Buy

Ferrari 365 GTC\4 engine

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by Bowzer, Dec 29, 2021.

  1. Bowzer

    Bowzer Formula Junior

    Aug 3, 2016
    311
    MALTA
    Full Name:
    Marcus
    Hello all ,
    Is there a notable visible difference between the engine of the Ferrari 365 GTC\4 and that of the Ferrari 365GT4 2+2 ?
    If yes, is it identifiable by the normal enthusiast , or is it something difficult to point out ?
    Thank you
     
  2. To remove this ad click here.

  3. BMWairhead

    BMWairhead Formula Junior

    Sep 11, 2009
    979
    Portland, OR
    Full Name:
    Ted
    The side draft carbs quickly ID the GTC/4 engine.
     
  4. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran

    Nov 19, 2008
    8,277
    Cardiff, UK
    Full Name:
    Steven Robertson
    ..and the 365 GT4 2+2.
     
    Smiles likes this.
  5. Bowzer

    Bowzer Formula Junior

    Aug 3, 2016
    311
    MALTA
    Full Name:
    Marcus
    In what way ?
     
  6. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran

    Nov 19, 2008
    8,277
    Cardiff, UK
    Full Name:
    Steven Robertson
    Engine same tipo F 101 AC 000. Said to be single rear mounted coil and distributor system on European 365 GTC/4 and twin system on US 365 GTC/4 and twin system on all 365 GT4 2+2.
     
  7. To remove this ad click here.

  8. DWR46

    DWR46 Formula 3
    Honorary

    Jun 19, 2012
    1,482
    Steve is correct.
     
  9. Bowzer

    Bowzer Formula Junior

    Aug 3, 2016
    311
    MALTA
    Full Name:
    Marcus
    Thank you , that seems easy to see the difference.
    On another note , can a 365GT4 2+2 engine be modified to work with one distributer ?
     
  10. DWR46

    DWR46 Formula 3
    Honorary

    Jun 19, 2012
    1,482
    Marcus: Yes, if you have the parts.
     
  11. Bowzer

    Bowzer Formula Junior

    Aug 3, 2016
    311
    MALTA
    Full Name:
    Marcus
    Thank you
    By parts you mean only the specific Webers , only?
     
  12. To remove this ad click here.

  13. DWR46

    DWR46 Formula 3
    Honorary

    Jun 19, 2012
    1,482
    To convert from one to two distributors (or vice versa), you need ignition parts, not carburetors.
     
    miurasv and turbo-joe like this.
  14. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran

    Nov 19, 2008
    8,277
    Cardiff, UK
    Full Name:
    Steven Robertson
    #11 miurasv, Dec 29, 2021
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2021
    See link here and scroll down the page for both US twin distributor and Euro single distributor 365 GTC/4 engines.

    @Bowzer To best help you, may we ask the reason for your question regarding the visible differences between the 365 GTC/4 and 365 GT4 2+2 engines?
     
  15. Bowzer

    Bowzer Formula Junior

    Aug 3, 2016
    311
    MALTA
    Full Name:
    Marcus
    The reason I ask is , if you are checking a GTC4 for possible purchase, There is always the doubt that the engine can be from a GT4 2+2. If you had that doubt, apart from the engine number stamp, what would be the determining factor that the engine is of the original GTC\4 rather than what could be from a GT4 2+2 car.
     
  16. Ak Jim

    Ak Jim F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Dec 23, 2007
    6,178
    North Pole AK
    Maybe look at the adjustment for timing chain tension?
     
    Bowzer likes this.
  17. Bowzer

    Bowzer Formula Junior

    Aug 3, 2016
    311
    MALTA
    Full Name:
    Marcus
    You mean the tensioner, from outside ? Are they different ?
     
  18. Wheels1

    Wheels1 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Oct 23, 2007
    3,157
    UK
    Full Name:
    Grant
    Ask the seller to get a Massini report on the car, or ask Marcel Massini for one yourself. Its always a good thing to have if you ever sell the car.
    https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/what-does-a-marcel-massini-report-convey.638493/
     
    readplays likes this.
  19. Ak Jim

    Ak Jim F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Dec 23, 2007
    6,178
    North Pole AK
    Not going to claim to be an expert but from my understanding all 365GT4 2+2 have a manual adjustment. There is a black headless bolt that you use an Allen wrench to turn after loosing the locking nut. The GTC/4 initially had an automatic type system but I think that at some point they switched over to the manual adjustment. Maybe some of the more knowledgeable people can help clarify.
     
  20. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran

    Nov 19, 2008
    8,277
    Cardiff, UK
    Full Name:
    Steven Robertson
    #17 miurasv, Dec 30, 2021
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2021
    @Bowzer There are no short cuts when considering buying a classic Ferrari, with much more to look into than whether or not the engine is the correct/original one. You need someone experienced and knowledgeable to look into the whole car, which you can not do on the cheap, and would be a very false economy.
     
