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FerrariChat.com Members Only Rossa Corsa Forum...

Discussion in 'Ferrari Discussion (not model specific)' started by rob lay, Dec 31, 2003.

?

FerrariChat.com Members Only Rossa Corsa Forum requirements?

  1. Own a Ferrari.

  2. User for at least one year.

  3. Voted on by current members.

  4. $15 a year.

  5. Approved by Rob.

Multiple votes are allowed.
Results are only viewable after voting.
  1. rob lay

    rob lay Administrator
    Staff Member Admin Owner Miami 2018

    Dec 1, 2000
    49,001
    Southlake, TX
    Full Name:
    Rob Lay
    What are your thoughts and what should the requirements be?

    You can vote for more than one requirement.
     
  2. El Wayne

    El Wayne Global Moderator
    Global Moderator Owner

    Aug 1, 2002
    17,952
    San Marino, CA
    Full Name:
    L. Wayne Ausbrooks
    Excellent idea. Of course, a Ferrari ownership requirement would exclude myself and many others, but If that's what eveyone wants, so be it. The big question is, how would one establish proof of ownership?
     
  3. Varenne

    Varenne Formula Junior

    Nov 8, 2003
    554
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    Mark
    Ok, my .02 worth.

    I even voted myself out since I haven't been a member of F-Chat for a year yet, and although I'm not particularly fond of the idea, I would be willing to pay $15 for "preferred" membership. It's unfortunate that it's come to this, but I've seen the other threads and I understand the rationale.

    I personally don't like the id of being voted in by other members. There are a lot of new members who aren't well known by the rest of the cognescenti and whether they own an F-car or not, they simply may not post very often and therefore may not be well known and it's likely that they wouldn't pass muster when voting time comes (and how to vote leads to another problem). Also, it sort of reminds me of fraternity rush when the brothers voted on which pledges were worthy of belonging and those who weren't 'cool' enough didn't get in.

    I'm conflicted by the possible requirement to own a Ferrari. I'm afraid that if this happens, then most of the truly knowledgable people will all drift to the new area and the rest of F-chat could suffer as a result.

    From what I've seen so far, this has been incredibly open community and I've felt warmly welcomed by the response the few posts I've made.

    Best Wishes and Happy New Year to everyone on F-Chat and thank you Rob for creating this environment for us to get together like this.

    Mark
     
  4. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Lifetime Rossa

    Oct 3, 2002
    44,698
    @ the wheel
    Full Name:
    Andreas
    Great idea and quite frankly any of the criteria would work for me.

    I did vote for the ownership requirement. That might sound snobbish and I realize it would cut off some good people. Technically it could be done by sending Rob a copy of your title, just the way FNA recognizes ownership.

    Why ownership? Simply because it changes your whole attitude. I was a Ferrari fan for years and thought I had it figured all out. But unless you own it, pay for it, fear for it and enjoy it, you haven't really experienced it. It is very easy to make statments like I would do this and that or never do this and that, but it is a different game once the machine sits in your garage and feeds off your check book.

    But hey, if it is not ownership, but another criterium (like Rob's preferred pick), that'd be fine too.
     
  5. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

    Apr 26, 2003
    13,234
    Never home
    Full Name:
    Dr. Dumb Ass
    Proof of ownership can be as easy as scanning and sending Rob a copy of our registrations.
     
  6. rob lay

    rob lay Administrator
    Staff Member Admin Owner Miami 2018

    Dec 1, 2000
    49,001
    Southlake, TX
    Full Name:
    Rob Lay
    I haven't put much thought in this yet, so don't hold me to my opinions. This is the very early stages and discussing and voting this is just allowing us to make a better decision down the road.

    Own a Ferrari. - I'm leaning towards this shouldn't be a requirement. We would loose users like Wayne and Jim Schad. I do see Andreas point though.

    User for at least one year. - For no other reason that you should feel like you "earned" the membership. I think it will be respected more once obtained and a motivation for others to be positive while working towards it. Also, some users start off OK and then things go crazy (JRV & Matt for example).

