Ferrari Enzo #399 of #399

I suspect it's nit picking but AFAIK the 599 GTO all wear a plate saying "1 of 599" with the same intended meaning as "599 limited production", unless I missed something (which certainly could happen).

 

The radio cover:


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Nitpicking indeed.........
Clearly not the same.
"1 of 599" is clear.
"599 limited production" means that an object is of limited production and by pure coincidence somebody added a number 599 to the same plaque. It means zero and leaves everything open to fantasy.

Marcel Massini

 

As Joe appears to have trouble grasping what has been written in recent days? (often by me it seems, as he thinks I am the confused one given his need to quote my own posts and then feel the need to add his own witty put down retorts at the end) so I thought it best for him to read his own words and interpretations again first and then respond to my questions at the end.

So Joe which actually is it? do you still proclaim it is a production car and the 399th one at that? or the 97th post production car based on all of the above?

As a marque specialist/broker surely you would have known all of this? so have you been pulling the wool over our eyes all along on this thread, and you actually told your client at the time all these facts and he still bought it via you anyway, or will it be news to him as well?

 

Thanks! That helps a lot.

So #399/399 in this thread is really #496 and #400 Pope Enzo is really #497. Better they be called second to last and last for accuracy rather than 399 and 400...

 

Correct, knowledge is received over time especially since this thread was started 7 years ago, and so far as you are open to receiving it and sharing it then all is good, the current owner loves his Enzo, regardless of wether it's "last of the official run of 399" is disputed or in fact revealed to be incorrect, as a dyed-in-the-wool Ferraristi, he understands how Ferrari SpA operates, and he didn't pay any more for it over a standard Enzo.

I understood that this is the last car of the original run in terms of build date (not chassis numbers), which we know are are not sequential.

139305 was completed 25 November 2004 with assembly number 56230, and 141920 was not completed till the following year @ 8 months later on 28 July 2005 with assembly number 59050, given that no cars were built after 139305 that 8 month period, it was understood that 139305 was the last production car.

Anyway, in this entire debate, it's worth recalling that the erstwhile editor of Road & Track magazine once said: "There are lies, damned lies, and then there are car manufacturer's statistics".

Rest assured, I do grasp what you are saying, I just don't worry too much about questioning Ferrari SpA's unique production accounting nor am I surprised if I find out later that there are more cars, and I apply this sentiment to all models and manufacturers, Lamborghini too for example. In summary, I do not have expectations that Ferrari's production statistics will appear logical, which to me, is not difficult to understand, that's what I mean when I say this.
No proverbial pulling of wool over eyes by myself whatsoever, I always pass on anything I learn to hear to the relevant party, and the owner of this Enzo having paid a standard price and having now bonded with the car, isn't too broken up about if it's proven that it wasn't the 399th Enzo actually built.
To answer your last question, I haven't really concluded anything different from my original understanding, I'd need to see documentation that helps me draw a definitive conclusion one way or another.

 

Not to add further confusion to the discussion, but, I believe Ferrari's Classiche Certification for 139305 states May 2005 as it's completion date.

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John imported 139305 into the USA, here he discusses how he established the car's 399/399 provenance before he started this thread 7 years ago, I later helped him sell the car to a USA buyer who still has it:

 

That is NOT the actual car completion date of 139305, it is the issue date of that particular certificate (paper). Not the same.
Just generally: Certificates of Origin are not issued automatically on the date when the (actual build of the) car is completed. I have seen CO dates up to 12 months later.
(Just remember that not too long ago brand new SF90's were sitting for many months at the factory prior to delivery, because of electric and battery issues).

Marcel Massini

 

I am really glad to hear that the current owner still loves this car regardless of the new facts they and other parties involved in its sale are only now aware of, rather than those under which it was sold to them at the time.

At the end of the day that is all that matters.

 

Got it, that's why I said I believe, I wasn't quite sure, we learn something new every day.

Indeed.

Ferrari SpA does not make it easy to track the cars and I think most seasoned Ferrari collectors understand that there is always new learned information wisdom incoming, we should all bear this in mind.

Short story: years ago Ron Tonkin sent his GTO to my record-breaking 288 GTO Reunion, he sent me the letter below for reference telling me not only was it the last one built, he believed that it was also the last one delivered. When I then told him it wasn't exactly the last one delivered and shared the Lauda car's 1986 delivery, you think that news dimmed his enthusiasm for his own GTO? Not a bit, he loved that car till the day he passed away.

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The myth of just 399 Enzo's has been well and truly busted now on this thread, thanks to Marcels facts, no doubt John has been reading it, so it would make sense for that you tube clip to be taken down by him to stop perpetuating the myth, and maybe issue an update one.

I imagine Ferrari boxed themselves into a corner by fitting that plaque at the start, then when demand later dictated nearly a 100 more cars were needed they could not publically announce such as this would upset the owners of already purchased examples. Things like the internet and forums were still in their infancy so collecting VIN numbers from around the world would have not been foreseen.

Talk of production and post production should also be dropped. Ferrari produced 496 Enzo's, the last being this example, then one special one after that.

 

I just watched this and searched out this thread.... what a crazy story!

The bureaucracy rules of customs and importing are insane.... not just for the USA, but world wide....

 

So this was an interesting thread as I almost bought an Enzo. Instead I bought a LaF, while I believe there are 499 excluding the Apertas and the XX versions. Resident experts, how many are there really? Thanks


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Lots more

 

LF over 610.
LFA over 240.
No XX included.

Marcel Massini

 

Disappointed to hear that, 610 rather than 499 excluding the xx. So that is 111 extra cars, maybe more. Now that they are public and we see a production badge being put in the 812c of 1 of 999, do you think they can build more. Separate question, how many Pista Spyders are there? Thanks


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I guess not info on the Pista Spyder build numbers?


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UK dealer consensus is Worldwide approx 4200 Coupe 1800 Spider..who knows.

 

I was told even more by my dealer and that Ferrari went quite eager with the Pista production - was a casual conversation though.

 

Thanks,


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Thats nuts!

 

Seems high, but I don’t know and nobody has been able to give a definitive answer.


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