F430 6 speed and the 458

Most dealers acknowledge that the 6 speed manuals are rarer and in higher demand. I took my car to classic coach the other day for some service and the manager told me that a customer saw my manual trans and wanted to know if I was interested in selling. I have often thought about upgrading to the 458 however I can't get myself to sell my 430 manual. I love the sense of control I get when I drive the car... and I don't drive it often enough to say I am tired of shifting. I think if I ever decide to buy another ferrari it will have to be added to the stable and the 430 manual stays!!!

 

+1

 

Sorry, dead wrong. The manual has been dying for a long, long time. It's the new (young) drivers who don't want them. The Playstation generation thinks the manual is as useful as an ashtray on a motorcycle.

Ask yourself this... 10 years from now, will anyone want a manual Ferrari if it's the very first manual they have ever seen? Would you spend a lot of money on a supercar that you don't know how to drive? Do you really want to learn to drive a manual on an expensive to repair exotic?

Unlikely.

 

I think that's right. I should modify my statement above to say that there will always be a market for 3 pedal cars so long as the current older generations are still around. Beyond that... well, ....

 

There's still a brisk market for 70+ year-old cars such as Bugattis and Alfas. Shifting may become a lost art, but the market for manual-transmission Ferraris will always be there. It won't be a mass market, but then, when was the last time you saw a Mercedes-Benz 540K in a mall parking lot? Fred

 

+1 on this.

And, if we've got a sequential box, how about adding the actuators to the clutch and box and giving the driver 3 pedals, a stick, and paddles?

 

There will be a market for manual transmission Ferraris. The manual transmission is a long enjoyed fixture in automotive history, especially in sports cars. When it's no longer available, people will want it again, just like everything else they once liked and can no longer get (not everyone, but plenty). That's human nature.

 

The Malaysian dealer recently confirmed that I have the only 6speed in the whole country (and there are a ton of F430s here, including a few 16Ms!)

When i called to inquire on my car (which had its cracked windshield replaced - yes, the drama doesn't seem to end), the guy goes, "Oh ya, you're the one with the manual 430." In fact, when I first pulled up, it was somewhat of a novelty with a few guys coming out to look at what the gated shifter looks like in-person.

So at least I know that in the case of supply vs. demand, I may have the upper hand locally - of course, given the prevalence of the F1 here, demand could be zero!

 

+1 Does anyone remember the "convertible to end all convertibles," the 1976 Cadillac Eldorado? Fred

 

Driving a stick shift is all a part of the experience of driving a car, and driving a ferrari is largely about the experience. By this logic, no one would want an original GTO or California, well since the current GTO and California accelerate faster and handle/brake better so who would want one of those old things with a (gated) manual!

Actually, at least by me (NJ), a lot of kids who are into cars opt for the stick shift. Many of them I've met at local meets prefer and have late model stickshift hondas, mustangs and Subies, etc...

 

The manual is going nowhere. If it would have died.. it would have died quite some time ago. It's kind like Apple isn't it...

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/driveon/post/2012/04/stick-shift-manual-transmission-ford-focus-surprise-more-interest-------/1

according to this.. 75% of european light vehicles are manual..
http://www.dctfacts.com/archive/2008/why-dual-clutch-technology-big-business.aspx

 

You guys are dreaming. I sold my F430 6 speed car pristine in every way for lot lower than what most people think it would sell here. Market doesn't care if its 6 speed , its still trades for lower than F1.

Buy a 6 speed car if you like driving 6 speed not because it will hold value better. They all follow the same depreciation curve.

 

In the long run, just because there are so few, I think 430 manuals wil fare a little better than the F1 cars. But neither car will hold value well because there are just too many 430s out there. I agree with vf430 - buy you car you want and do what you're supposed to do with a Ferrari - drive it and enjoy it.

 

I think its a mixture of both. My father has a F430 6-speed and is getting tired of it (I don't see how anyone could) but he will move into a 458 or 599 with F1 next.

 

I AM the playstation generation. Anyone growing up with me who liked cars is a hard core manual fanatic. We hate f1 and paddle shifts. I love my manual 360 it's amazing and i love the metallic clink of the gear change. I agree it's the older generation that has the money but not the drive to push for a manual. Everyone i know who's older says rowing the gears and clutching with their foot is too hard for them now so despite loving manuals they are choosing what's easier for them.

