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BestMotoring DVD: 360 v F355 v GT3 v NSX-R @ Fuji

Discussion in '348/355' started by Mako99, Feb 6, 2004.

  1. Mako99

    Mako99 Formula Junior
    BANNED

    Dec 29, 2003
    454
    Just watched a bit of this very well produced DVD (visuals are stunning, these BMI editions get better and better with each new release) and I thought I'd offer a few quick things that I noticed:

    1. Fuji track goes bye bye

    -Nice memorial and history lesson on the Fuji cicuit closing for two years due to a planned renovation. I first saw Fuji in the original Atari Pole Posistion game, and it's remained a sentimental favorite since. Great track for showcasing the technical prowess of the cars themselves, while say Suzuka has always been a showcase for the driver's skill level more than HP.

    2. Fuji Battle

    - Nice to see the cars stretching their legs on this 4.4km track, as oppossed to the rediculously short tsukuba track BMI uses that I've always hated for judging cars. Conditions on test day were brutal, nearly 100 degrees F, so tires gave out very early, and overheating was an issue.

    Cars entered were the Porsche 911 GT3, Ferrari 360, Ferrari 355, Honda NSX Type-R, Nissan Skyline GT-R Nur, Mitsu Evo VIII, Subie Impreza STi.

    Here's the finishing order at the end of 4 laps:

    1. 911GT3
    2. Ferrari 360 Modena
    3. NSX Type-R
    4. STi
    5. Evo VIII
    6. Ferrari 355 (DNF)
    7. Skyline GTR-Nur (DNF)

    Comments:

    911GT3: HP and grip rule, and the 911GT3 so easily destroyed this field at Fuji that it was a joke. Gan drove it and appeared to be sleeping the whole way due to a lack of competition. This car was in another stratosphere compared to any other in the field.

    360: Both the 360 and the F355 had aftermarket exhausts, in Japan that usually means no cats either, so they were running a bit hotter than stock. And they were both F1 tranny models. The 360 was difficult to control, driver called it "scary but fast". It passed the NSX-R easily on the last lap for second place, and also had the second fastest lap of the day. Was losing ground pretty dramatically to the GT3 by the end, about two seconds per lap.

    NSX Type-R: Had astounding brakes, easily equal to or better than the GT3's, they're the only reason the car was competitive on such a power intensive track. Easy as pie to control, until the tires went out due to heat. It also overheated badly by the end of the race on the final straight which is surprising, it would have been a DNF if the race were scheduled for even just one more lap. Don't think that's ever happened to an NSX before on BM. Both of the Ferraris had no problem with the heat. The NSX's stock bridgestone tires gave way in the heat (the rears) so by the last lap with the engine overheating and the rear tires out of their competitive temp zone, that car was a total mess. Funny to see the Type-R go from the great all-around car it's reputed to be on lap 1, to being what we usually expect a Ferrari or other Italian car marque to be by lap 4, which is difficult to control, on the verge of collapse, and one second from a major mechanical failure.

    F355: had worked its way up to fourth or so, and then had to retire on lap 3 from horrible brake fade. BM driver went off the course at the end of the straight in it and was like "Where are my brakes??" Seemed to like the drive until that point however. The 355 was competitive with the Subie and Evo, but not a match for the top 3 cars. It would have finished fourth in an extended race, IF its brakes had held up.

    Skyline: The Skyline was broken from the start, some kind of boost problem. Retired very early, and wasn't competitive anyway. Too much heat, too much weight, too much period.

    Evo/STi: They fought each other nose to tail the whole way, yes these are great cars but they bore me. I focused on the coupes, but I remember the driver loved the STi, fawned all over its engine and dampers.

    Bottom Line:

    As usual, the post-race comments were filled with *****ing by the drivers about the regulations that JDM companies put on their engines in terms of HP. However this is the first time I've heard them all agree that Japan is no longer competitive with Europe, and that drastic steps would need to be taken in order to even stay equal to the Euros in the future, otherwise Japan will fall far behind the rest of the world in terms of sports car performance.

    For me it's like, ok WE ***** about the Japanese regulations, and now the Japanese THEMSELVES are *****ing about their own regulations, so who the @#$! is running these JDM car companies? Lose the restrictions or get a$$-owned by not only the Euros, but the Americans too, whose C6 Vette and Viper will tap the Type-R's a$$ all over the place.

    Funny to think that the all-conquering GT3 (which started in EIGHTH PLACE on the grid and was in FIRST PLACE by the half way point of the first lap) is actually cheaper than the NSX-R in Japan, lol!!!

