I have had it with this piece of junk!

Mike , now hold on just a minute. Look at how Ferrari listened to us about the sticky button issue , they fixed that right away. Rolling eyes. .

 

Over the past ~8 years quality has become significantly better. My 8 year old Cali with 35k miles has been perfect. But yes, its true for most of their existence quality has been very iffy.

Point being, no one should judge Ferrari today by the quality of 10+ years ago.

 

Yes and no. I think people conflate different eras when it comes to Ferrari's, and to be fair - Porsches, Lambo's and other exotics. Ferrari always put performance over reliability, but reliability also improved with each generation of cars. So a 70's Ferrari was way more reliable than an early 60's car (One of my parents friends daily drove a Daytona Spider for almost 10 years). An 80's car was much more reliable than a 70's car, etc etc. In the 80's and 90's my family owned a few 80's Ferrari's, all of which were incredibly reliable (and were until they were sold). In fact we never had one break down, although dealer service costs were high as I've noted more than once. As time marched on those cars became "old cars" and no doubt started breaking down. But find me a sports car that doesn't do that. I know a bunch of Porsche guys who call the tow truck with semi regularity over snapped cables or some other problem with their old air cooled 911's. Is a 1982 GTSi less reliable than a 1982 911? Maybe. Depends on how they've been maintained. But both are bad examples because they're both old sports cars, and old is not synonymous with reliable in car vocabulary. But having said that, many members here who sort their cars out or buy sorted out cars, and maintain them accordingly, have had wonderful, trouble free experiences. Go figure.

On the other hand, the 458/F12/FF and beyond seem to be very reliable cars that can be driven by the masses who don't know how to "love them" the way old cars need to be loved, and future generations will no doubt be even better. I won't argue that a new Porsche is less likely to have issues than a new Ferrari, but at this point in the marquee's development, I don't think they qualify as "unreliable" unless they're not taken care of for extended periods of time...which is a caveat that's to be expected with any performance car.

Edit: For what it's worth, I think the myth of Porsche reliability might be a bit overrated as well, for the same reasons. A new Porsche, yes. But a lot of those old cars seem to spend as much time in the shop as their Italian cousins..and I love Porsche, for the record!

 

Lots of guys cross shopping a Ferrari 599 vs a Toyota Yaris these days? I think OP is full of it. This isn't to say Ferraris don't have QC issues, and that I haven't had a love/hate with them over the years... but there's never been a point where I thought I'd sell one of them to buy a $10k kitchen appliance.

 

The take away lesson is don't buy a garage queen if you're actually going to drive it! ;-)

 

Its sounds like a case of deferred maintenance, as evident by all of the seals that are leaking, in an environment that takes a toll on the car to begin with. When I lived in Houston Texas, the frequency of required maintenance increased substantially on my daily driver. Tires, brakes, anything made out of rubber had a shorter life span. If you are concerned with all of the modern electronics, a direction that many of us here have gone down is the pre electronic era Ferrari's. In all of the years that I have owned my 76 and 82 Ferrari's, I have never once been stranded. These cars are hand built and have a substantially different driving experience to the modern day cars, no power steering or brakes and manual transmissions make for a significant amount of driver interaction. If you maintain them properly, they will reward you with a great ownership experience!

 

Lol... exactly, so you understood exactly what my point was

 

I sympathize 100% and believe you had issues. It happens.

My expericne has been great! I have what many people believe is the most unreliable Ferrari (Mondial t) of all time. Yet I've demonstrated with documentation it was more affordable than a brand new Toyota 86 in the the last 5 years. Drove it 20k miles too, so it's not a case of a reliable garage queen.

Point being, experiences can vary by a wide margin. I've also heard/read quite a bit of horror stories of cars from the Middle East. Not sure why this is or if true, just my personal observation.

 

True, although I've found it's all about the owner and maintenance. Fix things immediately and following all scheduled maintenance goes a long way to enjoying these cars.

 

Well said.

 

What amazes me is how many people are active in Ferrari chat and post strong opinions on the cars without ever having owned one.

 

LOLZ! Ferrari's reliability issues are no secret. They are well documented from a plethora of sources.

I don't think you'd have to win a gold medal to know you'd like it, or have Ebola to know you'd hate it.

 

I get being horribly disappointed with a purchase of a dream car.

I don’t get what the goal was in venting here. To get everyone to chime in and agree? To start arguments with people who had very different experiences and tell them they’re all wrong?

