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Are 7 year old tires really a problem ?

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by srslusso, Jul 24, 2008.

  1. srslusso

    srslusso Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 17, 2005
    860
    Encino,Ca.
    Full Name:
    Steve S.
    Many people are saying tires are no longer safe for high speed or high cornering load use when they are 7 years old and reccomend replacing them even though they are in good condition. I have 2 sets that appear to be excellant, hold air and so on. Could anyone especially a tire engineer with experience in this area comment ?
     
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  3. t walgamuth

    t walgamuth Formula Junior

    Mar 13, 2005
    850
    I cannot tell you with any precision exactly how many years is unsafe, but I can tell you that I have taken absoultely perfect looking tires which were factory original spares and not in any way worn or dry looking and put them in service to find that in short order the belts will shift and they are useless or they will throw the tread off.

    Around town old tires would not trouble me but on the highway or track I would not want my life depending on 7 year old tires.

    Tom W
     
  4. BIGHORN

    BIGHORN In Memoriam

    Sep 18, 2006
    733
    FLORIDA/NEW MEXICO
    Full Name:
    JOHN F KELLY
    Tires are cheap relative to fixing your car after a failure
     
  5. bill365

    bill365 F1 Rookie

    Nov 3, 2003
    3,319
    Chicago area
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    Bill
    Hi Steve,
    For tires, 7 years is getting a bit long in the tooth.

    Two things that you really shouldn't try to scrimp on are...

    Tires and brakes.

    Tires are your car's only connection to the road, traction (braking and cornering) is diminished when the rubber dries out + with the speed that these cars tempt you to explore and the forces of cornering at elevated speeds, I surely wouldn't want a tire failure.

    As for the brakes... You're safe if you can't go... BUT if you can't stop???

    Safety fast..

    Bill
     
  6. Bryanp

    Bryanp F1 Rookie
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    Aug 13, 2002
    3,735
    Santa Fe, NM
    oh now you've done it - you're going to get a letter from MG's copyright lawyers! wait, aren't they in China now????
     
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  8. bill365

    bill365 F1 Rookie

    Nov 3, 2003
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    At this point, I don't think they'll mind :D
     
  9. CornersWell

    CornersWell F1 Rookie

    Nov 24, 2004
    4,649
    Have witnessed a fellow bring out a brand spanking new 333SP to a track event with 5-year-old slicks on. Didn't make it out of pit lane before spinning into Pit out wall. Spun again just getting the car around the track to pit in. Did enough damage to the chin splitter that he could have bought multiple sets of tires. Don't chintz.

    CW
     
  10. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
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    Jim Glickenhaus
    #8 Napolis, Jul 25, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Ditto. One of my cars still has it's original tires from 1967 BUT I only fit them for concours. When I drove her in the Historic Targa Florio I fit newly cast wheels and tires.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
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  11. buster bram

    buster bram Formula Junior

    Dec 10, 2005
    439
    mussolini's Garage
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    Sean
    Jim my 330gt (1964) STILL has the orignal tyres on it! I tend to keep corner speedsdown to below 100mph A little go karters trick with tyre paint keeps them soft
     
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  13. mdempsey

    mdempsey Karting

    Jun 6, 2007
    152
    Huntingtown, MD
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    Mark P. Dempsey
    All lawyers should be in China...........or better yet North Korea.
     
  14. Bryanp

    Bryanp F1 Rookie
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    Aug 13, 2002
    3,735
    Santa Fe, NM
    hey, I resemble that remark!
    The MG Car Club recently polled it's membership re: whether to allow the new Chinese-made MGs for judging at shows. No joke.

    Re: tires, I have always heard that tires begin to deteriorate from the inside-out after about 6 years. Some of my old Michelin XWXs were so old when I pulled them off that they didn't have date codes - at the time I think that would have made them more than 15 years old. They were freakin' ice skates in the wet.
     
  15. prance

    prance Formula Junior

    May 4, 2005
    510
    Agoura Hills
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    morris
    If your speaking about XWXs then I thiink they are relatively unsafe and unpredictable when new. I try to change them about 5 years or so the way I drive.
    If you are doing any sort of high speed driving then the price of new tires is a small price in comparison to the bad stuff that can happen if you tires fail.
    At 7 years why even question it.
    Morris
     
  16. p.roma

    p.roma Karting

    Mar 29, 2006
    145
    would you trust a 7 year old condom?
     
  17. CornersWell

    CornersWell F1 Rookie

    Nov 24, 2004
    4,649
    Well, that right there about puts it in perspective!

    CW
     
  18. Pete Wall

    Pete Wall Formula Junior

    Apr 1, 2005
    358
    Perth, Australia
  19. srslusso

    srslusso Formula Junior
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    Mar 17, 2005
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    Steve S.
    My 365 GT 2+2 originally was fitted with 215/70-15 tires, a previous owner upgraded them to 255/60-15s Eagle GTs, which he used for racing and hillclimbs as well as the street and they were last replaced @ 7 years ago. I do not intend to prepare the car for Concours Events and have a set of 215/70-15 Coker (XWXs) that are also 7 years old. The previous owner begged me not to go back to them for handling and ride purposes. They look a little too big and rub something slightly on the inside of the tires when at full lock in parking. Another friend has 235/60-15s Pirell P4000s on his 365GT 2+2 and they rub as well. I need a tire that is at least 26 1/2 to 27" diameter with a speed rating for 130+ mph what would anyone suggest ? Some of the tires that are being offered are NEW but up to 2 years old. Performance and low road noise are important to me, wet weather performance are not. I do not want raised white letters. Any suggestions ? I need them before Monterey.
     