    Voted on by current members. - I like this because it puts worth and value into the membership. Members feel like they have some say. I wouldn't expect there to be hardly anyone not voted in.

    $15 a year. - Besides giving me another revenue stream, we've discussed how a fee filters out much of the "cheap" rift raft.

    Approved by Rob. - Hmm, if we did membership voting, this may be useless or vice versa. I think I would make good decisions, I just think the overall membership should be in charge and not me.
     
  7. bigbaddad

    bigbaddad Karting

    Oct 31, 2003
    135
    Arizona
    Full Name:
    John Roberts
    Maybe I missed it in another thread, but what would the 'Rossa Corsa Forum' be? Is it viewable by all forum members, or just the R.C. members? What is the purpose of the R.C. forum? Is it to avoid 'trolls'? If R.C. members are being a PITA, then what?

    Just throwing out some questions... I like the idea.

    -John
     
  8. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Lifetime Rossa

    Oct 3, 2002
    44,698
    @ the wheel
    Full Name:
    Andreas
    Actually thinking about it, the one I wouldn't like is the vote by membership. Just as in politics: I rather have a wise and benign king than a democracy. Maybe I'm still too Europeish...
    :)

    So I would actually give Rob the power to make the call with one exception: Ownership gives you an automatic way in.

    Even if an owner has gone crazy I would still like to hear from him.

    The fee would sort some things out, but I think that is not entirely related to this question. There has to be more than just the willingness to spend fifteen bucks. Again I apologize if I sound like a snob.
     
  9. El Wayne

    El Wayne Global Moderator
    Global Moderator Owner

    Aug 1, 2002
    17,952
    San Marino, CA
    Full Name:
    L. Wayne Ausbrooks
    I feel this is really something you should leave up to potential members to decide. I think Andreas has a very good point and I sense that many owners would really prefer an "owners only" forum.

    I agree that there would be very few valuable contributors who met the other requirements, were willing to pay, but would be turned away in a vote.

    I agree that the other members should be in charge of voting. After all, we're not talking about a "Rob Lay Fan Club" here.
     
  10. Varenne

    Varenne Formula Junior

    Nov 8, 2003
    554
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    Mark
    Just curious for you owners out there...Isn't there a private 'owner's only' area on Ferrarina.com? Does it have a 'chat' area? If so, how does the discussion, etc. compare with what you've seen here?
     
  11. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Lifetime Rossa

    Oct 3, 2002
    44,698
    @ the wheel
    Full Name:
    Andreas
    Maybe I'm just lazy, but that website is just not too user friendly I think. Never spent there more than a few fleeting moments on it. For the same reason I didn't renew my membership with Ferrari's official world club.
     
  12. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

    Apr 26, 2003
    13,234
    Never home
    Full Name:
    Dr. Dumb Ass
    The owner's site is run by the factory: www.owners.ferrari.com

    The chats haven't been as animated as this board, but the access to old manuals/build sheets is amazing for the ones interested in the older cars. They are about to put an F1 car database up going back to 1970.
     
  13. Chiaro_Slag

    Chiaro_Slag F1 Veteran

    Oct 31, 2003
    7,731
    CA
    Full Name:
    Jerry
    I don't like the idea of dividing the website.

    I love the new software. I too don't like some of the trolls, I could do without a lot of them. Do you need help with having a moderator? I know you can't just keep banning people because they come back with a different dynamic IP. But what about locking threads that are just flame wars or just flat out deleting pointless threads (Mr Greens)? With a little more moderating, I think the worthless threads would start to dwindle. I know it sucks to have to do that, but do we really need threads about "Penis Size" and "Sex Questions"? I would love to see those threads just deleted as soon as they appear. They have no purpose here.

    And what about people that attack sponsors without any first hand knowledge? I have no problem with people posting from their own experiences, but to continue to attack good people beacuse of something they read in a magazine??? Do we really need that here? Or keep telling proud owners that their car sucks. I don't think anyone comes here to post about there common interest just to have some rich immature snob tell them how much their 328/348 sucks.

