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Instrument panel cable color codes in a 328?

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by jbanzai, Nov 7, 2003.

  1. jbanzai

    jbanzai Formula 3

    Feb 1, 2002
    1,564
    Madrid, Spain
    Full Name:
    Julio
    I did something very stupid. I was replacing my Speedo with one only in Km/h and, when taking out the pannel, and disconnecting all the small lights to take it out, I did not take note of their placement... doh!!!

    Does any body have a note with the colour code ccable couples that match each light? Left and right fan, defrozer, Slow Down light, Parking light, security belt light etc...

    - Thanks.
     
  2. f355spider

    f355spider F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    May 29, 2001
    16,557
    USA
    Full Name:
    Hugh G. Rection
    Too easy! Just turn the ignition "on" and activate each device, the light will come on, indicating it's function.... :)
     
  3. jbanzai

    jbanzai Formula 3

    Feb 1, 2002
    1,564
    Madrid, Spain
    Full Name:
    Julio
    LOL, I already thought of that, but I have a small problem, I am replacing the radiator and hoses and have all the front trunk, including the battery disasembled and water out.

    While I wait for the parts I decided to work in the instrument replacement, and did this stupid thing...

    No big deal, if nobody knows I will wait until I put back the radiator and ensable everything and then do as you say.

    Thanks.
     
  4. KurtK328

    KurtK328 Formula Junior

    Mar 6, 2001
    347
    Villeneuve-Loubet, France
    Full Name:
    Kurt Kjelgaard
    Jbanzai, what year is your 328? Colours change over the years.
    And, I assume you have a US 328 since you are changing to km's.
    Be aware that the final gear ratios are different, 17:63 for a euro version, 16:65 for the US version.
    This means that your km speedo will show around 10 % more than it should.....plus the normal up to 10% too much, all in all up to 20% to much.
     
  5. jbanzai

    jbanzai Formula 3

    Feb 1, 2002
    1,564
    Madrid, Spain
    Full Name:
    Julio
    You are right my car is February '86 328 GTS US version. Hmm, I have not thought of that. Is there any way to adjust/tweak it?

    Thanks

    - Julio.
     
  6. KurtK328

    KurtK328 Formula Junior

    Mar 6, 2001
    347
    Villeneuve-Loubet, France
    Full Name:
    Kurt Kjelgaard
    You might have guessed that I have been through the same exercise.
    and as I see it you have three possibilities:

    1. Have the speedo electronics (inside instrument) recalibrated
    2. Insert some sort of impulse changing circuit between the transmitter and the speedo.
    3. Live with it - the indication will be too high, that you can live with, but worse is that the km counter also will show too many kilometers.

    ad 1. Palo Alto speedo in teh US has been mentioned several times in the past, maybe they can solve the problem. You will need a reduction of the indication of approx. 0.9. When the speedo is fitted check the indicated speed against a radar reading or timing on a specific distance to calculate the correction you need.
    You can also calculate a correction using the odometer, but this will probably be different from the needle indication correction.
    You will then have to decide whether you want the needle or the odometer to be completely accurate.

    ad 2. I tried a device called ERA - did not work. Principle is that it transform incoming speedo transmitter signals to identical signals, but with a lower frequency. However, it did not work with my 328 and the company couldn,t offer any help.

    ad 3. Thats what I do.

    Let me know what you find out, I am interested in any solution you might dream up.

    Maybe there is somebody out there with electronics knowledge, that would take this challenge up - let me know.

    brgds
    Kurt
     
  7. jbanzai

    jbanzai Formula 3

    Feb 1, 2002
    1,564
    Madrid, Spain
    Full Name:
    Julio
    I just thought of a 4th one. My miles speedo works fine, I was just exchanging it for readibility as I was getting in trouble in the M40 in Madrid because I tend to forget I am looking at the mph instead of the smaller kph numbers.

    So here is the 4th: I change the face plate of the speedos and install back the original US verion with the European face plate. The mile counter will stay the same but I will be only looking at the speed in km/h.

    Also as that layout has the km/h scale slightly further that the US it might even compensate for the 10% original difference.

    Am I crazy if I try that?

    - Julio.
     