  20. prance

    prance Formula Junior

    May 4, 2005
    510
    Agoura Hills
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    morris
    Dunlop sp racing tires or Vredestein vintage tires.
    Morris
     
  21. srslusso

    srslusso Formula Junior
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    Mar 17, 2005
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    Steve S.
    Morris where can I buy them or get information on them, in Southern California. I don't see them listed on Tire Rack. What are you running on the 275GTB ?
     
  22. jm348

    jm348 F1 Rookie
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    Mar 21, 2007
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    Redondo Beach, CA
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    Jeff M
    +1 in a nutshell......:D no pun intended
     
  23. prance

    prance Formula Junior

    May 4, 2005
    510
    Agoura Hills
    Full Name:
    morris
    I'm not an expert on this but I hear that the Dunlops have good stick from those who do performance rallies, i.e. The Tour Auto. Try
    http://www.universaltire.com/cart.php

    they seem to have a good selection. I'm not sure where to get them in SoCal, you might want to call norbert at 562-290-0110, he is constantly trying diferent combinations for his customers.

    I personally run Michelin XWX 205/14 on the gtb and I basically hate them. They aren't grippy enough.
    When I was on the 275 tour I kept up pretty well with everyone except the comp. cars with larger wheel and stickier tires.
    I want to go with a 15" wheel but clearence is an issue on the rear. I am getting ready to try diferent combinations to see if anything fits without modifying the body. The comp. cars originally had 15" rims with 6" tires. They had much larger wheel wells to accomidate the larger tires.
    Work in progress.
    Morris
     
  24. Kds

    Kds F1 World Champ

    I draw the line at 4 years from the date of manufacture on the sidewall.

    Tires are cheaper than brain surgery.
     
  25. Bill P

    Bill P Karting

    Jan 27, 2004
    65
    Prescott AZ
    Full Name:
    William D. Preston
    I edit and publish the 250 GTE Newsletter. This is what I wrote for the July 2008 issue:

    In earlier columns I have said that tires over seven years old are dangerous from two aspects: (1) the carcass dries out, looses its elasticity and is likely to delaminate, causing the loss of a tread and, (2) the tread rubber becomes hardened, loses its flexibility, and makes the tire prone to slip. Tires have a “shelf life” and if you unknowingly buy a brand new set of old tires, part of that life has already been used up.

    How old are the tires on your car (s)? For years the Rubber Manufacturers Association has made it difficult for you to tell how old your tires really are. Until 2007 they put the encoded date on the inside of the tires. If you wanted to learn how old a tire was you had to crawl under the car with a flashlight. Beginning this year the coded date is finally on the outside of the tire.

    The code is the last set of a series of numbers on the sidewall of the tire. The rest of the numbers have to do with load carrying capability, traction performance, wear performance, etc. The last set of numbers is three digits long if your tires were built in the 1990s and four digits long if they were built in the 2000s. For example, a tire coded 441 was built in the 44th week of 1991 and is now 16 years old. A tire coded 4202 was built in the 42nd week of 2002 and is now five years old.

    In Great Britain consumers have been strongly warned that it is dangerous to drive on tires that are older than six years. In the U. S., Ford Motor Company has tried to get the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration to issue a similar warning but has not been successful so far. The Rubber Manufacturers Association has been successful in convincing the NHTSA that there is “no scientific basis” for putting out a warning or for putting a “sell by” date on tires.

    If you purchase an unpopular size or brand of tires for your car, be aware that those “new” tires may have sat in the tire dealer’s inventory for years (in some cases over fifteen years) before you came along and bought them. Now you know the code, take a look at the date on the sidewall before you accept the tires.

    If you want to know more about this subject, log on to:

    http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=4826897

    Bill Preston
     
  26. Crawler

    Crawler F1 Rookie

    Jul 2, 2006
    4,995
    #23 Crawler, Jul 27, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Try this place for the Vredestein Classic, if you're interested. They will ship them.

    www.cloverleaf-auto.com

    Some Dino guys have used them as an alternative to the ultra-pricey Coker XWXs and have given very positive reviews. I have a set on a Morgan +8 and have found them to be outstanding. (I'm actually taking the Dino to 16" wheels and modern tires.) I know that they have 205/70-14 (I think they're around $150), and Vred's website shows 205/70-15, but not 215.

    http://www.vredestein.com/Banden_Bandtypes.asp?BandgroepID=5&BandtoepassingID=0&BandtypeID=17&PageID=2&Rimsize=15&UserSessionID=71692622

    Vredestein advertises them as vintage-looking tires with up-to-date materials and technology.

    Here's a tread photo:
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  27. Crawler

    Crawler F1 Rookie

    Jul 2, 2006
    4,995
    ...or a funeral.
     
  28. pastmaster

    pastmaster Formula Junior

    Feb 5, 2006
    875
    Alma, Michigan USA
    Just out of curiosity, has anyone checked their new 2008 vehicle, any make, domestic or foriegn, to see how old the tires are?

    It's a new car and the tires should be new also, not older than the model year of the car. I don't have a new car or truck, is it convenient for some to do it?

    Ciao...Paolo
     

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