    P.S. - I would like to see "None of the Above" as one of the poll choices. Especially don't like owning a Ferrari as being a requirement - DES, Jordan, Sunny, etc! Much better forum with those nice folks. :)
     
  14. Doody

    Doody F1 Veteran

    Nov 16, 2001
    6,099
    MA USA
    Full Name:
    Mr. Doody
    i'm not sure what "Rossa Corsa Forum" is, but i'll respond to the poll items based upon OVERALL site access.

    Own a Ferrari.
    in general, not a great idea. LOTS of folks who visit (and may pay money) do not yet own a ferrari. it will impact revenue and visitors. many people like helping non-owners out and those folks would all just go away.

    that said, i think a GREAT thing to do is to provide on the site some instant graphical recognition for folks who are owners and who are not. maybe the user names in the left column of posts show up in bold-red instead of bold-black if you're an owner (or in rob's case, bold-italic-red).

    ownership is easy to prove. if you're an owner, you can get on the Ferrari Owners Site. you get an email address with that - the confirmation email has to be received at that address, and voila. FSpa has already done all the heavy lifting.

    User for at least one year.
    eh, i can take that or leave it. a year is a long time on the Internet. why reward "longevity" potentially at the expense of "value of contribution" or something like that. seems quite arbitrary.

    Voted on by current members.
    imo, this is silly.

    $15 a year.
    absolutely. you should be charging some de minimus fee for all sorts of goodies access on the site.

    Approved by Rob.
    with all due respects to our host, this smells plain silly.

    my two drachmas.

    doody.
     
  15. zjpj

    zjpj F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    5,938
    USA
    I think the ownership is the worst requirement of them all. You can be a biggest enthusiast than anyone, know more about Ferrari history than anyone, without ever owning a car. The knowledge of such enthusiasts would be sorely missed. Also, what about past or future owners? Do we want to discourage questions from people who are considering entering the Ferrari fraternity? Surely not. I know of someone who owned a 250 GTO decades ago but has no Ferraris in the stable now. Do we not want to let people like him participate? Of course we want everyone who loves Ferrari and cars to have a voice.

    I think the best choice is to make it a paying site. People would only sign up who actually cared and had something to say. That gets my vote.

    And, Rob, with added revenue, maybe you can make posting videos and/or high res photos possible (?)
     
  16. Tenney

    Tenney F1 Rookie
    Consultant

    Feb 21, 2001
    3,344
    I'd be in for 15 if it'd help Rob out. Don't have much use for the remaining criteria, though.
     
  17. Ricambi America

    Ricambi America F1 World Champ
    Sponsor Owner

    Dec 7, 2003
    15,217
    Winston Salem, NC
    Full Name:
    Daniel
    I'm in the midst of a serious search for my first F-car. Not some teen-dreamer, but actually going to pull the trigger once I've completed some good solid research. Whether it's through FML, FerrariChat, or conversations with owners, I'm in the game.

    But, I'm new to this forum and don't currently own one. If I'm "penalized" by not being able to join, then it'll certainly have a negative affect on my search (and impressions of Ferrari camraderie).

    How about a graduated payment schedule? More senior members (posts, years, proof of ownership) would get cheaper rates. Green beans like me would pay more. Lets be honest, if we're all popping (or about to!) $3K for a service visit, we can afford more than $15/year for high quality insight like I've found here.

    Just my .02. BTW, if anyone has a scoop on a well-documented, non garage-queen, '90 348, let me know!
     
  18. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Lifetime Rossa

    Oct 3, 2002
    44,698
    @ the wheel
    Full Name:
    Andreas
    I think that is a great idea and good compromise. For me an owner's opinion just has more weight. I'm not saying that because I'm an owner ((308) too. That's not it. But if I want to hear what e.g. a Testarossa is all about, I really don't care what somebody thinks about it who has only seen it in magazines. I want to hear it from the people who drive it, fix it etc.
     
  19. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

    Apr 26, 2003
    13,234
    Never home
    Full Name:
    Dr. Dumb Ass
    I would give DES a token ownership stake (gratis) in my 365 to get around this rule, unless BRUCE beats me to it.
     
