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Ferrari Technicians in the USA and OEM Technical Support

Discussion in 'Ferrari Discussion (not model specific)' started by 19633500GT, Feb 5, 2020.

  1. 19633500GT

    19633500GT F1 Veteran
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    I was wondering if anyone can chime in here with what they know.

    Say you're a Ferrari Technician at a dealer (let's use Miller Motor Cars since they're local to me)

    You're working on a 458, and are stumped by some actuator malfunction that's causing a delay in X, Y or Z (this is all STRICTLY hypothetical).

    At that point, if the master tech at the dealership cannot figure out the issue, what is the next step for a dealer and the service department to do? What OEM support does Ferrari provide? (I assume somewhere in Maranello, there is a tech team dedicated to issues, and either takes call or emails/messages to help diagnose?). Or does it go to F of NA first, THEN to overseas if not figured out?

    Does anyone know how this all works? Really interested to know.

    Thanks!!! Any experience much appreciated here.

    @Rifledriver your thoughts?
    @MerlinTech your thoughts?
     
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  2. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    All manufacturers, Ferrari included have a help desk kind of thing. They are of variable value. The guys at Ferrari (and I still know a few) tried to be of help and to many I am sure they were, especially to smaller dealers with smaller staffs. In a good dealer with a few good people chances were you had a better brain trust going than the factory did. There are many cases I am aware of where the same factory guys called a few of their known better dealer people looking for answers. One of the Ferrari service instructors was very honest about it. At an intro school for a new model he'd say today he was teaching us and in 6 months he'd be calling us for answers.
     
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  3. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    #3 Rifledriver, Feb 5, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2020
    I should also say more than once people at Ferrari (the good ones, not the ones who acted as though they knew everything) told us "Don't forget, we BUILD cars, we don't fix them".

    In the current era there is a real issue though. It used to be, the manuals everyone hated were great because they didn't tell us how to fix the car, we knew that already. They'd tell us how it all worked so we could understand it and work out what needed to be fixed. More and more they are dumbed down and have less and less on how systems work and more and more on fixing them. Thats fine if you know what to fix.

    By the way, we are mechanics. Not technicians. Save the newspeak BS for the snowflakes who are afraid to tell their mom they are a mechanic.
     
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  4. 19633500GT

    19633500GT F1 Veteran
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    Master Mechanic it is.

    Thank you for the insight.
     
  5. Llenroc

    Llenroc F1 Rookie
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    #5 Llenroc, Feb 5, 2020
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 7, 2020
    My personal definition of technicians and mechanics: technicians are the people who are blank fillers, they perform a certain function because they were told to do it that way through some manual and have no idea why. They have no idea why or how something works the way it does. A mechanic on the other hand knows how and why a concept works and why a certain procedure will fix the problem and just be a bandaid. An example might be a Weber carb, a mechanic would understand how it works then he/she would be able to understand how to tune and sync 4 of them on a 308. I am not sure what a tech would do with a Weber because he wasn’t taught the philosophy behind the carb.
     
  6. MerlinTech

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    Rifledriver is correct. Ferrari has a system in place. Cars are logged into the online system upon arrival and assistance is available through the online system if needed. Ferrari North America is the primary link and the factory sees it as well. When I was with a dealership, they were very responsive and did offer assistance when needed.
    He is also correct in how the manuals are written. In the 355 manual you will see the formula for deriving fuel injection timing. In modern manuals you will find step by step guides to disassembly and reassembly. I will say, with the complex design features of modern cars, it is helpful to know how to remove a complete dash assembly from one of these cars with step by step instructions. New car have way more complex component systems than older cars.
    As far as Technician vs Mechanic, I will say, I am very good with Weber carbs.
     
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  7. ago car nut

    ago car nut F1 Rookie
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    Yes, All we need: Magneto, mechanical fuel pump, and carburetor!
     
  8. MerlinTech

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    Magnetos will bite you, must be grounded !
     