Bought a car from a giant collection of unused cars without realizing that means inspection looks great but all running parts would leak with some use. That sucks. A lot.

But what satisfaction is gained here?

 

Sure OK. Takes a genius I guess to realize that one does not buy a super car for its reliability. Apples to oranges. Ferrari or Toyota. Whatever.

 

It’s always interesting to me the evolution of a brand. A really nice product usually starts as a niche product for aficionados. Ferrari’s pre-1980 were owned by people who were true car aficionados. Tools that came with the car included wrenches to remove spark plugs, they needed to adjust the timing periodically, etc. As Ferrari has become more of a lifestyle brand and status symbol, it draws a different type of owner. Think of Viking stoves... how many people have one and microwave dinners when they come home from work... but they have a Viking! With a performance oriented professional product, like a high end stove, it’s engineered to different tolerances than a consumer product like a Maytag. Granted, reliability has increased in general automobiles, Ferrari’s and high end porsche’s are no different (re: rods). True Aficionados understand this.

 

Roger, I acquired my first Ferrari, a 1967 330/365GTC, from Luigi Chinetti Sr in 1978. It turned out to be a speciale built by Enzo for his friend Leopoldo Pirelli, CEO of his patronymic Company. It had been used by Pirelli test drivers testing new tire formulae. It drove well enough, nothing broke and it never left me by the roadside. But within four years I decided on a total mechanical restoration, carried out by Nereo Iori, one of NART's two top wrenches. Iori rebuilt engine (new bearings, valves, valve springs, etc) transaxle, suspension, brakes, everything but the cosmetics. Total cost was about $25K - probably >$100K today. Total cosmetic restoration followed eight years later. And I had a new car.

Pre-owned Ferraris are going to vary in quality, reliability depending on the model, age and prior care. Sorry to read of your bad experience but equating that with all Ferraris simply doesn't compute.

You are clearly a car guy, you care about cars or you wouldn't have bought the Ferrari in the first place. Myself, I hope you find another one that works as it should and pleases the hell out of you.

Good luck, whatever your car future brings you.

 

I had a hard time when I acquired my Rolex watch and it didn't keep accurate time. I quickly discovered that this was the price of admission. It wasn't the accuracy, but the craftmanship and artistry of the maker that you buy into. Get a Timex if you think otherwise.

 

Here's that theme again: you can't build a reliable high performance car. The problem is, Porsche and Mercedes have being doing it for years. The two concepts are NOT mutually exclusive. This is evidenced by the fact that, as others in this thread have pointed out, Ferrari has improved it's reliability each decade. What I'm saying is this: now that Ferrari are nearing the physics limit for performance, and they're about to move into hybrids, isn't it time they make an effort to make the cars better, not just faster?

 

So IMS failure and Electrical gremlins don't exist? Please. There is a reason that I can buy a used 996 or 997 for less than $20k, and used Mercedes.. I can buy any AMG I want for 50% to 20% of new purchase price... Even the GTR has a reputation for transmission issues. When you stress mechanical parts for higher reliability, you have higher failure rates. Pure and simple. It's why Formula 1 engines are rebuilt every couple of hundred hours.
But the Ferrari plastic parts being so bad? Look at Porsche window regulators. You won't get more than 60k-70k miles before they need replacement.
Ferrari can only do as good as the parts suppliers allow. And they use many common bosch parts. Look at the failures and its not the serious stuff like the 10-20% of first gen IMS bearings killing engines. Even the 360 and its feared variations didn't kill that many Ferrari engines out of a Fleet of 16,000-18,000 cars. It's not just Ferrari it's ALL modern sports cars. If you don't drive a 911 or AMG you get similar reliability issues, esp with seals.

 

+1
High maintenance!



"You know of course that Italians build cars with their heart, Germans with their head. You cannot compare."
-Nerofer, FRANCE
Ferrarichat Member

 

I have had Porsche for 30 years. Still own a couple. You have no idea of Porsche reliability and cover ups like IMS etc. Any idea of how many blown engines were replaced by the owners without any compensation? Ask the air cooled guys about heat exchangers. Metzger block casting porosity. I’ve fixed them all. Others have given proper evidence but you won’t believe it. Mercedes does not have a supercar. No comparison.

My point is simple. Can’t compare a super car to a toaster. Ferrari vs Yaris. Who does that?

 

I guess that's debatable.

All the best,
Andrew.

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Beat me to it!

 

You got me. Maybe I should have said a regular production super car.

 

Is the Project One allowed (as it’s not available yet)?