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GSX-R vs F1

Discussion in 'Other Off Topic Forum' started by 348 Turbo, Nov 30, 2003.

  1. 348 Turbo

    348 Turbo Formula 3

    Jul 17, 2002
    1,837
    ok,
    I've been doing my homework on the sportbike purchase. The Titan hasn't even gone on eBay yet, so I'm taking my time learning the ropes.
    I went to see the Honda's (954rr's and RC51), the Suzukis (750 and 1000), and the Yamaha (F1). As you may have read in a previous thread, I rode the Ducati 996. Basically, I liked them all. I enjoyed the powerplants figures, notably the GSX-R! Can't have TOO MUCH power really can you?
    My salesman at Yamaha tells me the new F1 will have 180 whp! How could it make such a huge jump? Is this the dawn of a new level of performance for these bikes? I mean with the GSX-R topping the list now with 153 whp, how could the improvement be this monumental?
    Somebody clue in a newbie would you? Prices for a 1 year old bike with 2000-4000 miles seem steady at about $6000-7500.
    BTW- I'd like some feedbackalos on the RC-51 vs. GSX-R 1000.
    Thanks.
    Jeff
     
  2. robiferretti

    robiferretti F1 Rookie

    Oct 31, 2003
    3,252
    NYC area
    Full Name:
    rob ferretti
    my buddy is looking to sell his gsxr1000
     
  3. ART360

    ART360 Guest

    Horsepower claims!!! The GSXR is all that you're going to need as your first bike back. The race bikes (Superbike, etc) only make 175 - 180HP. For Yamaha to claim 180HP they must be measuring the power at the crankshaft. That would give you about 160HP at the rear wheel. More than enough, but since 75% of the wrecks occur in the first year of ownership, I'd buy a used bike, and then see what you need.

    Remember, these bikes are pretty good off the floor, but they need a fork kit (about $600), a rear shock ($500 - 1000) and a good set of tires to really make them work right. I'd buy the used bike, hopefully the prior owner has done some of the updates, and then add what you need. The Dunlaps or the Michelins are very, very good, especially if you buy the race compound (they don't last long, but who care?).

    Art
     
  4. noony

    noony F1 Veteran

    Nov 25, 2003
    5,903
    Seoul
    Full Name:
    Johnathan
    Have you seen the hayabusa? 200mph derestricted. Yamaha I think always overestimate power and acceleration figures, like ferrari.
     
  5. 348 Turbo

    348 Turbo Formula 3

    Jul 17, 2002
    1,837
    Thanks again, Guys.
    I'm also thinking I'll most likely end up with the GSX-R 1000. I'll ease my way back into riding sport style too. I hear they've improved quite a bit. Do these previously stated prices sound about right?
    Also, if the CBR makes 135 hp and the RC-51 makes only 113, and all the performance figures seem to favor the CBR, why does thte factory race the RC?
     
  6. Ferruccio

    Ferruccio Formula Junior

    Feb 2, 2003
    440
    olathe, KS
    Full Name:
    Dan Gordon
    I had a gsxr 750 and loved it! I drove a friends 1000 all the time was too much for me. That bike is fast BE CAREFULL only for experts. You will learn a lot more on a smaller bike. The new 600 gsxr comming out is fast enough for anyone. Again if you are not one of the best ridders out there it is too much of a bike for you.
     
  7. Aircon

    Aircon Seven Time F1 World Champ

    Jun 23, 2003
    77,463
    Melbourne, Australia
    Full Name:
    Peter
    Can you give some examples of where Ferrari overestimate power and acceleration figures?
     
  8. Hubert

    Hubert F1 Rookie

    Jan 3, 2002
    2,642
    The Left Coast
    Low end grunt.
     
  9. Mitch Alsup

    Mitch Alsup F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    6,333
    Whether you like it or not, you have a much better survival chance in your first year with less than 80 HP than with more than 100 HP.

    After you survive an entire year without dropping or wrecking a bike, then you can consider buying a new top-of-the-line model. So, start with a used bike that you can afford the throw away.

    Survival on a bike has a lot more to do with self control than with bike control. Bikes with big power and bigger brakes can spit you off faster than you chan sneeze.

    Notice: a 72 HP bike (Ducati 900 SS for example) can do 0-60 in 3.3 sec; while a 150 HP (near) superbike can do 2.7. The difference is that the former bike can do this with little knowledge of clutch hand control and little thought of throttle control of rear wheel grip. The latter cannot. These big bikes are loats of fun, but they are animales, and can eat you up and spit you out in nanoseconds. They demand mucho respecto.

