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bits needed for my new 456

Discussion in '456/550/575' started by Granada456, Dec 21, 2020.

  1. Granada456

    Granada456 Karting

    Dec 8, 2020
    51
    Granada
    Full Name:
    Julyan
    Hello all,
    I've just signed up to Ferrarichat because I've bought my first Ferrari, a 1994 456. It drives well and I'm happy I've bought it.

    So far I've found a few electrical issues that I need to look into; one window doesn't go down as it should when the door is opened, the heating control system isn't responding properly, and one seat isn't moving forward when the backrest is tilted. I see some threads on these issues and I hope the information will help me troubleshoot the issues. If not I'll be back on here asking questions.

    I thought I would ask the forum whether anyone has any of these bits and pieces lying around, because I'm missing them on the car:

    - My key is the one with a little light in it. (The part number is 164089, it seems.) My key is only 'half there': it's missing the plastic cover piece and it's missing the light unit itself from the key innards. I find I can buy a new key - for a lot of money! - but does anyone have just the plastic cover and/or the light from a key, by any chance?

    - A left (driver’s - LHD car) floormat in blue plus the clips to fix it to the floor.

    - One screw from the plastic cover over the engine, number 13302577

    - A toolkit

    Thanks for any leads on any of these.
     
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  3. 308 GTB

    308 GTB F1 World Champ
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    Feb 7, 2002
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    Barry Wolinsky
    Julyan,

    Congratulations on you 456!

    The Sipea lighted key blanks occasionally come up on eBay but are very pricey. The Alfa Romeo 164 key is identical and you can harvest the parts you need from one of those...


    Image Unavailable, Please Login


    Check on the Alfa Romeo 164 Register: Alfa Romeo 164 Register.com

    You might find some for sale there.

    Barry
     
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  4. Qavion

    Qavion F1 Rookie
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    Feb 20, 2015
    4,861
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    Ian Riddell
    Ricambi America may stock the carpet clips. P/N 63698100. I can't recall if they were OEM or a suitable replacement.

    Where are you located (Granada in Spain?)
     
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  5. mathewr

    mathewr Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed Classified Subscribed

    Julyan,

    Congrats on the purchase! I just bought my first back Ferrari in Oct.

    There are several OEM Tool Kits on USA Ebay for sale, new and used. Not cheap as they are considered rare.
    I have a set of perfect OEM wheels if interested, for cheap if yours have damage.
    I will look for the blue floor mat and let you know if I come across anything.

    Cheers, Mat
     
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  6. F456M

    F456M F1 Rookie
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    Congrats on your first Ferrari! I also had a 456 as my first Ferrari. Great car! If you ever considder to replace some of the exhaust, let me know. I spent quite a bit of money on the exhaust and it can be quite a long road and expencive thing to do to get it right. Any pictures of the car?
     
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  8. Granada456

    Granada456 Karting

    Dec 8, 2020
    51
    Granada
    Full Name:
    Julyan
    Yes, I'm in Granada in Spain, and I bought the car locally. It has spent since about 2000 here in Granada, before which it was in the UK for a few years, and before which it was originally sold new in 1994 in the Francorchamps dealership in Belgium. The car is silver with a blue interior and I will see about putting up a picture.

    Many thanks for the lead on a Alfa 164 key being the same. In fact I have a 1997 Alfa, a 916, but that has a different, red plastic key, and I hadn't seen this black square plastic key before on any car. I'll see whether I can trace an Alfa key to cannibalize.

    Since my car has spent most of its life in the dry Granada climate, my exhaust seems fine, and I don't see any rust anywhere on the car, in fact. My wheels are also more or less spotless, and the body as a whole has only a couple of tiny marks on the paint for its 26 years.

    At some point some owner (not either of the last two owners, with whom I'm in touch), did not hand on the toolkit with the car, and that is the most obvious 'missing piece' that I'll try to replace, although of course it's merely a case of having the car 'complete', rather than being of any practical importance. Am I right that the 456 toolkit ought to have '456' written on the leather?

    Over the christmas period I intend to play with the electrics to try to sort out the little issues that are of importance: see whether I can get the heating/air conditioning working, the passenger window to go down when I open the door, the central locking to work, and the driver's seat to move forward when I tilt the seat back.

