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Jump starting battery?

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by YOUNGSTOWN328, Jan 8, 2004.

  1. YOUNGSTOWN328

    YOUNGSTOWN328 Rookie

    Jan 8, 2004
    7
    Recently moved to NY from California. Yeah, I know. Car is in storage till house is built and battery went dead. Cold sucked it out. Anyone know how and what I should do or not to do to get her running again. It's a 1986 Ferrari 328 GTS. Any help would be greatly appretiated.
     
  2. 92_348ts

    92_348ts Formula Junior

    Jun 6, 2002
    282
    Boise, Idaho
    Full Name:
    Chris
    I think every Ferrari owners manual you read will caution you NEVER to jump start the car.

    Pick up a battery charger at your local auto parts store and TRICKLE charge the battery for an hour or so. Don't use the fast charge setting.

    Also, if the car is going to be parked for a while, check your owner's manual and see if you have a factory battery quick-disconnect. My car came with one, however I'm not that familiar with the 328. If not, you can pick one up for around $20.

    Hope this helps.
     
  3. pma1010

    pma1010 F1 Rookie

    Jul 21, 2002
    2,558
    Chicago
    Full Name:
    Philip
    Pull the battery off the car. Put it on a low current (trickle) charge for 3 to 4 days. Test to make sure it is charged, put it back on the car.

    If the fuel has been in the tanks for more than 6 months, drain (pull the hose exiting from the pump, put it into a suitable recepticle and 10 mins later you are done. Remember the vapor is highly flammable). Put in fresh fuel. Turn off the fuel pump (pull the fuse), turn the car over on the ignition for 15 secs to get the oil flowing and the pump primed. Replace the fuse, start her up. Change engine oil if it has been 3 months or more of inactivity. Change 'box oil if it's been a year or more since you last did it.

    Put on some shades for that bright winter sun in California, go and take it for a spin.
    Philip
     
  4. YOUNGSTOWN328

    YOUNGSTOWN328 Rookie

    Jan 8, 2004
    7
    Thank you for your help. I didn't think I should jump start it. I'll pull out the battery and trickle feed it like you said. Hope that works.
     
  5. flyingboa

    flyingboa Formula 3

    Nov 27, 2003
    1,551
    Italy/India
    Full Name:
    Eugenio
    Just to confirm that my 1986 328 GTS has a pattery disconnect plub positioned on the front left part of the front boot.
    As far as what to do if you leave the car standing for a while, I do believe that draining the tank etc is perhaps a little of overkilling...
    Ciao

    Eugenio
     
  6. YOUNGSTOWN328

    YOUNGSTOWN328 Rookie

    Jan 8, 2004
    7
    Thanks for everyone's advice and help. I never thought I would get feedback so soon. First time using the site. I'll look for the disconnect plug and unplug the battery and charge it back up. My manual shows where this is I believe. Not sure about draining, although very good information that I will print and keep handy. I drive the car at least a few times a month. Maybe when I have a few more in my stable, I'll need to do this procedure. Many thanks again!
     
  7. Chiaro_Slag

    Chiaro_Slag F1 Veteran

    Oct 31, 2003
    7,731
    CA
    Full Name:
    Jerry
    Hey Youngstown -

    My 328 battery went down yesterday also - Must be something that is in the air. :)

    I jumped started it (I didn't know you weren't suppossed to, oops). I took the battery down to Pep Boys & it accepted the charge just fine. Anyone know why the battery would drain? I am 99.9% sure I didn't leave any lights on - I drove the car at lunch and then after work, it wouldn't fire up.

    Youngstown - I am also curious how the battery fastens down - Mine just lays in there - Can you take a picture & post while you are in there?

    Thanks!
     
  8. YOUNGSTOWN328

    YOUNGSTOWN328 Rookie

    Jan 8, 2004
    7
    Slag328,

    Yeah, must be something in the air. I recently moved from San Luis Obispo and now in NY. The only thing in the air here is REALY cold air. High today is 15 degrees! I will take some photos and send when I take the battery out. Not sure why yours went dead. Maybe drive it for a longer period of time?
     
  9. Chiaro_Slag

    Chiaro_Slag F1 Veteran

    Oct 31, 2003
    7,731
    CA
    Full Name:
    Jerry
    Thanks - I appreciate it.

