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In the market for an F40. Any words of wisdom?

Discussion in '288GTO/F40/F50/Enzo/LaFerrari' started by SteveB, Jan 22, 2004.

  1. SteveB

    SteveB Karting

    Oct 5, 2003
    62
    Puyallup, WA
    Full Name:
    Steve Barker
    I finally sold my 360 Spider and now it is time to concentrate on buying an F40.

    I am hoping that some of you might have advice on what to watch out for, legitimate prices, etc.

    A few months ago I missed getting one that was owned by Paul Allen for $295,000.00 with only 2000 miles on it.

    Steve
     
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  3. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

    Apr 26, 2003
    13,234
    Never home
    Full Name:
    Dr. Dumb Ass
    You should be able to get one for right around $300k. Find one that hasn't been modified, regularly driven. Stay away from the Euro cars, they had a fuel cell that needs to be replaced around now (the rubber is only good for ~10 years). I know of a nice one in NC if you are serious.
     
  4. SteveB

    SteveB Karting

    Oct 5, 2003
    62
    Puyallup, WA
    Full Name:
    Steve Barker
    judge4re, thanks for the info. Am I serious? I wouldn't be wasting my time or anyone elses if I weren't.

    I will only buy an F40 through Ferrari of Seattle. I have bought all of my previous Ferrari's from them and they are great to work with.

    Steve
     
  5. bobafett

    bobafett F1 Veteran

    Sep 28, 2002
    9,193
    Steve,

    I am also in the market and *finally* found a 92. Best advice: buy a 92. Wait for it (I have been for months), and find someone VERY good to work on them.

    I'm going through a thorough inspection of the one I just found. If you're looking for pointers, PM me and I'll talk you through what I know (which isn't a whole lot. Nice to have good people behind you, though).

    --Dan
     
  6. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

    Apr 26, 2003
    13,234
    Never home
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    Dr. Dumb Ass
    Service on these is the key. Stick with a dealership or an independent that has several customers that have them.
     
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  8. M.James

    M.James F1 Rookie

    Jun 6, 2003
    2,721
    Worcester, MA
    Full Name:
    Michael.C.James
    Have up-to-date service on the turbo seals -if they blow when the turbos spool up, the engine is sprayed with oil and the car ignites. This can happen with cars that sit for long periods without being driven hard. F-40s were the most sought-after garage queen of the late '80s. Most have become never-driven lawn ornaments.

    I read about one F-40 owner who, after buying his car, drove it into the middle of his living room and walled the car in. Rabid F-40 speculation caused the factory to institute new rules on who was allowed to purchase the 'special' anniversary runs, and the Lease-to-Own program was instituted for the coming F-50.
     
  9. allanlambo

    allanlambo F1 Rookie

    Jun 9, 2002
    4,363
    Maui
    Full Name:
    Allan
    I have 2 words of wisdom. " Great Choice"
     
  10. zsnnf

    zsnnf Formula 3

    Sep 11, 2003
    1,877
    Drive the car you plan on buying. Wait a day or two for the grin on your face to subside and drive it again. I drove 5 cars before I bought mine. Each one is very different. Expect 2nd gear to be a little tough when cold. Expect the black paint around the rear window to be faded. If you know a good private Ferrari repair shop, have them do the pre buy inspection. I had the dealer that serviced my car before I bought it do the one on mine and even though I had questions on some things, they said it was normal. It wasn't.
    I went for a higher mile car that was serviced instead of a "Perfect" new car for several reasons: It's less money. :) I plan on driving the car so why pay a "No miles premium"? The car has a few rock chips so don't sh*t your pants if it get another one. *drive it* I have heard, and seen, cars that sit have injector problems. About $1000 each if you can find them. An F40 has 16 of them. I have also seen fuel pumps go away on cars that sit. $2800. Unless the car has had a recent major service, plan on doing one. Use that in your negotiation on the price. You will fell much better about driving it. If the guy tells you it hasn't been tracked...... Well, No comment.
    If the car has mods, try and get the stock stuff. Most guys do keep them. You *may* get tired of the loud exhust note. The turbos are music to the ear. (no wonder Enzo left out the radio)

    And if you find a guy with an extra set of 18" front Speedlines, I am looking for some.

