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Maranellos are disappearing

Discussion in '456/550/575' started by intrepidcva11, Mar 30, 2015.

  1. Themaven

    Themaven F1 Rookie
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    Hi Alan, you are correct, and thanks for these price points. I didn't make myself clear - in Q1 and Q2 2015, asking prices continued on a sharp upward trend (that had started the previous year, before that the rises were gentler) and as the early parts of this thread show, continued doing so into 2016, although there were far fewer cars around and asking prices became silly and buyers dried up.

    Peak Maranello (for the non-SA cars) happened sometime in 2016.

    The real collectors' cars, like low miles manual SA HGTCs, are among the few Ferraris that have carried on rising, now nudging a million US/Euros.

    These may have taken over from the Daytona as collectible V12 Ferraris. Daytonas, as well as BBs, Testarossas, 275s, and numerous other V12 models, have been hit harder than Maranellos. It seems more modern cars have been hit less hard, but it's hard to generalise: 360 CS have remained strong, 430 Scuderias have gone down, manual 599s and 430s remain strong, etc. There's not a lot of logic to it, it seems strange that a standard 993 Turbo with 25k miles fetches more than a 550 of the same era, meanwhile a good F1 575 may now fetch less than a "unloved" water cooled 996 Turbo S from the same year. Which seems strange to me.
     
  2. Themaven

    Themaven F1 Rookie
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    Just dropping in these posts and price points from another thread.

    1. [​IMG]
      21ATSFormula Junior
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      LHD (Uk registered) 550 63,000km no books no tool kit - resprayed (originally Giallo now silver/grey) - odometer changed.

      Doesn't look a great example.

      Hammer dropped at £45,000 - no sale.(little interest)

      https://www.bonhams.com/auctions/25453/lot/306/



      RHD 97 550 25,900 miles - Good service history Grigio Titanio over grey

      Estate sale, looks quite tidy

      Hammer at £75,000 + commission (two bidders ground this up from about £60K very reluctantly) - Sold

      I make that £88,500 including fees.

      https://www.bonhams.com/auctions/25453/lot/352/

      Yesterday at 4:09 PMReport
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    2. [​IMG]
      BluebottleF1 Rookie
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      The first is indicative of the problems with trying to sell a LHD into a soft RHD market, the second must represent the price for a "trade sale" - it was bought "as is", with no test drive, no PPI and no comeback.

      Today at 9:17 PMReport
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  3. Themaven

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    Looking through the history, £89k for a 27k mile 550 from auction is quite a perky price. Roughly a late 2016/early 2017 price. Either this sold well, or 550 values are ticking up.

    As to the other one, undocumented colour change, 60k ++ undocumented miles, LHD in the UK, not a sellable car.
     
  4. 21ATS

    21ATS Formula Junior

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    I agree. The LHD car wasn't going to interest many people, there were just too many "issues" for it to bring anything other than a "cheap punt" valuation.

    I watched the bidding live on line and the 27K mile car bidding stalled at around £60K, it then took ages at increments of £500 or so with a second bidder throwing in random numbers. It was quite odd.

    For an auction car I also thought £89K was strong money. I don't see that as a trade price currently. I see that as all the retail money this car would get from a dealer. Which then goes back to the old question of why pay that at an auction with zero comeback.
     
  5. marce

    marce Formula Junior

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    does the UK also allow fake(or in other words bids by the auction house) as done here in australia ?

    I don't think I would enjoy buying anything at auction again.
     
  6. 21ATS

    21ATS Formula Junior

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    "Allow" is a loose term. Is it policed? No.
     
  7. Themaven

    Themaven F1 Rookie
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    The answer appears to be, it is not legal, but certainly we have seen it happen. But it may be legal in a couple of months time, oops it’s Brexit again!

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/8632357.stm
     
  8. Themaven

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    You’re right. Plenty of nice 550s at reputable dealers. It looks like it might have been a heat of the moment job which is what a consignor dreams of.

    I wonder if the owner is a member here?
     
  9. Sonnjoh

    Sonnjoh Rookie

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  10. 21ATS

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    I missed the auction on line today, busy in the garden and forgot about it. It looks like it didn't sell but I have no idea what bidding reached.

    Still it's available as a buy it now for £57,000. That's got to start looking appealing on mainland europe with exchange rates where they currently are.
     
  11. Sonnjoh

    Sonnjoh Rookie

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    I think it got to ca 46k. Ad implied sold in France and with good service history. However , in reality it was imported from Japan and had from what I could tell very limited service history. I found almost no invoices in the folder. Maybe the owner can shed some more light on this but I wouldn’t buy this without a major inspection of it.

    Beautiful car though and it could of course prove to be well looked after and a bargain to someone.
     
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  12. bcar1

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    love the color how big of a deal to import to the US?
     
  13. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Likely around $20-30K.
     