    Anyway that's all I've seen, I scanned the rediculously lame "Togue challenge" part of the disc, which is BM trying to look hip and young to their domestic viewers by featuring the asinine sport of drifting, setup as a strange nose to tail race. Skip. There's also a nice recap of the Tokyo Auto Show from November.

    Overall I liked the disc, the Fuji portions are fascinating, and for $20 I'd buy it again.
     
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  3. Jameel

    Jameel Formula Junior

    Nov 4, 2003
    401
    Canada
    1. Isn't Best Motoring all in Japanese? or is this DVD translated?

    2. Where can you buy this from / where did you get it?

    3. I don't think it's fair that they compared the GT3 to the "regular" F360. It should have been compared to the F360 Stradale.

    Yah the Japanese have fallen behind in terms of the sport car market. The early 90s to mid 90s was amazing for the Japanese. They had very competitive sports cars, like the 3000GT-VR4/Stealth Twin-Turbo, 300ZX TT, Supra TT, RX7-Turbo and the NSX. And with just some minor modifications you could have very fast cars. But since the entire Yen to dollar ratio falling the Japanese cars fell of the market (it's a shame).

    And I don't know what the current (Japanese) car companies are thinking with the RX-8 and 350Z. And Honda better smart-in’ up and make the Next generation NSX (HSC) be very competitive with Ferrari, GM, Ford and Dodge. Hopefully they’ll slap a V8 with at least 400HP in the next NSX.
     
  4. netviper

    netviper Formula Junior

    Nov 2, 2003
    659
    Saint Augustine
    Full Name:
    Dave
    I think you are being a little harsh once again MAKO. It was competitive because of its incredible brakes and handling. It could hold off the GT3 easily until the first straight. There is no way the NSX-R can hold off a car with 100 more HP in a straight line. It was over from there.

    I also think the only reason the 360 was ahead was because of the car overheating.. which was strange. I think he backed off. I have never seen that from a NSX before.

    Anyway, give the NSX another 100 HP (like they should have done 5 years ago) and I think it would take it.
     
  5. Mako99

    Mako99 Formula Junior
    BANNED

    Dec 29, 2003
    454
    First, here's where I buy my DVDs to all that asked:

    http://store.performancecardvds.com/bemoin1.html

    Second, Viper, my eyes are fairly sportscar agnostic and I think it's a fair analysis of what transpired. For others here that don't know, I own a late model NSX, so if anything I'm likely to be a bit biased in that direction. However, here's what I saw:

    1. The R driver didn't back off at all, plus even if he did, the 360 had reeled him in from two laps previous and continued that pace on the final lap. Also, the 360 had a better max laptime, even when the R wasn't overheating and its tires were perfect. Granted that laptime took place in only 4 laps, but the 360 driver was only going to get faster and faster as he pushed it. The R set its own fastest lap right away, which is a testament to its ease of use. It likely didn't have much more to shave off, even with 100 laps. The 360 did for sure.

    2. As in F1, two cars close together at the start may look competitive for the first lap or two until the trailing car finally passes and speeds off into the distance. Then you realize that the front car was MUCH slower and was simply a barrier throughout the course. Even F1 commentators fall for this trying to spice up the limited action in a telecast, playing up the "battle" and the "competitiveness" of the two close cars only to see one blow by later and have them looking like morons.

    This is definitely the case in the video during the one single lap where the 911 couldn't get by the R. The 911 being two seconds faster PER LAP doesn't speak to the R being competitive in the handling areas, and it's not all gained on the straight. The GT3 was faster through all sectors, and the R's great breaking allowed it to hang for as long as it did (again it hung in there for a grand total of 1 lap).

    This was not a battle, it wasn't close, the R was beaten in all sections and at all points with the exception of breaking, were they were equal with a slight advantage for the R.

    3. Agree with you on more power, if you give the NSX another 100HP it's right there or faster for sure. Especially with a 2,800lb curb weight. That would be a magnificent car.

    But then we could play the "well if the 500HP Monza was there it then blows away the +100HP revised NSX" so it's always a losing battle playing the what-if game. All that matters is the here and now.

    Frankly I'd love to see a retest, at Sugo, with the Stradale, GT3, Gallardo, and a tuned JDM car or two.

    Hey what did you think of that ARTA NSX getting a$$-owned in the JGTC sections of that DVD? I was shocked, that car was horrible. Very similar to NASCAR restrictions to limit a particularly fast entry, the NSX is no so limited over there that it's not even a race. Lame.
     

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