Crappy Replicas thread

its still a ferrari.
not as it came out of the factory, but it still possesses the identity of a ferrari.

how do you know it wasnt based on a crashed car that would have been written off otherwise?

the difference is that that is identified by law as a real ferrari.

 

And how it left the factory OR styling house is what is important. NOT what PSk (for example) made it in to.

A classic car is interesting to us because of atleast a couple of things:
- It was made by a particular company like that ... how cool and original.
- It has great racing history, or even otherwise interesting history.

By using an original Ferrari to create that piece of **** (my opinion) you have removed much of its value of interest to us enthusiasts. You also have removed an original model that somebody else might have wanted to restore.

Been there and discussed that before. What is wrecked to one person is a restoration project to another ...

Yes I fully understand that ... and hence why these @rseholes keep on destroying these lovely old and interesting 2+2 Ferraris.

In the end doesn't that just show how shallow the person that made the replica is ... ie. wants to drive around in something that looks like a 250GTO Ferrari, but is so insecure he/she thinks the fact that it is based on a real Ferrari is somehow going to make the classic car world allow them in ... er, not this one

Anyway 'nuff said, I have said my opinion all before ... it is just sad and NOT done for driving enjoyment, but simply for the potential money made. These cars never stay with the person that makes them, it is just the same as bogging up a car and painting it resale red to increase the sales price.

Do a search on the companies that make these cars ... they could not give a flying fnck about the classic car world and what they are destroying, all they are interested in is keeping their business afloat ... they don't even drive them afterwards.

Also do a search and find how many of these cars are for sale, with bugger all miles since the conversion was down ... ie. nobody wants to own them, they just again want to make the bucks out of them. It is a left over from the terrible '80s where many cars were destroyed on the wave of the great money making scheme of classic cars.

Pete

 

yes this is true, but do u agree that if a car is valued at £50,000 and its seriously damaged in an accident causing it to need repairs to the value of £75,000 then no one will likely follow through with the repairs?


Under these circumstances then is there any harm in rebuilding the car to gto specs?


I do agree that unless the circumstances are exceptional (similar to what ive stated above for example) then the car should most definitely NOT be changed

 

Hmmm, restoring a car as a hoby is never a financially sensible thing to do. I am restoring a 1750 GTV Alfa Romeo and it really was just scrap metal ... but not to me.

Thus somebody like me, who does not have the funds to buy a nice old 60's Ferrari, has the only path left to them to buy a wreck and over many years restore it with their own blood, sweat and tears.

Problem is these replica companies get to the cars first ... because it is just an investment to them. These replica companies also push the price up of spare parts too and make it harder for many to keep their original Ferrari engines running, etc.

In the end my opinion does not matter, just the owner's matters.

Pete

 

its an emotive subject thats for sure,

and whilst i wouldnt condone anyone doing this today (except maybe with a completely totalled car) i do feel that whats done is done.

 

im gonna regret playing devils advocate like this im sure.

in another thread u say

and this too

oh and this as well

the owner of the car i posted could say the same then yes?

 

No not at all, and I'll explain why. This is a great example .

Thus in this case, because Jim cannot locate the original body he HAS to rebody it. But he has NOT converted the car into something it wasn't ... ie. a 250GTE into a 250GTO. He has chosen to rebody it as a P4 ... when he should have rebodied it as a P3/4 Spyder to some, but these sort of race cars wore their bodywork like we wear underpants ... they get changed when they get damaged D).

250GTE's do not get rebodied into GTO's everytime they get damaged, they get repaired as GTE's.

Arh, yes thus the 250GTO replica in question will always remain that same car and the continuous history will note that it has received a major bit or work to make it into a GTO from a GTE.

But in this case the modification was unnecessary IMO. The (serious) racing career of that car (if ever raced) was way finished and thus the modification to a GTO was not to keep the car at the front of the grid and winning races ... just to copy something.

I stand 100% by that comment. Thus the owner of the GTE wearing the GTO bodywork and rejigged chassis can still refer to it as the same car, or a GTO or a rebodied GTE ... whatever. But the fact of the matter, continuous history of that car will show all the modifications and the fact that it left the Ferrari factory as a GTE, was unnecessarily modified to a 250GTO in year X, etc.

Absolutely ... but the sad fact is the GTE bodywork and trim, etc. has been lost and what have we gained.

In Jim's #0846's case we have gained the very best we practically can to get #0846 rolling again. Jim could have made a brand new body to replicate #0846 as it was at Le Mans ... but he instead had a NOS body and thus IMO that rates higher than a brand new replica body.

In this GTE's case ... we simply have lost an original car to yet another clone. A body that was built by nobody special. Even if it was Scagletti that made the body he did not make the body for the right and valid reasons ... ie. the original was some how destroyed and the car needed to be repaired, OR performance mod was required to win races when it counted, in the 60's.

Thus remove the not special bits and what have we left: Now just a chassis and running gear. Body and trim permanently lost ... thus this Ferrari has just got closer to the rubbish dump.

Pete

 

what does NOS mean?

 

New Old Stock.

Thus Jim's P4 body was apparently made as a spare for the works team back when these cars raced in anger. Thus probably part of the same batch all the P4 bodies.

That is heaps more interesting/genuine than a NEW replica body made by New York panel beater Mr X.