  20. andybm3

    andybm3 Karting
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 12, 2003
    235
    USA
    Full Name:
    Andy
    I would make the requirement that you are either a Ferrari owner (and can prove it) or you pay $15. That way we do weed out the rif-raf without locking out non-ferrari owners that have good insights. For what its worth I am new to the site (Nov) and am a current owner and have found the site very valuable.
     
  21. Brian C. Stradale

    Brian C. Stradale F1 Rookie
    Lifetime Rossa

    Mar 17, 2002
    3,603
    Dallas, TX, USA
    Here's my thoughts:

    First on the criteria:

    1) Don't exclude non-owners... people go in and out of ownership... and some of the biggest enthusiasts are non-owners at times..

    2) Don't do "voting"... too painful and too ugly... at most, I'd do like we do on a track list I am on... require N people to support a person's nomination. That ensures that people contribute something useful AND that we know who they really are.

    3) $15 subscription. This is the ticket... it ensures the people truly value what they get here... it auto-flushes the trolls, as very few trolls are going to pay... there's plenty of places to troll for free. Owners will all happily pay the $$... hell, its less than a tank of gas or a mere phone call to Ferrari service. ;)


    Second, on the idea of a separate Rossa Corsa forum:

    1) I think you'll end up needing the divisions you have now also in the Rossa Corsa section. Otherwise, there will be this painful dichotemy of the "free" area having the advantage of more focused areas.

    2) Having to visit double the forums will be painful... we'll want all the enthusiasts to join the pay area... so, I think we'll minimize the limiting criteria other than those I mention above.

    3) Once we have the pay area and the free area equivalent, and we get all the enthusiasts into the pay area, the free area will dwindle away and fail, IMO. There won't be any traffic there as no real enthusiasts will be there.

    4) Thus, in the end the free area will serve no purpose... just create confusion and be a place for unknowledgable people to post nonsense that doesn't get refuted because there's nobody there to refute it... and we really don't want Fchat associated with a pile of nonsense.


    THEREFORE, I say just jump to the end solution:

    Leave the existing forums how they are and charge $15 for the privilege of posting (being a "member"). But allow anybody to see the forums... lurk for free, but pay to participate. Create a clear set of rules for which continued violation will lead to loss of "member" status (with no refund)... that'll keep everyone in line. Only members can see other member's profiles (that should minimize improper spamming).


    JMHO.
     
  22. zjpj

    zjpj F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    5,938
    USA
    Yeah, I meant to say this earlier too. Definitely lurk for free - how else will someone know they want to join if they can't see what they are buying into? Great idea.
     
  23. pdiack

    pdiack Karting

    Nov 19, 2003
    236
    GREAT idea!!!
     
  24. 134282

    134282 Four Time F1 World Champ

    Aug 3, 2002
    40,617
    California
    Full Name:
    Carbon McCoy
    AWWWWW...!!! You guys are awesome...! i'm sure i speak for Jordan and Sunny as well when i say Thank You. :)

    Rov, you can just come out and tell everyone that you want a RobChat, to match the DESchat you made... It's ok, we'll understand... :D
     
  25. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Three Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 28, 2003
    38,914
    Texas!
    >> would make the requirement that you are either a Ferrari owner (and can prove it) or you pay $15. That way we do weed out the rif-raf without locking out non-ferrari owners that have good insights. For what its worth I am new to the site (Nov) and am a current owner and have found the site very valuable<<

    I think that there is a lot of merit to both these ideas. There are jillions of car boards where trolls can flame each other to their heart's delight. What makes F-Chat different is that you are dealing with people with real experience, like Mr. G, or real passion, like DES or Dan or Carbonio or whatever he calls himself nowadays. $15 is not much of a toll charge to avoid trolls (sic). This is 1/10 of what I pay for a FCA membership. (I think.)

    And the problem with the ignore feature is that the trolls keep changing their name. Personally, I learned a long time ago to ignore losers. But the nature of a free internet site makes this very difficult to do.

    Maybe you could try this on a trial basis to see what happens?

    Again, be careful out there tonight. Internet trolls are annoying. Real life trolls can be deadly.

    HYN!

    DrTax
     

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