 

I have 18 and 19 year old daughters - the younger one chose a 6 spd manual Mazda3 as her first car, both drive them well. Among the large group of friends they have, there is plenty of interest in manual cars, especially the car enthusiast boys. Car enthusiasts who have Ferraris very often have other performance cars, it would be very surprising that manual cars are not among them. So the idea that someone moves into the Ferrari enthusiast demographic (middle age) never having encountered a manual car is unlikely.

In any case, these kids won't be spec'ing new Ferrari cars for decades on average. The only thing driving Ferrari's move to paddles is the preference of the wealthy middle aged group that buys them, by the time the Playstation gen gets there, the point will be mute.

 

I have an '08 430 red/cuoio 6-spd manual coupe with less than 3500 miles. I'm the original owner and if decided to sell it today I wouldn't take anything less than $200K. Now it may take a long, long time to sell, if it ever does, but that's okay with me. I have to see the 458 refresh in the new few years to see whether it would be worth putting my car up for sale. I could see this car being my first and last Ferrari as after over four years of ownership I still enjoy driving it. And as Dave said, alias Hardtop, I've never wished that it had more power, better looks, better handling or a more aggressive exhaust sound while owning it. Perhaps the 430 is just good enough for me.

 

Whether you prefer a stick or the F1 transmission, I think the argument can be made that the 360 and F430, when equipped with a manual transmission, are a kind of bridge between the older, less powerful Ferraris (like the 308 series) and the newer, supercar-grade Ferraris, like the 458 and its progeny yet to come. The 360 and F430 have some of the "attitude" and modernity of the 458, but the stick ties them to the tradition of the Ferrari with the gated shifter. Regardless of future gearbox preferences (most likely for paddle shifters, but perhaps something as yet unimagined), the manual-shift experience in a modern Ferrari is something not to be missed. Fred

 

Actually right now, manual shift F430s are going for the same as F1s, on average. This means that they are actually commanding a premium.

In any event, no one buys a manual shift FCar to "make money." They will buy one because they will get satisfaction from driving it. We are fortunate enough to have both a 458 and a manual shift F430. They are both wonderful in different ways. There is no doubt that the 458 is quicker and overall more capable; it is a product of the digital age; and the technology will make you seem like a better driver. The F430 is analog, an authentic sports car (even the exhaust sounds more authentic), and nothing is quite like the satisfaction of running through the gates -- up and down. The box is so bullet proof that it is hard to defeat.

 

Yep I have the 6 speed gated and I love how "arcane" she feels compared to my 599... Yes the 599 has break your back speed and amazing shift points but the analog versus digital analogy is spot on, as some say much more profound in the 458. Good or bad there will never be a 6 speed product like the F430, the last of a generation and nicely done. Appreciation probably not but I bet I can unload my 6 speed way faster than an F1 if sitting side by side.

 

I have to agree with g4 titan that the 430 will probably not appreciate however I do think that they will be more desirable and probably hold their value slightly better than the f1 trans 430.

 

What I'd like to know is if the 458 can back up a hill without smoking the clutch!

 

With respect to those with contradictory opinions, I bought my 430 6 speed this summer and got a great deal because it did not sell for a while. Clean PPI no stories, etc. As far as I know it was the only black black six speed coupe on sale this spring/summer. This lag was despite the accepted dogma that the six soeed 430 is the most bullet proof modern Ferrari made.

I bought it because I wanted the rifle barrel gated shifter from my youth ( my fathers old Ferraris) and I enjoy it. That said it is a different experience than a Porsche Manual shifter which is more like a Honda these days. Smooth, short and easy vs finicky, loud, and long throws.

I expect that in the end, the six speed will be a liability not an asset when it comes to selling and not help price or speed of sale. Even when the prices hit the 80-90 k range.

Scott

 

Why do people collect mechanically inferior cars from the 1930's ? Ten years from now, you will still be able to find a manual, on most compacts and economy cars.

No doubt, most buyers of new F cars are old men.

 

if you consider the price point, that's your answer. older people are the only ones for the most part who can spend 70+ thousand on a toy car. IMO that's the only reason the 6 speed might take longer to buy. Ferrari is so good at telling it's customers what they should like if they came out and went back to manual transmissions no one would argue.