  8. KurtK328

    KurtK328 Formula Junior

    Mar 6, 2001
    347
    Villeneuve-Loubet, France
    Full Name:
    Kurt Kjelgaard
    Theoretically it should work, but I think that you will have problems.
    Not so much taking the speedo apart, but more putting it back together without damage. The 308 speedos has a crome ring that must be destroyed to disassemble and therefore needs a new ring upon assembly.
    The 328 speedo has no such ring and the black plastic ring holding the glass seems to be glued to the main white speedo body.
    You will need to separate the speedo at the front to get the inner parts out in daylight.
    Keep us posted on your thoughts.

    Let's not forget the original question about color codes.
    This is what I have for the '86 US 328:
    There are three plugs connecting the main harness to the instrument cluster. Note!!:The following color codes apply to the main harness - the shorter leads from the plugs to the individual lamps can have different colors.

    Here we go:
    The six lights above the instruments should be as follows, left to right on the panel, two wires for each (main harness wirecolors):

    LH ventilation fan light: Red/beige striped black
    Rear window heater light: Black/Orange
    Fasten seat belt light: Green striped white/Brown striped white
    Slow down light: Green striped white/Red striped brown
    Parking light indicator: Violet striped white/White
    RH ventilation fan: Blue striped red/Beige

    Indicators in instruments, one wire per light since ground is supplied by instrument casings:

    Speedometer, left to right:
    Left turn signal indicator: Light blue striped black
    External lights indicator: White
    Right turn signal indicator: Light blue

    RPM indicator, left to right:
    Brake fail light: Orange striped black
    Hi beam light: Green striped black
    Parking brake light: Pink

    Oil pressure indicator:
    Low oil press light: Grey striped yellow

    All remaining light are for instrument lighting.

    Good luck, I hope this is sufficient, if not I'm sure you will be back
     
  9. jbanzai

    jbanzai Formula 3

    Feb 1, 2002
    1,564
    Madrid, Spain
    Full Name:
    Julio
    Thanks Kurt,

    that is exactlly what I needed. You are right again about the speedo, it is pretty strongly glued. Most likely will break when opening it.

    It will be difficult to find somebody in Spain to recalibrate that speedo. However I happend to know that the spedo used in the 328s is exactly the same model used in the old Alfa 75 (with different calibration obviusly).

    If that info is accurate, which I will check, that will mean that there should be plenty of places in Europe where the recalibration of that speedo can be done. I am going to talk to a couple of friends and see. I'll keep you posted.

    Thanks again.
     
  10. KurtK328

    KurtK328 Formula Junior

    Mar 6, 2001
    347
    Villeneuve-Loubet, France
    Full Name:
    Kurt Kjelgaard
    No problem - I am looking forward to hear what you find out.

    brgds Kurt
     
  11. jbanzai

    jbanzai Formula 3

    Feb 1, 2002
    1,564
    Madrid, Spain
    Full Name:
    Julio
    Hi again,

    thanks all for the info on the lights, everything is back in place now and working.

    Kurt, are you sure that the US and Europe Speedos are different. I just took my car to a house I have exactlly at 32 Km from where I currently live and he km counter was quite precise in the count, 32.4 Km.

    Also the speed readings are slightly lower than before, I will even say that it seems more precise now.

    In 5th gear at 3000 RPM I was at a speed of 90 Km/h in the speedo and also according to my brothers car speedo. That acctually matches ethe 17:63 ratio of the European version, as you predicted. However I am certain that my car has a 16:65 final rati, so now I am seriusly confused.

    I am going to repeat the test tomorrow with other car as reference, to be sure.

    I am a real beginer in this matters and therefore I do not know how the speed is measured in this car. So here is my question, will it be posible that the speedo is not taking in consideration the gear difference and Ferrari just accepted that there will be a speed reading difference.

    Also I have to point that my Km speedo was purchased in Canada. So other posibility is that there where 3 different speedos, US, Europe and Canada, is it possible? Had the 328 sold in Canada the same final ratio thanbthe US and Km speedos?

    Thanks.

    - Julio.
     
  12. KurtK328

    KurtK328 Formula Junior

    Mar 6, 2001
    347
    Villeneuve-Loubet, France
    Full Name:
    Kurt Kjelgaard
    Jbanzai, I will have to get back to you later.
    Presently I am in Stockholm and won't be back home in two weeks.
    My km speedometer came off a Euro 328 and is definitely showing too much, both speed and km counter.
    According to the sparepart manual (if my memory serves me correctly) there is no specific Canadian km speedometer.
    I don't know if the Canadian 328's are in fact US cars, but with km/celsius/kg instruments.
    Can anybody out there help?
    Some time ago, I actually asked Ferrari UK if any km speedo could be used in the US cars, but never got an answer.
    Could your gearbox/differential some time in the past have been substituted with a euro ditto?
     