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  9. Llenroc

    Llenroc F1 Rookie
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    Lol, maybe you should remove the “tech” part of your name :p:)
     
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  10. MerlinTech

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    MerlinMech ? Has a nice ring to it. :cool:
     
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  11. 19633500GT

    19633500GT F1 Veteran
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    My question is seeded in thought.
    As I’ve seen Porsche utilize AR to help decrease trouble shooting time this being cost effective and creating quicker turn around on fixes.
    I am still not clear how Ferrari does it but I assume a series of phone calls or emails have to happen?
     
  12. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Do not ever compare Ferrari to a real company. It is an invalid starting position.
     
  13. 19633500GT

    19633500GT F1 Veteran
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    lol. So ominous!
     
  14. MerlinTech

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    He tells the truth.
     
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  15. MerlinTech

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    They have an online system that controls the trouble shooting. Tech logs on and inputs everything known to man, response comes asking for all know universal knowledge, tech responds with all known universal knowledge, response comes back and so forth. Some issues are taken care of quicker than others as I am sure is the case at most dealerships.
    All kidding aside, it worked well when I was there, however, I have zero to compare as Ferrari is the only brand I have worked for.
     
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  16. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    You make the same mistake so many with little or no direct long term experience do. It is not a company whose guiding principals are logic or good business practices. Those are almost never even in the picture.
     
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  17. Jaguar36

    Jaguar36 Formula Junior

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    Is there no way to reach back to the actual design engineers? I'm in a different industry but the way it works for us if a mechanic can't solve the problem with the published information he reaches back to our service engineering team. If they can't figure it out they will then reach back to to the design engineers who will figure out how to fix it (and possible fix the design/issue a service bulletin/ hopefully not have the same issue in a new model)
     
  18. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
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    I tell every one of my new clients not to confuse an Italian car with transportation.
     
  19. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    You assume Ferrari wants or accepts information travelling upstream. We typically have issues fixed in the field long before Ferrari is willing to acknowledge a problem. They make perfect cars that are fixed and owned by idiots. Just ask them. Reread post 12 and 16.
     
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  20. jjtjr

    jjtjr Formula Junior

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    This is the same exact position that GM takes, even though they lead the world (along with Ford) in recalls. In regards to post 17, design engineers design, manufacturers assemble, and dealer franchise techs (oopps) Mechanics repair the engineers and manufacturers goof ups.
    I used to laugh hysterically when GM execs would blab on about how important CSI (customer satisfaction index) was and say things like "fix it right the first time". I would always reply with "build it right the first time". That made me an unpopular person with those folks but i didn't, and still dont care. :)
     
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  21. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    When the 360 came out the geniuses at the factory ran a wiring harness in the nose of the car right where it would get crushed and cut shorting a bunch of circuits going in a steep driveway. Within days we notified them of it with the usual response. About a year later they told us they had discovered the problem and taken steps to cure it. We used to joke our tech hotline where we could fax them this stuff was poised above a trash can.

    Like I said, information never went upstream.
     
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  22. 19633500GT

    19633500GT F1 Veteran
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    So Ferrari runs like the Army.
    I DO have this experience ;)

    and I suppose this all answers my original q which was can AR help. And it seems Ferrari doesn’t want help. Because there’s nothing wrong. :)
     
  23. 19633500GT

    19633500GT F1 Veteran
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    So Ferrari runs like the Army.
    I DO have this experience ;)

    and I suppose this all answers my original q which was can AR
     
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  24. jjtjr

    jjtjr Formula Junior

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    Question for Rifledriver: Does Ferrari (and other exotics) pay their mechs flat rate? I can remember going to a chevrolet master tech event at the time of the C5 launch, and while listening to one of the DSM's tell another fellow tech that chevy was considering paying straight time on the new corvettes due to their complexity, I almost choked myself laughing. I said there is NO WAY chevy (and the stockholders) cares enough about their corvette customers to pay a premium on labor to fix the problems that these cars take with them when they leave the factory. They care only about the profits. That DSM couldn't leave the area fast enough.
     
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  25. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Ferrari doesn't pay mechanics anything. Every dealer world wide is a franchise and operates their own business their way. In the US most dealers are flat rate. I left when that became reality in the region I was working. Flat rate is directly related to the increasing costs of service in the dealers. It is just very simply a way to screw the employees and customers at the same time.
     
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