    I appreciate all your replies, thanks
    Julyan
     
  9. Fennicus

    Fennicus Formula Junior

    Apr 10, 2015
    523
    Helsinki, Finland
    Full Name:
    Pekka T.
    Hi Julyan,

    and welcome, I have had our 1995 Argento Nürburgring / Red (Connolly VM.3171) car for almost six years now. Original spare parts are quickly becoming NLA which is sad.

    There are almost perfect clips for the carpets available if you search for ”boat top / canvas fasterers”.

    The front seats are very heavy, have an assistant when you lift them out or back into the car.

    cheers!
     
  10. Salami

    Salami Karting

    Oct 31, 2020
    126
    Oregon
    Yes the tool kit with my car says Ferrari on the front and 456gt on the back, stamped into the Leather.
     
  11. Granada456

    Granada456 Karting

    Dec 8, 2020
    51
    Granada
    Full Name:
    Julyan
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  13. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Jul 19, 2008
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    Very nice. Like the pre-airbag steering wheel.
     
  14. Granada456

    Granada456 Karting

    Dec 8, 2020
    51
    Granada
    Full Name:
    Julyan
    Do you know whether it's useful for me, having just bought this car secondhand, to register myself on the myferrari app and add the car to it? Does the myferrari app give me access to anything useful as the owner of a secondhand, 26 year old Ferrari?

    I'm not sure whether I should ask this here or should start another thread, in another area of the site...

    Merry christmas, Julyan
     
  15. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 19, 2008
    33,046
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    Terry H Phillips
    Julyan- Gets you access to an online owners manual and you will get e-mails from Ferrari that occasionally have interesting stuff on new Ferraris and events.

    If one did not come with her, you most likely want owners manual 792/93 or 817/93.
     
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  16. Granada456

    Granada456 Karting

    Dec 8, 2020
    51
    Granada
    Full Name:
    Julyan
    Owners manual: I have the leather pouch with the owners manual, service book, list of dealers, hifi manual etc. My owners manual is 792/93.

    I also have a copy of the workshop manual, which I'm using to troubleshoot the electrics.

    MyFerrari: I have tried registering twice, with two different emails. It takes my data then when I come to login it says "Sorry! Dear user, your credentials are no longer valid for accessing the MyFerrari portal." Perhaps it's a christmas problem of their server.
     
  17. Qavion

    Qavion F1 Rookie
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    Feb 20, 2015
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    Ian Riddell
    I'm curious to know if you have a wiring diagram for the 456, Julyan? I think most of us have only been able to find diagrams for the 456M (which are somewhat different).

    These would be useful for diagnosing systems like the active rear diffuser.
     
  18. Granada456

    Granada456 Karting

    Dec 8, 2020
    51
    Granada
    Full Name:
    Julyan
    Sorry, I should have been more careful in my reply. I have a workshop manual for the 456, and for the 456M, and, yes, I see that it's only in the latter that there's a wiring diagram. That explains why the previous owner had the manual for the later model, and why he passed it on to me along with the correct manual, which is something that puzzled me at first, since as far as I know, he had never owned a 456M.
     
  19. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Jul 19, 2008
    33,046
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    Julyan- There is also an expanded Section L for the 456M with more detail.
     
  20. Granada456

    Granada456 Karting

    Dec 8, 2020
    51
    Granada
    Full Name:
    Julyan
    I have the two workshop manuals, but not that expanded section L, which sounds like it could be really useful - could you point me to somewhere I can find it?
    Thanks
     
  21. Qavion

    Qavion F1 Rookie
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    Feb 20, 2015
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    I'm working on some coloured and labelled schematic diagrams for the 456M which give a better general overview of the wiring (and incorporate most sections of Section L), but you will probably still need the WSM version when trying to follow the harness routing.

    https://www.dropbox.com/t/g0RYcLfowc24CFCn

    Link expires in 6 days.

    If you can view the files with Windows Paint or similar graphics program, you can enlarge them. Depending on your (computer) devices, you may be able to send the individual files to an iPad for easy enlarging/scrolling.

