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Doing 30K service for 348, should I replace Water Pump?

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by PassionIsFerrari, Jun 12, 2005.

  1. PassionIsFerrari

    PassionIsFerrari Formula 3

    Aug 15, 2004
    2,454
    I am going to do the 30k service for my 348 this summer. I am wonder about the water pumps. Are they strong on these cars. Mine works fine, but since I am going to have the engine out should I replace it...The reason I ask, there is a guy on Ebay that is selling them for $199 (after core charge)

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=4555264340&category=42606

    So what do you think. Would this be a good investment of $200 to ensure the proper performance of my car...or would it be a waste of $200 because the one I have to last a long time anyway...

    I guess what i am asking is

    Would this be a good preventative maintenance idea for $199 or would it be a waste of $200 bucks...

    Thanks
     
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  3. Llenroc

    Llenroc F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed Consultant

    Jun 9, 2004
    3,340
    Colorado
    Full Name:
    Vern
    Just passing along my experiance. I had 33000 miles on my 348 when I sold it and it still had the original pump. I change my coolant once a year and use water wetter also, this has to help preserve the seals. If you know the service history of your coolant that could help determine what you should do. Also do you have the original pump in car still? What mileage is on the existing pump? I was told at one time that if the cars were used on a regular basis the 348 pumps will last a long time. On the other hand for two hundred that is fairly cheap prevenitive maintanence, seems to reasonable to me. I think new ones are 1200. Hope that helps regards, Vern
     
  4. resnow

    resnow Formula Junior

    May 21, 2001
    652
    North Carolina
    Full Name:
    Bob Snow
    you have a PM
     
  5. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 19, 2001
    22,063
    The Brickyard
    Full Name:
    The Bad Guy
    It really depends on the condition of the bearings, and how many mile you have on the pump. I would look into getting a rebuild kit from the guy if he sells one. When I did my 30k I didn't do the water pump because the bearings were still good. I really depends on you. Most people change the pump because if it were to go bad after you did the major, you have to pull the engine again to change it. For me it isn't a big deal to pull the engine so I just left it. Oh yeah, and I don't have a lift to pull the engine. If it will make sleep better at night, then change it.
     
  6. No Doubt

    No Doubt Six Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant

    May 21, 2005
    67,323
    Vegas+Alabama
    Full Name:
    Mr. Sideways

    Yes. You've got three options:
    1. Factory original waterpump replacing your existing one,
    2. $200 rebuilt waterpump on eBay that uses better bearings and seals and has twice the warranty of the new Ferrari OEM replacement water pump, or
    3. For some extra $$$ you can buy a rebuilt waterpump from Durable1.com (that also has better bearings and seals than the OEM) that has been ported...freeing up some substantial horsepower...especially if you also go with an underdrive (i.e. oversized) pulley.

    So if you want some extra horsepower, pay the $$$ and reduce the drag on your engine via option 3 above. If you just want to insure that your waterpump doesn't freeze up and then break your timing belt (i.e. engine failure), then go with option 2. If you want safety *and* want to stay Original, then go with Option 1.

    You can't go wrong for $200, though.
     
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  8. Mike C

    Mike C F1 Veteran
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Aug 3, 2002
    6,075
    Southeast USA
    Full Name:
    Mike Charness
    I somehow doubt that it's "substantial". I think the porting may help push more water through, but I doubt it gains you even 1 or 2 hp, which is hardly substantial, but please give me dyno numbers if you have them... I'd like to be pleasantly surprised! I don't see any number from Matt (Kermit) on that at his site. I don't think that's the reason to do it... it's for the water flow improvement, which certainly would be a good thing in itself.
     
  9. No Doubt

    No Doubt Six Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant

    May 21, 2005
    67,323
    Vegas+Alabama
    Full Name:
    Mr. Sideways
    That *would* be interesting to know, specifically.

    What's our 348 waterpump doing, moving a bit more than 5 gallons of water/anti-freeze/water-wetter (8.3 pounds per gallon) for something like 42 pounds worth of total fluid, right? And this system itself is pressurized to a couple of atmospheres, I'd guess.

    So how many horses are tied up moving our water/anti-freeze? We certainly can't gain more horsepower than that, even if we remove the waterpump entirely!

    I'd swag that no more than 10 hp are tied up moving water, and you'd be hard-pressed to save 5 hp even with better bearings, porting, and an oversized (for an under-drive) pulley.

    No, a better way to think about it would be in torque, not hp. If you save 5 lb/feet of torque, then you free up horsepower gains from idle all the way up to Wide Open Throttle...that's more than 5 hp...because a "5 hp gain" might only happen at the very top of your rpm limit...whereas this would happen all through the entire rpm range.
     
  10. Markie1949

    Markie1949 Karting

    Apr 4, 2005
    82
    Utah
    At that price, I think it's a no brainer, replace it, and sleep better!!. I have a bill paid by the PO for over a grand for a new pump.
     
  11. Ricambi America

    Ricambi America F1 World Champ
    Sponsor Owner

    "Warranty" on a rebuilt pump is irrelevant when the cost of failure is actually the labor to pull the engine twice.
     
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  13. Dr Tommy Cosgrove

    Dr Tommy Cosgrove Three Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    May 4, 2001
    31,733
    Birmingham, AL
    Full Name:
    Tommy
    If the motor is out I would put a new one on. The WP was the first thing to go on my car the day after I bought it. On my 308 it's easy and cheap to R&R ( I did it). Not so on your car. Play it safe.
     
  14. Mike C

    Mike C F1 Veteran
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Aug 3, 2002
    6,075
    Southeast USA
    Full Name:
    Mike Charness
    I see you're in Alabama -- please check your Private Messages for one from me.
     
  15. ghardt

    ghardt Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 18, 2004
    1,256
    Texas
    Full Name:
    Jerry
    An experienced mechanic will check the condition of the bearing. If the bearing is good, there is little need to replace. While the pump is being inspected new seals can be installed. This is what my guy did.
     
  16. NYCFERRARIS

    NYCFERRARIS Formula Junior

    Mar 2, 2004
    999
    IT is the labor, the mechanic is already in there so they say replace it. My attitude was inspect and if it seems fine leave it alone and the OEM WP is very robust and I did not r/r at my 30K repair and the OEM has been just fine for a few years now. If you have weping or noise or something then that is another story. Preventative r/r of a good working well maintained WP I think is overkill and not that big a risk, I took a calculated chance and so far so good.
     

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