how to value a car where the owner did the major themself

is it me or is his shop cluttered with junk....

$1M cars right up against racks of parts, etc.

 

It says zip about fixing cars.

 

+1 and waaaay off topic now.
Would one feel safe buying a Ferrari say, from Pawn Stars clowns, just because they told you their knowledgable 'friend' inspected it, like that Count joker?
Forget the TV personalities, use credible documentation and good judgement is a better bet.

 

so, which bit am i confused about? Will you tell me? Are you saying he does not have collectors buying from him or no one buys f40s from him. What am i confused about?

 

Not to go off topic, and not to defined Wayne's shop, but I happen to live about 10 miles from the place and I've seen what they can do. What you see on TV is entertainment.

I will agree that he has gotten caught up in the TV series. But such is life. When some one hands you a rainbow, do you not take it?

 

My theory most of the TV builders have something to prove most likely from not being breast fed when a child.

Wait I resemble that remark


Goes back to those that can do those that can't... well you get the drift

 

It says everything about talent, skill and, for most, innate capability.

Regarding race teams as mentioned earlier, a pit stop is child's play when compared to an Integrated Combat Turn.

 

Agree. Hope he's making a bundle but to the unknowing who foolishly believe TV it looks bad.

 

But just WTF does one have to do with the other?


The fact that you do not see the difference illustrates the point perfectly.

One I am sure you know a great deal about and the other nothing.


Not to mention the fact that it really has nothing to do with the topic.

 

I love this place.

 

I'm a stud

 

I'm going for a drive. You wanna go see what Bruce is breaking...a fixing...a doing?

 

Here is more love.


Sintered block love

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/348-355/114801-no-lift-needed-348-engine-removal-2.html

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Grinding Parts to make them fit love

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/348-355/433547-incorrect-information-engine-cam-belt-change-video.html



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Bafoon love

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/technical-q/177335-diy-360-clutch-replacement.html



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DIY hack love


http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/348-355-sponsored-bradan/472295-engine-out-wrecked-ring-nut-main-tbelt-drive-pulley.html



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Outdoor Patio Major Service Love

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/348-355-sponsored-bradan/459555-joshtownsends-1992-348-engine-out-service-maintenance-thread.html



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612 Cluster F love

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/612-599/453306-heres-pic-me-pulling-engine-out-my-612-yesterday.html



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“Extreme” lost and confused love

Bad news from the F-dealer today - FerrariChat.com



Which then lead to this :

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/348-355-sponsored-bradan/353086-30k-355f1-major-engine-out.html

Which then ALWAYS leads to this LOL :

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/348-355-sponsored-bradan/385678-selling-my-355-a.html



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Tin Foil Love

Announcing! 348/355 Annual Maintenance Program! - Page 5 - FerrariChat.com


Announcing! 348/355 Annual Maintenance Program! - Page 6 - FerrariChat.com





Any questions?

 

Hey where's the picture of the 348 on cinder block jack stands?

 

I have my guys here building the slab for the new garage, I'm stuck here
Thanks

 

All three!
You'll find me under the shade tree by the block and tackle!

 

Page 1. That link takes you to page 2

 

So since you have seen the shop do they really do full restorations or is this another fake reality show like mystery diners?


I went to a restaurant that was on that Mystery diners and asked the waitress did the situation I saw on TV really happen. She busted out laughing and said none of it was true. She said the people they showed that worked there never actually did. It was a big joke among the staff.

 

Well, so much for conversation and soft skills.
.
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Here is a link. Click on the restoration photos. Photos | F-40 Motorsports | Portland, CT 06480

(FYI, I have no affiliation.)

 

SOME Factory mechanic fall under your broad label. However , the so called factory " life line " you state is more like using a magic 8 ball. While FNA techline has direct access to the factory that Dealerships do not ( Nor do most DIY / Indi Shops ) the amount of help is mostly in the form of " look up tech dox XYZ " or have your checked this or that. The tech , with hands on the Ferrari , is the one who is truely diagnosing the failure.

I would actually challenge your statement when it comes to Ferrari. That a modern dat technican is much more than a mechanic of yester year... as using a screwdriver to diag a misfire , pulling spark plug wires to find a dead miss , is way easier that diag on a multi ECU , CAN line, system that are in Ferrari today.