    You may need some guidance when it comes to interpreting the instrument diagrams. There are large differences between the instruments on the 456M and 456, so I don't know how useful they will be. I've been working on an automatic gearbox diagram, but I'm stuck at the moment. The cooling fan circuit is not clear and there are some connectors in other parts of the circuit which have wires the same colours and the WSM doesn't make it clear how they are hooked up.
     
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  22. Granada456

    Granada456 Karting

    Dec 8, 2020
    51
    Granada
    Full Name:
    Julyan
    Many thanks for that, Ian. As you say, I'll have to see how much is useful on an earlier 456.

    The little problems with my car all seem to be electrical. I have it down in the garage with part of the carpets and door cards removed to expose the innards. So far, I've removed an old Clifford alarm - I didn't even have the remote - and am tidying up next to the fuse box where the wiring was cut to insert that. Apart from that, there seem to be two issues:

    One is that the central locking doesn't work and nor does one of the door windows lower when that door is opened. Removing the door cards showed the problem here - someone has messed with the wiring. The window doesn't lower because that control box has been removed. And it looks like part of the wiring has been disconnected that is probably the central locking. So I'm trying to work all that out. If anyone has pictures of the doors showing the correct wiring and where everything should plug in, I'd like to see them. I see that a control box is very expensive, but the actual electronics is almost certainly very simple; I don't suppose anyone has made a circuit diagram or a replacement circuit?

    The second problem, possibly not linked to the first, is that the heating controls don't work. The previous owner had tried to fix this and had bought a replacement heating control box. But neither the old nor the new box makes anything work. I'm trying to see where I might start to diagnose this one. Any tips will be gratefully received.
     
  23. Fennicus

    Fennicus Formula Junior

    Apr 10, 2015
    523
    Helsinki, Finland
    Full Name:
    Pekka T.
    Hi,

    what do you mean with “makes anything work”?

    Are you aware of the AC off switch in the center console? Is it on or off?

    if the HVAC/AC unit is powered can you get the fans to run at full speed if you switch the “auto” function off, select a mode manually and switch the fans to ”4” which is max/full speed?

    There are many threads here on fchat with photos and part numbers about the 456 GT HVAC aka AC aka A/C system if you do a couple of searches.

    Unfortunately it looks like the ”thermal switch” which is the same part also for 550 and 456M is now NLA. I have two, both non functional, I am trying to find an electrician (or magician) who could fix them.

    Cheers!
     
  24. Granada456

    Granada456 Karting

    Dec 8, 2020
    51
    Granada
    Full Name:
    Julyan
    I meant that so far I haven't managed to get the heating controls to respond at all. But I'm not familiar with how they should work. If the AC switch is off, should the fan run? Or does 'off' mean absolutely everything of the AC, heating and ventilation is turned off?

    Regarding the door electrics, here is a picture of my left-hand door after I have taken the door card off. What is that connector above the control box that is not connected to anything? Should it be there or is it another modification someone has made for an unknown purpose?

    Thanks for any help!
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  25. Qavion

    Qavion F1 Rookie
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    Feb 20, 2015
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    #22 Qavion, Jan 3, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2021
    The connector should be there, according to other photos of the harness (p/n 153103)

    https://www.ebay.co.uk/p/4005487733

    It doesn't plug into the opposite side of the control box?

    https://www.ferrariparts.co.uk/part/ferrari/153096?id=27279

    The control box (P/N 153096) should have 3 connectors.

    I can't see the part number on your box.
     
  26. Qavion

    Qavion F1 Rookie
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    The compressor should stop working and the hot water valve should close, so basically no heat control. The fan should still operate manually as should the air direction controls.
     
  27. Granada456

    Granada456 Karting

    Dec 8, 2020
    51
    Granada
    Full Name:
    Julyan
    Yes, it plugs into the other side - thanks! It does look like the wiring has been messed about on this left door, because the connectors look as though at least the harness has been unwound, but it's the other, right door where things are definitely bad. There's no box, there and the connectors have been removed and the wires joined 'ad hoc' in some way to kind of make things work. I think I want a box and a wiring loom for the right door.

    A question about the box: should it control both the window mechanism and the door lock mechanism?
     
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  28. Granada456

    Granada456 Karting

    Dec 8, 2020
    51
    Granada
    Full Name:
    Julyan
    Thanks - I'll check this tomorrow.
     

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