  13. jbanzai

    jbanzai Formula 3

    Feb 1, 2002
    1,564
    Madrid, Spain
    Full Name:
    Julio
    Hello,

    well I bought the car from his second owner. I have service records from the car since new. If the gerabox or differential has been changed or modified I do not have that record, so I doubt it.

    I am now even a bit disapointed, my car now is as fast as before, of course, but the speedo reradings are way lower, and something tells me that the new speedo is right.

    I guess there is not tha many Fchaters in Europe who got US 328s...

    We might should post this in the Europe section.

    One thing, if you still keep the US speedo it is relatively easy to remove the speedo 'glass' by pushing it down carefully. Then you can remove the gauges and exchange the face plates between the US and Euro speedos. Place back the gauges, apply some drops of plastic cement in the glass and reattach it. You will have your old speedo with the 'right' speed readings, althoug the km counter will be miles.

    - Julio.
     
  14. jbanzai

    jbanzai Formula 3

    Feb 1, 2002
    1,564
    Madrid, Spain
    Full Name:
    Julio
    Kurt,

    it is confirmed now. I did the test again both the speedo and the km counters are more accurate now that when I had the US one installed.

    The speedo is marking now speeds about a 8% lower than the mph version and the Km counter is almost 99% accurate compared to 2 other cars, same route at the same time, the Km counter were 45.2 Km (Peugeot 406), 45.4 Km (Mazda MX5) and 45.5 Km in my Ferrari 328.

    So either the speedos are interchangable and non dependant on the gearbox final ratio, or there were different Km/h speedos depending on the geographical area where the cars were sold, and therefore will be a difference betwen a Km/h 328 speedo from Canada and a km/h speedo from Europe.

    The only bad thing now is that it hurts to realize that the car is slower. I kind of knew it, but it is different from guessing it, than from seeing it all the time in my face, &^%$.

    - Julio
     
  15. KurtK328

    KurtK328 Formula Junior

    Mar 6, 2001
    347
    Villeneuve-Loubet, France
    Full Name:
    Kurt Kjelgaard
    Thanks, jbanzai - I will investigate some more.
     
  16. KurtK328

    KurtK328 Formula Junior

    Mar 6, 2001
    347
    Villeneuve-Loubet, France
    Full Name:
    Kurt Kjelgaard
    jbanzai, see my post on Canadian cars.
    That seems to solve the mystery.

    best regards
    Kurt
     
  17. KurtK328

    KurtK328 Formula Junior

    Mar 6, 2001
    347
    Villeneuve-Loubet, France
    Full Name:
    Kurt Kjelgaard
    jbanzai, I sent you a private message.
     
  18. jbanzai

    jbanzai Formula 3

    Feb 1, 2002
    1,564
    Madrid, Spain
    Full Name:
    Julio
    That explains it. I have sent you the info and here is the label in the Speedo Box, if you need more info I can take the speedo out this weekend and take a photo of the labels.

    I can look and see if I can find the info where I purchased mine. I contacted the Guy throu Ebay, but I did not buy it from an auction.

    I will look in my email archives and see if I still have the contact.

    Good luck.
     
  19. jbanzai

    jbanzai Formula 3

    Feb 1, 2002
    1,564
    Madrid, Spain
    Full Name:
    Julio
    I found the info. I have sent you another private message with the email address of Gentry Lane, where I bought mine.

    - Julio
     
  20. AndersJL

    AndersJL Formula Junior

    Apr 16, 2001
    365
    Sweden
    Full Name:
    AL
    Julio, pls. tell me how you managed to disasembel the dashboard.
    I need to take the whole thing down to shange the leather.
    Brgds Anders

    ajlamberth@telair.com
     
  21. jbanzai

    jbanzai Formula 3

    Feb 1, 2002
    1,564
    Madrid, Spain
    Full Name:
    Julio
    I did not need to disasemble the dashbord. I removed the stering wheel , and then removed the four ligts in the 4 corners of the instrument pannel. Behaind the lights there are 4 screws. After removing them the instrument pannel gets out just by pulling.

    But if what you want to remove is the leather cover, after removing the instrument pannel there are some screws that holds it in place. I never tried it, but I guess yoou just need to remove those screws and the cover will go out.

    - Julio.
     

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