Though , giving credit where credit is due, each has their specialty and it's up to shops to cross train and utilize what resources they have available to them.

IMO they learn more by doing, hands on, than reading.

Even if they WERE " Certified " 20 years ago on a 3x8 , does that mean they magicly know there way around newer models? If a Ferrari Technician were to be factory trained on a 348/355 and has consistantly worked with them to modern day, then I would feel 100% comfortable with them performing annual services / belt services / etc and consider it to be on par with any Dealership as well.

Now, just because at one time they worked for Ferrrari and were trained by the factory on a 348/355, at the time, that has minimal bearing on their ability to work on a F430 today. It doesn't cross over.. no matter how good they are on a 348/355. So no, I wouldn't put them above a Dealership with technicians trained on the F430.

So, yes, IMO Ferrari training matters. The real question is , does it matter to YOU?

Truer words could not be spoken.

Now, let's apply that to the topic at hand, with your above statement in mind, how does a DIY'r that's fantastic neuro doctor, or even a technician who WAS trained to work on Ferrari 30 years ago... how does that apply today, that either would be considered a better option that a currently trained , well respected Ferrari Dealership technician?

And with all of this said, we are still not talking apples to apples.

An owner working on their own car, taking the extra care to pay the special attention to details that matter to that owner, would most likely NOT pay someone else the time to do the exact same job. It's a delicate balance of value to the dollar spent.

But thats a topic for another thread...

I for one am gaining invaluable insight from this thread and thank you to everyone providing their perspectives and opinions!

S

 

While this thread has spun in various directions I'll just go back to the original premise: How do you value a car where the owner did the major himself. The problem is simply that regardless of what the owner does or doesn't know, he is an unknown and unverifiable. You can find plenty of cars that are cosmetically immaculate but mechanically a mess. If the quality of service is unknown, and that applies to dealers as well as DIYer, how can you put a value on it?

 

Agreed for the most part.

Like I said in the beginning, life ain't fair.

Most buyers are going to find a higher level of comfort with well known shops or dealers.
Some are going to put a premium on dealer only servicing and owner serviced will be for most at the bottom.


The relative skills of any really do not enter into it.

 

Interesting thread......

I would have no issue when an owner has done simple maintenance, but if he's cracking open an engine or doing a timing belt change.....sorry would not buy.

 

As a mechanic , and ferrari owner i am always interested and somewhat amused by threads like this. There are a few others here , fbb. , for one , who have a high degree of knowledge of cars , not just ferrari's , and do it for a living .these guys get it . And theres the guys with no or little knowledge. , and i dont mean anything bad , but to the little mechanical knoeledge group , you're overthinking this . I work on all types of cars everyday , trust me on this , your 348 or 355 has the mechanical complexity of a 1986 ford escort. Yes , more cylinders , blah blah , but its systems , fuel injection , abs , power equipment , wiring etc are extremely basic .its engine internals , valves , pistons , timing belt and design are also nothing cutting edge . If an owner wants to pay crazy money to the so called expert , more power to em , call it peace of mind , but there is nothing going under the skin of that car that a good mechanic can not handle . I work on complex stuff every day , late bmw's , benzes etc and i when i work on my 348 i laugh at how rudimentary the car is , i can not see one part in the car that could even remotely need only be touched by " ultra expert " hands . I think the whole damn car can be disassembled using a 10 peice tool set , a phillips screwdriver would be the most used tool . Lol

If you have no mechanical skills , please , with your ferrari or your ford , leave it to a mechanic , but dont discredit a car worked on by a knowledgeable diy owner, key word knowledgeable .

To catergorise owner serviced cars into a group of " lower valued " cars is just making a stupid generalization

To compare the topic to aircraft and doctors etc is just silly. Sorry there just is no magic going on in your 348 or 355 . They are magical cars. , full of personality , fast , sexy , amazing sound , feel , and so on , but they are a low tech old car . Low tech in a wonderful way !

Now this will ruffle feathers but imho , the "ferrari expert " is just the same as religion , a myth perpetuated for the sake of business ( profit )

Before computers and the internet , maybe only some experts had the answers , but times have changed.
1994 ferrari 348 spider , third owner purchased may 2013 w/ 27804 miles