Cold Start only on second crank | FerrariChat

Cold Start only on second crank

Discussion in 'Boxers/TR/M' started by deuce49, Mar 21, 2022.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. deuce49

    deuce49 Karting

    Sep 25, 2011
    131
    Scottsdale
    Full Name:
    BC
    One issue that I have been wondering about since picking up my 1990 TR a few months ago is when I haven't driven the car for a few days and I try and start cold, the starter spins for a few (1-4) seconds and nothing. Doesn't ignite any cylinders or try and come to life. Turn the key for a second time and it comes to life every single time. Sometimes it feels like at first it's not running on the full 12 cylinders but only for a fraction of second as it gets running and then its all good.

    I never have an issue of starting on first crank when warm or hot.

    Any ideas? I would assume this isn't completely normal? Not a big deal by any means to crank short once to prime and crank again be off to the races. Thank you!
     
  2. Yenko

    Yenko Karting

    Jan 23, 2014
    113
    Florida, USA
    Full Name:
    Keith
    You have described my 1990 TR to a "T" (no pun intended). I have owned mine for 8 years and never thought it to be unusual. Mine has always started cold on the second crank and first crank warm. I actually consider it a good thing as you pre-lube and pressurize all the rod and crank bearings. I don't know for sure but "think" it is normal because it takes a second to pressurize the injectors and get them charging the cylinders. My feeling is, don't worry about it. Just my 2 cents..
     
  3. vincenzo

    vincenzo F1 Rookie

    Nov 2, 2003
    3,373
    You just described my 1994 F250 (460 CID) to a “T”.

    It needs a bit of foreplay to get things started.
     
  4. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

    Apr 6, 2008
    8,934
    southwest germany and thailand
    Full Name:
    romano schwabel
    so does the starter then stops after those 1-4 seconds or you stop the starter?
     
  5. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    25,150
    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
    Full Name:
    Steve Magnusson
    Are you getting down to below ~68 deg F overnight for many hours? If not, cold starting can be somewhat sluggish as the TTS won't close (so the cold start injectors won't squirt during the first initial starter motor cranking). Would never hurt to unplug a cold start injector, connect a +12V test light between the two terminals in the harness connector, and confirm/deny if it illuminates during the first second or two of the first cold start attempt (it should if the TTS got cold enough for long enough).

    Have you inspected the fuel pump connections in the y white connector, or done some modification to ensure that they aren't degraded? During starting, the battery voltage droops down to about 10V so a connection getting flaky may not work; whereas, if the engine actually starts (on one bank), the alternator voltage will increase to about 14V and may make a bad connection (on the other bank) start working.
     
    turbo-joe likes this.
  6. deuce49

    deuce49 Karting

    Sep 25, 2011
    131
    Scottsdale
    Full Name:
    BC
    I stop cranking as I never like to have starter run for prolonged periods
     
    vincenzo likes this.
  7. deuce49

    deuce49 Karting

    Sep 25, 2011
    131
    Scottsdale
    Full Name:
    BC
    Thanks for the response Steve! Yes there have been a few nights that got down into 50's and the start is the same as when the cold start is done on a warmer day.

    I have checked the y-connector and it looks like the previous owner put new contacts (the look "new and shiny" compared to the other connectors more ash or silver looking) on the pumps and the radiator fan circuits. There is some browning of the white connectors but no black or fully melted situation.
     
  8. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    25,150
    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
    Full Name:
    Steve Magnusson
    #8 Steve Magnusson, Mar 22, 2022
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2022
    The TTS should close, and the cold start injectors squirt, on the first start attempt after a night in the 50's -- try the test light test after those same conditions to see if you need to dig deeper into the TTS system, or not.

    Not a bad thing that the female terminals for the fuel pumps have been replaced, but the male tab can also get badly oxidized -- so wouldn't hurt to "clean" them (with maybe some DeoxIT). Long-term, you'll have the same failure so you'll probably have to do something more significant eventually. Also, have a look at (and keep an eye on) the water fan motor connections in the j connector and the AC system connection in the k connector.
     
  9. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    25,150
    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
    Full Name:
    Steve Magnusson
  10. deuce49

    deuce49 Karting

    Sep 25, 2011
    131
    Scottsdale
    Full Name:
    BC
    Thank you, will do! I did notice a small amount of fuel residue (dried) a minimal weep, not dripping or anything obvious out of the flat head screw area on the back of the fuel accumulators.

    Wiped them clean last night, drove the car today and just checked them both and rubbed with a white paper towel and had the slightest residue again.
     
  11. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

    Apr 6, 2008
    8,934
    southwest germany and thailand
    Full Name:
    romano schwabel
    up to ten seconds starting should never be a problem for the starter

    as you write there is a little fuel at the back of the fuel accumulators. so next time before you start the engine try to only switch on the ignition. then the fuel pumps will run a short time. do this 3 times and then start. so you see if the problem is gone or not and can go on further.
     

Share This Page