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Is it time for gun control in Washington?

Discussion in 'Australia' started by Aircon, Sep 17, 2013.

  1. spicedriver

    spicedriver Formula 3

    Feb 1, 2011
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    Very nice country yes.

    But back to reality - even vegetarians kill to survive.

    We had a TV show called "Survivorman". Where a survival specialist went out into the wilderness to survive by himself. There was one show were he was sent to the Alaskan wilderness. The show's producers required that he carry a rifle. Without the rifle, he could easily have been killed by a bear. Sometimes it's kill or be killed.

    As the world population rapidly increases. Many immigrants from "not so nice" countries will be showing up at your door. Your country will likely have some change coming.
     
  2. Aircon

    Aircon Seven Time F1 World Champ

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    President Trump Retweeted a Tweet from Donald J. Trump
    “Did George Bush ever condemn President Obama after Sandy Hook. President Obama had 32 mass shootings during his reign. Not many people said Obama is out of Control. Mass shootings were happening before the President even thought about running for Pres.”
     
  3. spicedriver

    spicedriver Formula 3

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    #2878 spicedriver, Aug 7, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2019
    Don't be confused. The threats were the shooters, who should have been shot. Unfortunately, their victims were unarmed. Unarmed due to leftist policies that you endorse. The Colorado theater shooter for example deliberately drove for many more miles to find a theater that did not allow permit holders. He did not want to face any armed resistance.

    The shooters in these instances are psychotic. Given a large enough population, you are going to have a number of psychotic individuals. This has been true througout history. The solutions being proposed will simply not work.

    Gun Buybacks:

    The US was born out of the right to bear arms. You could have 100 million assault weapon owners who simply refuse to turn in their weapons. What are the authorities going to do then ? Apparently some people have trouble thinking their ideas through.

    Assault Weapons Ban:

    This was done under the Clinton Admin. There are statistics, and there was zero affect on any crime from this law. Also, an assailant with any type of firearm will have a devasting effect on an unarmed group. The type of weapon is irrelevant.

    Background Checks:

    Most states already have background checks in place. Most of these mass shooters did, or would have passed a background check. These are mostly young people with no criminal or psychological records.

    And I'll bet our cockroaches are much larger than yours.
     
  4. simon klein

    simon klein F1 World Champ
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    'The silicon chip inside her head gets switched to overload' etc.....

    Yer can't beat folk who've been brainwashed, eh Scott.
     
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  5. moretti

    moretti Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Firstly, the type of weapon is VERY relevant, a Gatling gun will kill hundreds in seconds with people not getting time to flee but if it was a bolt action then people have time to either run or get the gun out of the IDIOTS hands, and assault rifles are for military use, who the **** goes deer hunting with an AR15 or such ??!!

    And secondly, our cockroaches in QLD are so big I need to buy a 40kg packet of food for my pet one every week :p
     
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  6. kerrari

    kerrari F1 World Champ
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    Good idea if you live in 3rd world remote rural ... but western suburbia?
     
  7. 4_Eff_Sake

    4_Eff_Sake Formula Junior

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    A wise man once said, “Don’t argue with stupid people. They’ll just drag you down to their level, then beat you with experience”
     
  8. 4_Eff_Sake

    4_Eff_Sake Formula Junior

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    Mate, this is Australia... don’t make me laugh, everything here wants to kill you.

    We don’t feel the need to arm every citizen to protect ourselves from wildlife.

    Here, let me give you a (very) basic lesson in risk management. (I built a pretty successful international business that specialises in the subject)...

    Risk is assessed across two dimensions - the likelihood of an event to occur, and the consequences of the event if it does occur. Once you’ve made an assessment of the initial level of uncontrolled risk, you look for ways to reduce the risk to an acceptable level.

    A risk Control can work to reduce either the likelihood or the consequence of an adverse event. The best controls do both.

    Remove most guns from your society and you will dramatically reduce the Likelihood of shooting deaths. By taking guns out of the general population, whilst there will certainly still be people that snap and want to commit violence against innocents, they will need to resort to more constrained methods, thereby also significantly reducing Consequences.

    Find me a better risk control for shooting deaths and I’m happy to listen.

    (PS: you don’t have to just use a single risk control either. You could take a multilateral approach and layer up controls - it’s called the Swiss Cheese model - layer up enough controls and eventually all the holes get filled)
     
  9. Aircon

    Aircon Seven Time F1 World Champ

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  10. spicedriver

    spicedriver Formula 3

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    The founders had military use in mind when writing the 2nd ammendment. Some people do hunt with the AR-15. I believe someone did grab the Dayton shooter's AR-15 barrel right before the police shot him. Nobody got out of Oswald's way when he hit a moving target from 265' away with a bolt action rifle.

