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Enzo Ferrari on the Jaguar E-Type

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by Smiles, Sep 24, 2018.

  1. Smiles

    Smiles Moderator
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    I've read multiple comments attributed to Enzo Ferrari concerning the Jaguar E-Type. They range from il Commendatore saying that the E-Type is the prettiest car ever, to him saying that the E-Type would put him out of business.

    My problem: I never heard these stories before the internet, and I'm inclined to think that they're acrophical.

    Does anyone have any further insight?

    Thanks!

    Matt
     
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  2. mcimino

    mcimino Formula 3
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  3. Smiles

    Smiles Moderator
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  4. Glassman

    Glassman F1 World Champ
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    If Enzo was looking at a Hardtop Roadster.............he was completely correct.
     
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  5. Bluebottle

    Bluebottle F1 Rookie
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    To have made the comment he did, he could only have been looking at a FHC!:D

    I rest my case:

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  6. Smiles

    Smiles Moderator
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    So...

    I've read through the Gino Rancati book. It's good. Not outstanding. Definitely a product of the time from a man who rubbed elbows with Enzo and wanted to capitalize on the fact.

    But I can find no mention of Jaguar at all

    If anything, Enzo Ferrari was completely distracted in 1961 -- the year of the E-Type debut -- by the exodus of eight of his top directors. He lost Chiti, Bizzarrini, Galassi, Della Casa, Giberti, Tavoni and two more that year alone.

    Chiti and Bizzarrini alone would be tragic losses. Imagine losing six more.

    Enzo wasn't worried or even thinking about the Jaguar E-Type.

    Matt
     
  7. Ferrari27

    Ferrari27 Formula Junior
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    There is an older thread on Ferrari Chat that sort of asks the same question:

    https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/enzo-ferrari-the-jaguar-e-type-is-the-most-beautiful-car.524310/

    The conversation goes off in all kinds of directions (of course) but there is a reference to a reference on Wikipedia (so it must be true) that dates back to a magazine article from 1964 (see post #5 in the older thread). I do not have a copy of Classic Car Review 1964 to see what the article says.

    I have every other year, just not '64.

    (That last bit is, of course, a lie and a :))
     
  8. Smiles

    Smiles Moderator
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    Thanks for that!

    I think it’s completely apocryphal. It never was said.

    And the 1964 article would have to have quoted its source. He wouldn’t have waited a few years to deliver that opinion. Or waited to deliver any opinion. He was Italian!

    Matt
     
  9. msdesignltd

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    Sorry
    He was referring to the OTS
     
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  10. torquespeak

    torquespeak Formula Junior
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    I am of precisely the same opinion - though open to seeing more evidence.

    What did you find on p.164 of the Rancati book? No reference to the E-type at all?

    -Ed
     
  11. Bluebottle

    Bluebottle F1 Rookie
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    No, definitely the FHC! :D

    If he didn't actually say it, I am sure he must have thought it! :D
     
  12. Smiles

    Smiles Moderator
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    I don't think so. I need to find the book again!

    As I remember that part of the book was covering 1964.

    Matt
     
  13. Jack-the-lad

    Jack-the-lad Three Time F1 World Champ
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    How can one be sure that someone else did not say something, unless that person denies having said it?

    It seems out of character for Ferrari to have made such a statement, but it's certainly possible that he did.
     
  14. Smiles

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    You can't absolutely prove Enzo didn't say it, but all the evidence points towards an anachronistic false attribution.

    Matt
     
  15. mcimino

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    #15 mcimino, Dec 2, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2018
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  16. Smiles

    Smiles Moderator
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    To me it matters. The Jaguar E-Type is undeniably gorgeous.

    But to perpetuate a falsely attributed anything is unacceptable to me.

    Matt
     
  17. torquespeak

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    Ah, perhaps the 'p.164' mention here was referring to the 2017 magazine.
    https://forums.jag-lovers.com/t/that-ferrari-quote/354309

    In any case, the comments there state that the following is in the book: "Quando esce la Jaguar E-Type cabriolet mi dice che la considera la più bella automobile del mondo".

    -Ed
     
  18. Smiles

    Smiles Moderator
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    But it isn’t.

    Matt
     
  19. Glassman

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    So I guess it was a hardtop roadster then........right?
     
  20. torquespeak

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    Thanks for clarifying, Matt. I considered getting a copy, but it's more the time it'll take to reach me rather than the ~£25 it'll cost. I'm going to take your word for it!

    I wonder what the Jaguar forum guy was on about then. Perhaps that's what the 2017 magazine article *said* that the book had stated. Very odd.

    -Ed
     
  21. open roads

    open roads F1 Rookie

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    This probably isn't going anywhere. It may be what was once called a wild goose chase. It's easy for me to say this now. As early results have thus far been inconclusive. The effort to find documentation is commendable And the effort to find the truth is not bad in and of itself. But just may not be possible.

    Everything said or printed on the Internet is true. Or is it? ... And everything printed in the "old" press was true too. Or was it?

    I too like to know the truth. And I abhor revisionist history. And I also don't like constructive history. Probably many here share these sentiments.

    We each determine what we believe and what we don't. While admittedly not being able to prove or disprove our personal beliefs about this matter either way.

    I like to consider it this way. And I will ask that you briefly join with me in this consideration. Simply entertain the idea with me.

    The Jaguar XKE was a stunning car. At it's debut, people were shocked by it's beauty. Also it's performance and price. The public reception has adequately been recorded in reports. And just look at the expressions of people in photographs. The photos that I have seen of that time, were of people who were shocked. Or stunned. ....... And I believe that there was an acclamation. That this was a most wonderful expression of man's ability to create beauty in an automotive art form.

    At such a time. And in such a place. In all probability, in the presence of many, many people who may have been expressing themselves thus. They may have been saying that this was the most beautiful car they had ever seen. ... I believe that in such a place and time, it is entirely possible that Enzo may have spoken in concurrence with what was probably spoken by just about everyone there. ...... And is still heard today.

    I personally believe that it was probable. Not just possible. And that the story could be told by one to another. From one day to the next. And one year to the next. ... All the while being true. And unrecorded. ... And thereby may thwart modern historians efforts to document the truth. Had it happened this way.

    Regardless. The XKE's success is a matter of historical record. It's beauty. Found in the eye of the beholder. And one day, many years ago. The beholder was Enzo.
     
  22. Smiles

    Smiles Moderator
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    Well said.

    Unfortunately the story only surfaced relatively recently.

    Matt
     
  23. Bluebottle

    Bluebottle F1 Rookie
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    Really? I am sure I recall hearing this over many years, in various forms - the most beautiful car ever built, the car I wish I had made, etc., etc.
     
  24. Smiles

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    Google search any way you like. The earliest I can find for Enzo, Jaguar and "la più bella autovettura del mondo" is 2011.

    It gained much more traction in 2015, and again in 2017.

    Matt
     
  25. torquespeak

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    Matt, can you flick ahead and back a few pages each way in your book? Is there absolutely no mention of 'Jaguar' and/or 'E-type' in the Italian text?

    I'm getting a hit via Google Books for 'Enzo Ferrari' and 'E-Type' in English translation of the Rancati book published by Haynes in 1989. It's showing the right preview to see that particular text, but this 1989 archive copy of Motor Sport magazine backs up the fact that Rancati definitely claimed it in the late 1980s (though still nothing but his assertion that it happened):
    https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/archive/article/march-1989/54/enzo-ferrari-man

    What I'm getting at is: if there is 100% no reference to it in that chapter of the Italian (original) text, and yet it made its way into the English translation 12 years later... ;)

    -Ed
     

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