    I drive the car several times a week. Just not sure why it died. :(
     
  10. jimpo1

    jimpo1 Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Jul 30, 2001
    21,837
    Dallas, TX
    Full Name:
    Jim E
    I live in TX and my 328 battery drains all the time. It's NOT cold related, it never gets that cold here. I disconnect the battery now. It's very simple to do. Open the hood (in the FRONT of the car). Look behind the headlight on the drivers side, you'll see a large red plug that has a braided line attached to it. Unplug it. Thats it! When you're ready to drive again, plug it in.

    I've jump started my car before, in fact, I carry jumper cables with me. Bad Jim, bad bad Jim!
     
  11. Ken

    Ken F1 World Champ

    Oct 19, 2001
    16,078
    Arlington Heights IL
    Full Name:
    Kenneth
    Ferraris are notoriuos for slow battery drains. I don't know what it's from, but in general a battery even sitting on concrete in your garage can drain from condensation on the case through the concrete floor. In a car, there's all kinds of electrical paths very low but significant wattage can leak. Most owners seem to have a trickle charger as standard equipment.

    If you REALLY want to have a car with a 100% drain proof battery, whip out your meter and touch one lead to the + side of your battery. Touch the ground to the case. Voltage zero? Now start testing all your millions of grounds and see if there's any voltage where there shouldn't be. We Lotus types get quite adept at this!!

    Ken
     
  12. pma1010

    pma1010 F1 Rookie

    Jul 21, 2002
    2,558
    Chicago
    Full Name:
    Philip
    I believe it is called dark current. It is there to power the ancilliaries that will work independently of when the ignition is switched. My 308 has a lot of controls that will operate without the ignition switch being turned on (horn, lights etc).

    Also, as batteries age, I believe they are more prone to not holding their charge. Cold weather seems to sap them faster (and certainly pulls more current from the battery on starting). Some, like my Delco, have a 5 year warranty. If the battery is old, it may be time to replace. Dealers in the Midwest seem to like the Optima red top (a gel battery IIRC).
     
  13. Chiaro_Slag

    Chiaro_Slag F1 Veteran

    Oct 31, 2003
    7,731
    CA
    Full Name:
    Jerry
    Took it to my mechanic today - The battery looks good, but doesn't look like the altenator is working correctly when items such as lights, A/C, etc are switched on. I'm taking it back on Monday to have the alternator rebuilt.

    :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :(
     
  14. F328 BobD

    F328 BobD Formula 3

    Mar 17, 2001
    2,327
    Southlake, TX
    Full Name:
    BobD
    Don't forget about the Battery Tender Plus!!!! Jim, like you, I have an older alarm system which drains the battery. I installed a Battery Tender a year ago and it's GREAT! You never worry about the battery again. I've got it hooked up directly to the battery, then I have the wire port installed (and hidden) down by the grill. I don't even have to pop the front hood to connect it. I hook the Battery Tender up every month or so for a couple days... although you can leave it connected always.

    These things cost $70 in stores but you can get them on eBay for $39 (and no tax)!
    http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=35594&item=2452340553

    Also agree, Optima Redtop is the way to go for batteries... USer's go to Pep Boys for the cheapest prices!
     
  15. Dave

    Dave F1 Rookie

    Apr 15, 2001
    2,722
    Little Rock
    Full Name:
    David Jones
    No where in my owners manuals is it printed "do not jump start your vehicle"
    I have jumped many vehicles including Ferraris.
    As long as you know what your doing you should be fine...

    I can see it now, "hello AAA my ferrari is dead on the side of the road and I need a jump...
    Oh I'm sorry we can't jump start a Ferrari, but we can put it on a trickle charge for a few days"
     
  16. Chiaro_Slag

    Chiaro_Slag F1 Veteran

    Oct 31, 2003
    7,731
    CA
    Full Name:
    Jerry
    lol, glad to hear it. :)
     
  17. jselevan

    jselevan Formula 3

    Nov 2, 2003
    1,849
    Here is a vote for Dave's approach. Jump the sucker. Have jumped many Ferraris, and never a problem. Can someone share an engineering principle behind the no-jump admonition? There is no electrical engineering reason that I can think of. Sudden surge? What about when you turn on your battery-disconnect switch? Hurt the electronics? Twelve volts is 12 volts - the quality of the voltage or current is not an issue: Ferraris will start with poor-quality voltage (there is no such thing).

    Drain the fuel tank? More likely to strip the aluminum drain plug that has never been touched before, with consequent aluminum threads in the fuel supply. What are you looking for? Corrosion? Rust? Ever look at the bottom of a fuel tank. They are not flat. There are usually baffles or L-pieces to strengthen the bottom and sides. Draining the fuel will not get every single last piece of rust out of the tank as they get trapped in these compartments. More likely to mess something up, not to speak of burning down your house (with your car in it as you have removed the battery and drained all of the fuel so that you can't get it out of the garage while the house burns around it!)

