    Cutting and welding were necessary where I indicated:
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  20. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson F1 World Champ
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    That's actually my ex-308 non-stainless steel ANSA silencer FE2040 (USA 4-tips) for '78/'79 308GTB/S (originally purchased circa 1989) -- very similar to the FE1940, but the hangers might be different.
     
  21. bergxu

    bergxu Formula 3

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    I just shipped my Ansa Sport (FE 2620) back because there was no way it was going to work on my US-spec '82 GTSi. The mounts were totally different and the tips didn't come even close to aligning with the openings in the rear valence. I've been talking to Dan at Stebro and it looks like their 'Euro' system will work on a US car but I am also going to get their headers so hopedully that won't change things!
     
  22. Pizzaman Chris

    Pizzaman Chris F1 Rookie

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    #19 Pizzaman Chris, Feb 10, 2008
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  23. 308 GTB

    308 GTB F1 World Champ
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    Thanks for identifying the ANSA model number, Steve. I downloaded that picture about five years ago.

    ANSA fitment remains an issue for these early GTBs. Hopefully this thread and others like it will be of assistance.
     
  24. Sean F.

    Sean F. F1 Rookie

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    Don't count on that. There's been more than one issue with Stebro exhausts not fitting and waiting a LONG time to get it all right, assuming it happens that is.

    Ben, looks like those brackets need to be ground off and welded back on with out the riser portion. Other than the height, does everything else on the exhaust line up ?
     
  25. Artvonne

    Artvonne F1 Veteran

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    Originally Posted by 76Steel
    Artvonne,

    So, do you think that early 308's came with ANSA exhaust as "stock: OEM exhausts? I just found out that my 308 has an ANSA and was wondering ... thanks, Mike


    The early euro GTB/S cars (75-77 at least) had a single outlet exhaust, probably built by Ansa. But it probably wouldnt fit the US cars. The early US cars had the thermo muffler. Ansa has never made a specific muffler for the early US cars that I am aware of, and I think the problem lies in too many people assuming the cars are all the same underneath, and they are not. The later injected cars have dual cats, and the later QV have single cats, and they all use a different muffler. The 1940 will fit without the rear valance, but as pointed out above it really needs to be cut and rewelded to fit correctly.

    If the muffler from Superformance is made for a euro car, this could cause the confusion. If its a Larini, its probably going to be quite loud from all ive read, so before you modify it to make it permanently yours, think about it quite carefully.
     
  26. 308 GTB

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    #23 308 GTB, Feb 11, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    The ANSA FE1940 is no longer available. ANSA now lists the FE2020 (pictured below) for the early 308 GTB/S. Has anyone installed the FE2020? Did it require modification?
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  27. decampos

    decampos Formula Junior

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    Yes, it connects perfectly to the headers when held in position, the tips are also where they should be. Just the mounts are way off. I've spoken to Superformance and they've described the GT4 one as being a better match for my car. Going to swap them tomorrow so we'll see...

    That's interesting. That looks exactly like the Superformance one so I'd guess that would indeed require serious modifications for a US car.
     
  28. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
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    It does........:)

    I am not sure what I'll do.......either relocate the support brackets or use a conventional pipe hanger clamp off the spring isolator points, but on the NON CAT North American cars the spring points are well forward of the muffler can.

    If you leave it against the garage wall, it causes no trouble at all.....but I have to restore the body of #22641 where someone hack sawed it to fit a home built piece.....WTF???
     

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