    Also Note: The 72 HP bike will top out in the 145 range while the 150 HP bile willtop out in the 170-190 range. I spend a significant amount of time venturing into the 120,130, and 140 range. I have (personally) never needed to venture any higher--the risk reward relationship goes south very quickly above 130 MPH.
     
  10. 348 Turbo

    348 Turbo Formula 3

    Jul 17, 2002
    1,837
    OK,
    Sorry, I guess I haven't been clear.
    I am not a new rider. I've been riding since I was 8 years old. Racing enduro's when I was a kid. I've owned many street bikes too, to include but not limited to, all the old 3 cylinder two cycle bikes, S3 H1, and H2. I owned seveal Hondas in between and lastly owned a Honda CBR 1000F, which I rode over 20,000 miles. Now for the past year, I've had my first American V Twin, a Titan,

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2446094835

    I'm done with it now and want to go back to riding "ass up".
    So, I'm not a new rider, just new to the new generation sportbikes. I hear they've come quite a long way!
    With this in mind, is the new GSX-R even too much for me?
     
  11. Artherd

    Artherd F1 Veteran

    Jun 19, 2002
    6,587
    Bay Area, CA
    Full Name:
    Ben Cannon
    Get the Ducati. All 750+cc bikes are fast, but the Ducati is also beautiful.

    Best!
    Ben.
     
  12. Stickanddice

    Stickanddice Formula 3

    Nov 2, 2002
    2,473
    I've had a Honda CBR600 F3, Ducati 748S, and a Yamaha R1. I'm no track star by any stretch but have been street riding for a bit (yes, I can scrub the tire to the edge of the tread :)). Currently no bikes but I must say my friend's GSX-R 1000 is a BEAST. More than enough power. I prefer the sound and every day practicality of the twin though. Should I ever get back on the saddle its going to be either an Aprilia or a Ducati. Suzuki also makes a liter twin with the SV, which I would also consider.

    For a 4 banger monster you can't beat the GSX-R though. I'm not a good enough rider to be commenting on handling nuances but I must say that the R1 was a road scalpel, as was the Ducati. The CBRs seem sprung a bit too soft for hard riding. The R1 was pretty stiff with the shocks pegged. A friend of mine who is a better rider has said that just about any bike, Ducati and R1 inclusive, needs suspension work for real track use. Felt fine "out of the box" to me.

    Art, I've heard, is an amazing rider so I'd go with what he has to say.

    Art,

    Have you heard of a Daniel Baldini? Raced Kawis I think. Privateer, although I'm not sure he ever got funded to race AMA or if he did race it might have been a short stint. Maybe an AFM rider? 600cc. From Napa, CA.

    Cheers
     
  13. markr

    markr Karting

    Sep 15, 2003
    196
    N. Virginia
    I have a 2003 GSXR-1K. Bought it brand new last March. I had three Triumphs previously and they were all good, fast bikes BUT, my Gixxer is in a whole different league. This is the first bike that I have ever had that I can honestly say that it is frustrating to ride. Without doing track days you will never, ever, get to really see what it can do without running into the law.

    As for the new R1. You can bet you a** that the 180bhp they are claiming is at the crank. They have also said that this is taking into consideration the ram air effect. So as someone mention before you are looking at a true 160ish at the wheel in stock form.

    Nevertheless, the gixxer dyno'd at 147 at 500 miles on the clock and in bone stock form. With custom mapping and the new exhaust I am looking at somewhere over 150bhp at wheel. Does it matter, not at all!! Because regardless of how fast the new R1, CBR1000, and ZX10, there is no way that I would need anymore power on the street. It looks like by next year I will have the slowest bike (relatively speaking of course) on the block and I do not mind because no one short of a true track god will be able to use that type of BHP.
     
  14. 348 Turbo

    348 Turbo Formula 3

    Jul 17, 2002
    1,837
    OK,
    Thanks for all the advice guys. Yes, of course I meant R1.
    If my Titan goes anywhere near the true value, I'll begin my shopping in earnest with cash in hand. I wnat to go and ride the R1 and the GXS-R. I'll also keep the Ducati in mind, but there is o local service here in Memphis for it. Sadly, it is decending on my list of potentials.
    BTW- The local dealer here is clearing out the last 2 2003 R1's for $8900 ea.
    Jeff
     

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