  21. Bowzer

    Bowzer Formula Junior

    Aug 3, 2016
    311
    MALTA
    Full Name:
    Marcus
    Steven, I have already done that and more, believe me. This is that last hurdle which has been a niggling doubt all along. It is incredible how every body thinks , just because I am maybe more careful than others, that I do things on the cheap.
     
  22. Bowzer

    Bowzer Formula Junior

    Aug 3, 2016
    311
    MALTA
    Full Name:
    Marcus
    Seller does not have a Massini report and will not get one. On the other hand, I will not get a Massini report unless I am 99% sure that I will buy the car. What is the point in buying the Massini report before purchasing the car, and due to the report you do not buy the car?
     
  23. gcalex

    gcalex Formula Junior
    Rossa Subscribed

    Aug 16, 2010
    315
    Mostly New Hampshire USA
    Full Name:
    Alex
    While I can understand not wanting to go through expenses until a car seemed like a good prospect, I don’t think that personally I could be 99% sure about a car, without first knowing whether the engine and trans were original to it. Unless, of course, the price were so low that it did not matter (in which case, well, it does not matter).

    Also, “risk” expenses are part of this sort of purchase. For example, pre-purchase inspections can be pretty pricey, and in my many years of searching for cars (even as expensive as Daytonas), it was the *very* rare seller that had a decent PPI in hand; i.e., that expense always seemed to be “on me”... :)
     
  24. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran

    Nov 19, 2008
    8,277
    Cardiff, UK
    Full Name:
    Steven Robertson
    #21 miurasv, Dec 31, 2021
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2021
    You have things the wrong way around. You get a Massini Report and Mechanical Inspection to find out everything there is to know about the car before you are 99% sure you are going to buy the car, not after, so that any negative information can be found. Invariably the costs of the Report and Inspection pay for themselves in negotiating the price down/rectification of faults if they are found and/or negative information is found in the history. Or you dodge a bullet by them finding out the car is a bad one and not worth buying. The questions regarding the engine you had here would have already been covered. If the findings are all positive, the Report/Inspection may increase the value of the car when you come to sell it. Getting the Massini Report and Mechanical Inspection done afterwards defeats the object.

    No disrespect to you, I really do not mean to sound condescending, but not knowing that the Weber carburettors have nothing to do with the coils and distributors, that form parts of the ignition system, which was pointed out as a potential difference between a 365 GTC/4 engine and a 365 GT4 2+2 engine, means you need help in your Ferrari purchase.
     
    BMWairhead likes this.
  25. Bowzer

    Bowzer Formula Junior

    Aug 3, 2016
    311
    MALTA
    Full Name:
    Marcus
    Stephen, I have already paid for a pre- purchase inspection, driven the car. First you need to do these things to see if the car is at least close to the asking price.
    Negotiations have not started as yet . Many things are involved . Compression test, drive, ( 4 hr drive ) how is my feel of the car , quality of paint , interior , any missing pieces , parts , etc, etc , Engine number , Chassis number . All this against how the car was advertised. Now I had a niggling doubt about the possibility of a GT4 2+2 engine instead of a GTC4 engine , that is all.
     
    dino69 likes this.
  26. Bowzer

    Bowzer Formula Junior

    Aug 3, 2016
    311
    MALTA
    Full Name:
    Marcus
    I have already paid for a pre- purchase inspection, driven the car. First you need to do these things to see if the car is at least close to the asking price.
    Negotiations have not started as yet . Many things are involved . Compression test, drive, ( 4 hr drive ) how is my feel of the car , quality of paint , interior , any missing pieces , parts , etc, etc , Engine number , Chassis number . All this against how the car was advertised. Now I had a niggling doubt about the possibility of a GT4 2+2 engine instead of a GTC4 engine , that is all.
     
  27. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran

    Nov 19, 2008
    8,277
    Cardiff, UK
    Full Name:
    Steven Robertson
    #24 miurasv, Dec 31, 2021
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2021
    Excellent, well done. However, the same reasons you got the Mechanical Inspection/pre purchase inspection done before you purchase the car apply to having a Massini Report before, not least of which the correct engine numero interno may be found (if engine tipo F101 AC 000 have these or the later different engine to chassis number?), which may not be revealed by a pre - purchase inspection, potentially revealing an incorrect engine.
     
    Bowzer likes this.
  28. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    28,138
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    It seems to me if you have had a pre purchase inspection and that question was not answered you chose the wrong person to do it. I have been doing this a long time and I cannot imagine not providing a client that information and a lot more.
     
    turbo-joe, TTR, BMWairhead and 2 others like this.

Share This Page