    You should bee able to find a good car for about $275K

    PM me if you would like more insight,
    Rick
     
  11. SteveB

    SteveB Karting

    Oct 5, 2003
    62
    Puyallup, WA
    Full Name:
    Steve Barker
    bobafett, why a 92? I will PM you for more info.

    judge4re, thanks again.

    M.James, thanks for the tips on the turbos. I wonder if the guy that walled his in is ready to sell?

    allanlambo, thanks! I am indeed hoping that it will be a great choice.

    zsnnf: great insight! I will PM you for more info.

    Steve
     
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  13. zsnnf

    zsnnf Formula 3

    Sep 11, 2003
    1,877
    Dan ,
    Which car did you find? PM me if you like. I hope it wasn't the "last car in the states"
    Why a '92?
    The '92 that I rode in and drove felt a little weak. The car I thought ran the best was a '90.
    I later heard from a mutual friend of ours that the '92 I drove has never ran right.

    Rick
     
  14. F40

    F40 F1 Rookie

    Apr 16, 2003
    3,227
    92's were the last year they were built, and by then they had pretty much all the quirks out of them, and were used to building them, so it was done correctly.
     
  15. zsnnf

    zsnnf Formula 3

    Sep 11, 2003
    1,877
    Which Quirks were those?
     
  16. skipgt4

    skipgt4 Formula Junior

    Nov 3, 2003
    403
    GR Michigan
    Full Name:
    Charles VDB
    Steve,
    You may want to contact George Evans http://www.evansauto.com/
    He has had an F40 for a couple of years and drives it alot.
     
  17. kenyon

    kenyon F1 Rookie

    Oct 7, 2002
    2,836
    East Yorkshire
    Full Name:
    Justin Kenyon
    I have been told that al F40 have racing fuel safety cells and that they need changing about every 10 years, It cost about £10,000 pounds sterling.

    I might be wrong put was told by one owner I know.
     
  18. nerd

    nerd F1 Rookie

    Oct 12, 2003
    2,506
    Southwest Airlines
    Full Name:
    RSK
    Steve,

    The F40 is one of my 3, or 4 favorite Ferraris. With one exception, I have always found the best cars through dealers or mechanics that were watching the market for me (in one case 3 years, and now going on 2 years looking for the right Daytona). The Ferrari Market Letter is an entertaining reference and Mike Sheehan (love him or hate him) almost always has an F40 within reach (he has modified '91 currently listed).

    Good luck!
     
  19. rexrcr

    rexrcr Formula 3

    Nov 27, 2002
    1,572
    Kalamazoo, MI
    Full Name:
    Rob Schermerhorn
    Clogged injectors can be resuscitated back to life. Not every cleaning process is the same. If someone has this issue, email me. I can get it done for you, or point you in the right direction.

    If one really requires new injectors, I can help here too.

    All Euro and ROW cars have rubber bladder fuel cell systems with external fuel pumps. The factory (and all racing sanctioning bodies) require recertification of the bladder and internal material. Yes, it will degrade over time. The internal "foam" that prevents or slows flame breaks down too and will clog fuel filters. This material degradation will take many years, and after a decade or more, one should consider removal of the fuel tanks in a Euro car and at the minimum, visual inspection, at most, send to ATL for recertification. Internal foam, cheap stuff, should be replaced at this time. Removing tanks requires removal of a couple of rear suspension components, not a huge deal.

    USA cars do not have rubber bladder fuel cells (unless the car was modified, one was, I know 'cause I did it.) USA cars have fuel pumps integral with the tanks, just like 348, F355, etc. The reason for the difference is evaporative emissions compliance.

    I am not aware of any differences of any significance (other than ring & pinion ratios, which only limit top speed, not drivability) between 1990, '91, or '92 cars. Their history is more important than build date.

    Just like other Ferrari's, cars that sit may have more issues than drivers. Clutch slave seal wear may be an issue on a garage queen.