    A bolt action rifle is every bit as deadly, and arguably more accurate than an AR-15. Banning certain types of guns would do nothing to stop mass shootings, or firearm related deaths. The idea of confiscating guns in the US is absurd. It would be immediately challenged in the courts, and deamed unconstitutional. Citizens likely wouldn't comply anyway. Some US cities such as Chicago, and Washington DC did pass laws banning private gun ownership. These laws have been struck down as uncostitutional. And when the laws were in effect, these cities had some of the worst gun violence in the country. The Boston bombers wreaked havoc with improvised pressure cooker bombs. Is the solution to ban pressure cookers ?

    Wal-Mart and the Ned Peppers establishment likely didn't allow permit holders on their property. The solution is more permit holders.

    https://www.wftv.com/news/local/police-investigate-shooting-at-titusville-park/806192101
     
  11. Aircon

    Aircon Seven Time F1 World Champ

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    How many people did Oswald kill with that gun again?
     
  12. spicedriver

    spicedriver Formula 3

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    He killed the one he was aiming at. Despite the world's best security force.
     
  13. Aircon

    Aircon Seven Time F1 World Champ

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    So, just one, then?
     
  14. simon klein

    simon klein F1 World Champ
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    Sunshine,go and google mass shootings in Aussie in the past 20 years and compare 'em with your country.
     
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  15. spicedriver

    spicedriver Formula 3

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    "Remove most guns from your society"

    Okay. So how exactly is that done ? You have this successful business and all. Please explain in detail.
     
  16. simon klein

    simon klein F1 World Champ
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    Keep chasing your tail and you'll end up in your own orifice.
    You sideslipped my advice: Google Mass Shootings in Aussie in the past 20 years....Howards buyback did the job required with VERY few exceptions.
     
  17. spicedriver

    spicedriver Formula 3

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    How about mass shootings by Australians ?

    And according to the article I posted, the buyback was only about 20% in Australia. You won't get anywhere near that number in the US. Try to take them by force, and you will end up with a lot of dead police. You obvioulsy don't understand the US. It's been a gun culture from the beginning.
     
  18. 4_Eff_Sake

    4_Eff_Sake Formula Junior

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    In the interests of a balanced discussion, I’ll make an alternate observation that I think is most definitely a contributing factor to the massively disproportionate amount of gun deaths in USA.

    Your public health system is rooted. (That’s an Australian expression that’s synonymous with the more common one of f’ed)

    In Australia, we have a universal health care safety net for all citizens, which encompasses mental health services as well. The onus on pay-for-service healthcare in the US is outrageous and works against supporting the economically disadvantaged. This is not a left vs. right concept. It is widely supported here on both sides of the political divide.

    Without an adequate medical (and particularly mental health) safety net, your society is undermined by mentally unstable who have ready access to firearms.

    So there’s your second risk control... fix your f’ed medical system
     
  19. 4_Eff_Sake

    4_Eff_Sake Formula Junior

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    No-one understands the US, not even the US. You just wander round with your heads up your backsides, spouting platitudes about thoughts and prayers, as if your imaginary friend in the sky will somehow stop the senseless slaughter, instead of admitting you’ve got a problem and all working to fix it.

    It starts with “Hello, my name is USA and I’m a gun-aholic”
     
  20. simon klein

    simon klein F1 World Champ
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    I'll tell you what,here is the list.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Mass_shootings_in_Australia

    ......and while we're here I found a picture of you and the rest of the progun mob.
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  21. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob F1 World Champ
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    You understand the situation.

    I think you stop mass shootings by shooting back.
     
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  22. simon klein

    simon klein F1 World Champ
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    You forgot the car rego CTP that is Aussie wide as well Scott,the OOESAY doesn't have that either.
     
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  23. C50

    C50 Formula Junior
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    If Sandyhook was not adequate motivation to significantly change American attitudes towards firearms, one should not be surprised that ongoing violence does not change the legal landscape.
    The genie is well out of the bottle and Howard-style buybacks would not have similar effects as in Aus.
     
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  24. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob F1 World Champ
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    Not true the US healthcare system sucks for all. The poor are subsidized under obamacare and the rich pay for the poor through higher insurance premiums.

    How do you deal with mentally ill in Aus?

    In america there are no loony bins because they are politically incorrect so the mentally ill are on the streets. America drugs its mentally ill. Big pharma is making big money on categorizing new levels of mental illness and giving out more pills. No one gets cured in america they get life long pills. Then you got people who refuse to take any pills and go off meds. You can't force anyone to take pills because that is another political issue. In America we start them young in school. Kid are branded ADHD get drugs. Depressed break up with boy friend get drugs. Then we confuse kids with terms like toxic masculinity, unlimited gender identity, and "feelings" equivalent to physical harm. That breeds anxiety and we have a pill for that!
     

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