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F1 = Cambiocorsa?

Discussion in '360/430' started by propaganda, Jan 6, 2004.

  1. propaganda

    propaganda Rookie

    Oct 1, 2003
    25
    Is the Ferrari F1 or F1A gearbox the same as the Maserati Cambiocorsa system? If not then what are the differences - is it just software?
     
  2. jack

    jack Karting

    Nov 1, 2003
    244
    Switzerland
    Full Name:
    Lionel
    They are almost the same gearbox. Almost because they each year Ferrari and Maserati improve their gearboxes (hard & soft). They made 3 software updates on mine ! Probably the best models are actually on the 360 CS, Enzo and QuattroPorte (and I'm sure they share the main components but they are slightly different).

    But basically they are the same.

    Lionel
     
  3. propaganda

    propaganda Rookie

    Oct 1, 2003
    25
    Does that mean that software/performance improvements on one gearbox i.e. the new F1A on the 612 will filter down to the other models?
     
  4. Willis360

    Willis360 F1 Rookie

    Aug 4, 2001
    3,928
    Redmond, WA
    Full Name:
    Willis H
    To be precise, F1 is not a gearbox. It's the system that's connected to it. Gearbox is the same as the manual shifting one. Cambiocorsa is pretty much the same as the F1.
     
  5. kizdan

    kizdan F1 Veteran

    Dec 31, 2003
    5,281
    USA
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    Dan
    The transmissions are the same, except you pay around a $10k premium to have it on a Ferrari, and less than a $4k premium to have it on a Maserati.

    The transmissions in both the Enzo and the Stradale have a "Race" mode, which gives you ridiculously fast shifts. Aside from those 2 cars, the best application of this transmission is easily on the 575M.
     
  6. propaganda

    propaganda Rookie

    Oct 1, 2003
    25
    I felt that the cambio box on the maserati coupe (04) is still not too great in lower gears i.e. going from 1st to 2nd, the shift occasionally thuds and is far from smooth. Is this behaviour found on all the F1 shifts or is it being slowly improved. Gear shifts in the upper ranges are excellent. I suppose I hope that any improvements on the F1A gearbox will find their way into other F1 type shifts in the Ferrari/Maserati stable.
     
  7. kizdan

    kizdan F1 Veteran

    Dec 31, 2003
    5,281
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    Dan
    These "thuds" that you describe do not exist on the 575M, my guess is due to the massive amount of torque.

    As for the 8-cylinders, it will shift as aggressively as your throttle inputs are. If you shift at 2-3000 RPM, the shift will be quite smooth. Over time, you can develop some technique when driving with these transmissions. It is very common, and also habit, to lift off of the gas when shifting - a huge "no-no" with an F1.
     
  8. thomas_b

    thomas_b Formula Junior

    Sep 15, 2003
    765
    yes - you have to differentiate between the gearbox and the electro-hydraulic actuator system together with the automatic clutch activation mechanism. The 360 gearbox for example is the same in the manual and semi-automatic (F1), however the F1 actuator system replaces the stick (plus connection mechanics) and clutch pedal in the semi-automatic version.

    The F1 system is also known as Magneti Marelli Selespeed. It was developed in conjunction by Ferrari and Magneti-Marelli. The heart of the system is a complex computer (ECU) with serious processing power and its own real-time operating system, software abstraction layer and drivers for sensors and actuators. You can find a picture of the ECU at http://www.marelliusa.com/pcu.html.

    Magneti-Marelli distributes the technology to other car manufacturers such as Fiat’s own Alpha Romeo's and ironically to Lamborghini as it is the base for the Gallardo semi-automatic box. Keep in mind that this is only the ECU and the electro-hydraulic mechanism 

    The system program is pretty complex taking in multiple sensor signals and actually has to perform shifts similar to a manual operation (forward/backward + left/right) as well as open/close the clutch in a controlled way. It also interacts with the engine ECUs to control torque produced.

    So the gearboxes are usually different. The Magneti-Marelli Selespeed mechanism will be the same or very similar. However the software program that operates the gearbox will be different and that is what makes the semi-automatic gearbox tick.

    Note aside, the CS and Enzo use the same gearbox actuator mechanism (not surprisingly by now) and I would assume that they share major programming parts Sport/Race mode and Launch Control (in fact I have been told that they are the same but missing validation).
     
  9. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Three Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 28, 2003
    38,914
    Texas!
    Kizdan, I'm curious about this remark. My 550 has so much torque that even a shift kinda works like an auto, i.e., you can pretty much drive it around town in 3rd or 4th without a problem. Is the F1 really needed on a 575?

    Thx, DrTax
     
  10. kizdan

    kizdan F1 Veteran

    Dec 31, 2003
    5,281
    USA
    Full Name:
    Dan
    The F1 really shines when you are downshifting (you can hear the computer blipping the throttle to match the RPMs to the gear - incredible!). Yes, you can leave a 550 in 3rd or 4th while driving around town, but when you want to pass someone in a hurry, there's no comparison to an F1, it is just so much easier with the F1.

    I'll tell you something though, I'd have a really tough time choosing between the 2 transmissions myself. You really can't go wrong with either.

    If you were able to get an F1 on your 550, would you have when you bought it?
     
  11. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Three Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 28, 2003
    38,914
    Texas!
    Probably not. A lot of the fun in driving the 550 is making smooth shifts. (Although, to be frank, I always go from 1st to 3rd on upshifts. 1st to 2nd is too abrupt.)

    My business partner has a 360 with the F1. Now, that car was made for paddle shifting. Indeed, everytime I talk to folks who have tracked their car, they rave about the F1. They say it turns driving into a hot video game, whap, whap, whap.

    The 550, however, is a GT road car. While you can track it, and a better driver than I could probably lap faster than most people can in a 360, it is a long-legged animal that begs for the open road.

    I'm curious. Do you know anything about the mix of 575s sold with F1 versus stick?

    thx
     
  12. shelbee

    shelbee Guest

    The difference:

    Ferrari's F1 feels real and Cambiocorsa on maserati feels like "plastic toy"
     
  13. kizdan

    kizdan F1 Veteran

    Dec 31, 2003
    5,281
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    Dan
    I'd guess 95% with the F1, 5% with a stick.
     
  14. propaganda

    propaganda Rookie

    Oct 1, 2003
    25
    tried shifting from 1st to 3rd - this works amazingly well! very smooth by comparison to 1-2-3 in fact this seems too good to be true. Why can't the software do this automatically?

    Are there any down sides to using this technique?
     

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