    BTW, I know the story of the F40 delivery to the owner's living room. I worked for the store that sold and delivered it. It no longer resides there. :)

    HTH

    Best regards,

    Rob Schermerhorn
     
  20. rexrcr

    rexrcr Formula 3

    Nov 27, 2002
    1,572
    Kalamazoo, MI
    Full Name:
    Rob Schermerhorn
    Here again, if one has a Euro car and does actually require bladder replacement, I can do it for thousands less than this.

    Rob
     
  21. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Dec 6, 2002
    74,351
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Bubba
    Michel Sheehan shows one in inventory.

    All hopped up, and carpeted!
     
  22. fanatic1

    fanatic1 Guest

    Nov 1, 2003
    553
    columbus
    Full Name:
    philip
    I'd just like to say George Evans does have an F40 he drives regularly....but stay away FROM ANYTHING HE IS SELLING!!!! He's a fiarly nice guy, very knowledgable, but in my dealing with him (which has been several dealings over a few years) I wouldn't trust anything he says.....................AT ALL.
     
  23. parkerfe

    parkerfe F1 World Champ

    Sep 4, 2001
    12,887
    Cumming, Georgia
    Full Name:
    Franklin E. Parker
    From what I've read the US spec F40 has more horsepower that the eurospec car anyway. Yet another reason to get a US spec one. While I have driven an F40 and loved the car, I recommend that you drive a 288GTO before you buy. While the F40 may be a little faster, the 288GTO looks better, drives better on the road and will hold it's value better in the long run. Just my humble opinion.
     
  24. CHRISA

    CHRISA Rookie

    Nov 25, 2003
    3
    COSTA MESA CA
    Full Name:
    CHRIS ANDERSON
    FERRARI OF ORANGE COUNTY HAS A 1990 CHECK IT OUT AT WWWFMSOCAL.COM
     
  25. SteveB

    SteveB Karting

    Oct 5, 2003
    62
    Puyallup, WA
    Full Name:
    Steve Barker
    skipgt4, I would be a little hesitant to call him and burn up his time - especially with the comment by fanatic1.

    kenyon, thanks.

    kaller, out of curiosity which are your other favorite Ferraris?

    Rob Schermerhorn, what is a ROW car? Your knowledge of these cars is impressive. I am with you on the garage queens. Buying a used exotic is a real crap shoot. You don't really want a car that has a lot of miles where things are worn out but on the other hand you don't want one that has been sitting where parts can degrade from lack of use.

    Speedy308, I have to wonder about that car. It has been for sale for quite some time. Anybody know anything about it?

    fanatic1, thanks for the tip.

    parkerfe, I am hopelessly drawn to the F40. No other car will do. I do appreciate your opinion however.

    CHRISA, I have seen that car on eBay. No one put in a realistic bid for it and the auction closed. FoS is checking into the car right now.



    I am one of those guys that likes doing his own work on cars. I am not afraid to tackle just about anything - except paint and body work. This is a hobby for me. I even have a DynoJet chassis dyno in one of my garages.

    Are there any service manuals for these cars? How about software for manipulating fuel and ignition maps?

    Steve
     
  26. Athrill

    Athrill Rookie

    Jan 20, 2004
    22
    Metro New York
    Steve:

    I've got a 1991 F40 that I purchased about 1 1/2 years ago. It's an awesome car. This car has been tracked -- it's where it really belongs. Although street legal, it's tough to drive because of low clearance and many potholes. It's been serviced by an authorized Ferrari dealer in the area. I might be convinced to part with it for the right price. Send a PM and we can discuss.

    Ron
     
  27. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Dec 6, 2002
    74,351
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Bubba
    Wow! Post #1 and it's to offer his F40!

    Is this great site or WHAT!
     
  28. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Dec 6, 2002
    74,351
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Bubba
    Well, the car Sheehan has is heavily modified, but talk with Fchat member Chris Parr, who has had to upgrade his brakes, etc. in similar manner.

    Don't bother Chris right now, he's on track at Moroso at the Cavallino Classic, today.

    Sheehan's in the office, we just exchanged emails about Walter Medlin.

    THE ONE IN THE LIVING ROOM IS NOT THERE ANYMORE, BTW!

    D*&(^* urban legends never die, do they?
     

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