Pete

 

id happily own the car i posted up.

i. id consider it a ferrari (and it would be legally registered as such too)
ii. if asked id tell the truth, its a gte rebuilt into a total nut an bolt recreation of a gto.
iii. id be proud to won it
iv. i wouldnt contemplate doing it to another gte unless it were virtually just an engine, a few scraps of frame and a chassis plate.
v. its the only way a mere mortal (albeit a fairly well off one) is ever going to get to drive a gto. (yes i know its not a real one, but it will look and feel identical)

 

cheers

and yes agreed it is more interesting

 

oh dear...

http://www.mx5z3.com

werds escape me...

 

Why? When a real Z3 is worth less then a Miata?

 

it's always been my dream to buy a ferrari, and make it into an MR2 replica.

 

I hope I don't catch too much flak for bumping this since the last post occured just three days ago...

Lots of name-calling and not a whole lot of discussion going on here. After all this do we even have a definition of what constitutes a "replica"? Let's talk muscle, I'll let the Ferrari/Lambo owners/admirers duke out the "exotic" stuff.

What about the '71 Hemi 'Cuda convertible sans original engine that sells for 6 figures? Fender tag says it's a Hemi car but the engine serial doesn't match. Torch it?

What about the '71 Hemi 'Cuda replica selling for high-5 figures? Could be an original six cylinder or small block car, but not an original high performance car. Burn it as well?

A friend of mine in high school had a brother with a '70 Pontiac GTO with the "Judge" package. It was a real GTO, but not a real judge, and he would tell you that. Not only was the car badged falsely, it also had a Chevy 396 in place of the original Pontiac 400! Body from one manufacturer, faux trim level and engine from a different manufacturer. What do you do with THIS car?

What if you bought a '70 Road Runner and turned it into a Superbird replica? What if you turned your tri-five Chevy sedan into a convertible (at least one kit exists to do so)? Where do you draw the line?

 

As an addendum to the above post, I'm not trying to rekindle any flames here, I'm just wondering if what I see as the "board position" on replicas, rebodies and other assorted "monsters" is the same when we're not "in your back yard" so to speak. In other words, what do you do when it's not a Lambo or a Ferrari or Porsche? I think the examples I gave are right up there with the cars featured in the rest of this thread.

 

well, to leave judgement of performance and historic significance aside, i think the big anti-replica crowd thing is about trying to combat a world that is becoming more fake than real.

there's some fantastic songs from the 80's that i absolutely love. every few weeks we hear a new song that is a remake of an old one. people who have never heard it, or never much attuned to it originally, will happily bop away to it thinking it's great. other's who adored the song originally, are supremely critical, and rightly so. it's somebody else singing the song of someone who really meant it, and we really felt it, the first time.

to tell you the truth... i enjoyed the movie "Clueless" back in the 90's. then i saw the movie "Emma" (based on the original story) and was REALLY annoyed that Clueless managed to get through to us all without so much as a sideways acknowledgement to the material which was being stolen.

it's about credit where it's due. a ferrari replica done to the nth degree surely is a piece of art. but don't expect to walk into your local art gallery and see photocopies of "The Scream" hanging on the wall purporting to be the original, even though a casual observer couldn't tell the difference.

credit where it's due.

 

Heck no. Its a real car with the wrong motor. It should sell for less than an all matching numbers machine.

No you don't burn the car. The key here is intent. Is this vehicle being represented as authentic, Hemi from the factory? If so then BURN the SELLER . If it is being represented as a clone, then no harm no foul. Especially since it is selling at a discount from original cars.

Buy it if you like it The wrong motor doesn't make a car a fake, it just makes it non original and probably less desireable. In the world of Shelby Mustangs, we call these cars clones. They look just like the real thing but aren't. The sin occurs when the car is misrepresented.

What if you bought a '70 Road Runner and turned it into a Superbird replica? What if you turned your tri-five Chevy sedan into a convertible (at least one kit exists to do so)? Where do you draw the line?[/QUOTE]

Do you think there is something wrong with doing these things?

Erich

 

I personally don't think there's anything wrong with building/buying those cars, as long as they're presented as such. My question is, where do you draw the line and start saying "no you can't build that car"?

 

What I don't think get's considered in this discussion enough is the fact that everybody knows the kit-car industry exists. This changes everything.

Not 'some', but MOST people ask if my GTO replica is a "real one" so they know there's a good chance it's not. I think it's pretty up and up, we (kit-car owners) are just celebrating what you otherwise would never get to see in your home town. Making one is like creating a work of art. There's no deception, merely a celebration!

Wes

 

I go to a Shelby club meeting and there are 16 glass Cobras
4 GT350 clones, 2 real GT350's 1 real Cobra and my Sunbeam Tiger.

Nobody asks me if mine is real!

I enjoy getting a ride in my friends 427 powered replica, but I would not want to own one.
Because so many of the cars are not real, I get jaded and don't even look closely to see the real ones. On the other hand, the club is full of a bunch of great guys who enjoy cars, driving, cars, talking cars, wrenching cars etc.

Before I spent 30 to 40k on a Cobra kitcar, I would slide myself into the drivers seat of a Maserati Ghibli. But that's just me.

Erich

 

Ahhhh...Maserati. You're obviously a man of good breeding.

I came across this picture.

Can you tell me, is this a replica?
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

i would say it is.

 

I know, but isn't it hillarious!?!
I just busted out when I saw it.
Poor guy......

Wes

 

what would cause doubt?