    Take the simple approach. Jump the battery and start the bloody car.

    Jim S.
     
  18. cwwhk

    cwwhk Formula 3

    Nov 13, 2003
    1,535
    Hong Kong, Tokyo
    Full Name:
    Wayne
    I have not read about this in any of my manuals. Hmmm... interesting. The only NEVER jump start warning I know of applies to frozen dead batteries in very cold weather. I think a frozen battery will explode if you attempt to charge it. So if the car is in temp above 32F or 0C then this is not an issue.

    Don't know about the 328, but on my RHD 355 to the right of the engine under the metal panel there is a +ve jump start post. So you can jump start at least the 355 that way as Ferrari intended.

    There is no + jump start post on my 360 Spider, but if I remember correctly the manual says the jump start procedure is to remove the footwell panel on passenger side to connect jumper cable directly to the gel type battery there. I have also jump started my 550 many times by connecting jumper cable directly to the battery in egine bay. Never had a problem.

    My personal experience is that Ferrari's battery drain problem is more serious than other cars. The OEM FIAMM batteries are not the strongest on the market, but my infrequent driving is also a factor. Multiple ECU on late models draw enough current to drain battery by50% in as little as 10 days.

    As long as you follow proper jump start procedure, electrically speaking I see no difference between jump starting and starting under a car's own power. The jump start procedure I always use is as follows:

    1. Use heavy gauge jumper cable to ensure minimal voltage drop and enough current draw through the jumper cable.
    2. Make sure +ve & -ve clips are connected properly.
    3. Make sure boost battery is fully charged and is of correct voltage and sufficient Amp rating.
    4. If boost battery is on another car, then with jumper cable connected, try running the boosting car at say 2,500 rpm for say 5 minutes so you get at least a quick charge to the dead battery (will reduce peak current draw during jump start). Then turn off engine on the boosting car, then try to start the dead car (this prevents current or voltage spikes to the alternator for both cars).

    If others have a better jump start procedure, I would love to hear it. As others have said in this thread, using a battery tender will solve all your problems. I now use them on all my cars. Cars are always ready to go with no disappointments.
     
  19. Diablo

    Diablo Formula Junior

    Actually there is a + spot in the car and a ground spot in the 360 too.
    On U.S. cars it is behind the drivers seat. Remove the lower panels 5 or 6 screws and you will see it.
    No one ever uses it because it is too time consuming and the 2 screws in front of the passenger footwell are a lot easier to access the battery anyway.
     
  20. funshipone

    funshipone Formula Junior

    Jan 2, 2002
    618
    Harrison Twp. Mi. US
    Full Name:
    John Bicsak
    If car is going to be layed up for 3-4 months but started once every 2-3 weeks to operating temp driven around parking lot, and stored in 50 degree storage yes or no add stabil to gas?
    What do ferrarichat people think.
     
  21. jselevan

    jselevan Formula 3

    Nov 2, 2003
    1,849
    No.

    Jim S.
     
  22. joeyy

    joeyy Karting

    Nov 11, 2003
    190
    long island
    Full Name:
    joe
    battery tenders are good but they sometimes mask a bad or aging battery. put in a new bat every couple of years (cheap insurance) as for the fuel. i fill up with VP racing fuel and run it thoroughly thru everything (take a nice long drive) it never goes stale.
     
  23. roofguy

    roofguy Karting

    Dec 10, 2003
    71
    Alamo, CA
    My mondial had the same thing happen. Auto Zone sells a computer saver that you connect to an extra battery and plug it into the cig. lighter. I used it to connect a trickle charger so I could charge the main battery. Used a 2 amp charger. Took about 6 hours. The computer saver connector costs under $10.00.

    good luck.
     
  24. Glassman

    Glassman F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 23, 2002
    12,908
    I guess the Ferarri has more of an adversion to the 12 volt jerk than my Nisson does. Can anyone explain that? My 250 doesn't seem to mind!!!
     
  25. atheyg

    atheyg Guest

    In a pinch you can jump a Ferrari with acceptance of the risks

    Jumping a car you can get voltage spikes if you have any loose connections and fry your ECU or alternator or many other elec items.

    If you take the cables off the jumped car too soon you can fry your system and alternator if your battery was totally dead as it quickly needs to supply the load for the car.
     

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