  14. bcar1

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    Yeah- I briefly researched and looks to be the right #. In 1-2 years the 96s will be 25 years though!
     
  15. Themaven

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    I remember contributing to this thread four years ago when the big spike in Maranello prices had just happened, and Maranellos had “disappeared” and then reappeared. As I was then, I am now on holiday/vacation in the Alps, with a bit of spare evening time, and just scrolled back to the posts around July and August 2015. I would recommend this as engaging reading for anyone interested. If you want a good 550 now, you will be paying what people paid exactly halfway through that spike - before speculators came onboard. We are back to May 2015 prices but still well above December 2014 (and before) prices.

    What will it look like four years from now - who knows.
     
  16. 21ATS

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  17. ralfabco

    ralfabco F1 World Champ
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    When you meet up with a contemporary F Club meet, it is almost always full of 360's, 430's, 458's, 488's - and the two 355's. The 550 is the occasional dinosaur that almost seems out of place with the latest modern cars. I am unfamiliar with the latest modern cars and do not even know the designations and 'special' editions, after the 599. I lost interest with the automatic transmission and dash navigation systems.
     
  18. FrankieFourEyes

    Sep 3, 2019
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    How much do you think its worth?
     
  19. 21ATS

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    Over the last few years a number of LHD cars made their way to the UK due to the bubble in prices from around 2014/15. These were selling for more in the UK than they were in their country of origin, in the case of the Pozzi Cornes car, Japan. So there was a market for people to import cars here and make a margin on them despite the fact the steering wheel was on the "wrong" side for the UK. These cars have always sold at a discount than the equivalent RHD vehicle. Unless of course it was something special or interesting.

    The problem occurs when the bubble bursts, which it did, specifically on 23rd June 2016 when the UK voted to leave the EU.

    The value of all of these cars is in limbo and now trying to find a new normal. That new normal is a lot lower than when the Pozzi car made it's way from the Far East to the UK. If the equivalent RHD car is now worth somewhere in the region of £50K to £60K in the UK, you're going to need to discount the price of a LHD car by £15K or so to make it attractive.

    The seller is unlikely to want to let this car go for a number beginning with either a 3 or a 4, in fact it failed to sell with a hammer bid of £48K at the last auction it passed through.

    The reality is it needs to be sold in a LHD market that currently isn't as depressed as the UK, or it needs a foreign buyer attracted to the UK auction with the currently depressed exchange rates.
     
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  20. FrankieFourEyes

    Sep 3, 2019
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    Thanks Alan, very insightful and about where I think it should be as well. Bids to 48gbp, he should have considered that.
     
  21. Themaven

    Themaven F1 Rookie
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    It seems Germany, France, Switzerland and also the US are all pretty soft on all classic and modern classic cars right now. The Pebble Beach auctions were pretty depressed and friends tell me typically prices for the top cars are down 25% in a year or so. So Brexit isn't the only factor to blame for the current prices. But it doesn't help. A dealer told me he sold a gated 360 Spider that a year ago would have been £80k, for £60k last week. It's all across the market except perhaps for a few ultra-rare cars, and the cheaper end.
     
  22. Bradwilliams

    Bradwilliams F1 Rookie
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    Saw this car a few weekends ago at auburn. It was nice and went for $83 grand

    https://rmsothebys.com/en/auctions/af19/auburn-fall/lots/r0559-2000-ferrari-360-modena/811071

    And the few who called it for what it was were screamed at, shouted down, and told that they weren't "credible." I Thought that the Maranellos were all gone and now an uber rare impossible to find classic car? It was a funny fable that some on here tried to spin.
     
  23. Themaven

    Themaven F1 Rookie
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    That's entertainment! They were hard to find when the OP started the thread, to be fair to him. Now you'll trip over six of them this weekend at one average auction in the UK alone.

    But manual HGTC Superamericas, now they really are disappearing. Maybe we should rename the thread.
     
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  24. Bradwilliams

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    #1074 Bradwilliams, Sep 11, 2019 at 10:43 AM
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2019 at 10:49 AM
    The Superamerica is a stunnigly gorgeous car. It's a shame they didn't make just a few more of them, especially sticks. I was never a fan of the 550 Barchetta, I think it is a very ugly car with no design harmony. It is one of only two Ferraris of the past 35 years that I find ugly, the 599 being the other one. If I recall, somebody paid close to a million for one back in 2015.
     
  25. 21ATS

    21ATS Formula Junior

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    Price point 14th Sept 2019 Bonhams Goodwood Revival.

    2004 575M F1 HGTC 24,000 miles RHD.

    https://www.bonhams.com/auctions/25454/lot/227/

    Sold - £74,166 inc premium.

    Is it me or does that look like a bargain for an HGTC car? That's just knocked the legs out from under a lot of asking prices in the open market.

    I just watched the recording of the sale on Youtube - bidding actually reached £75,000 and was a no sale - which is odd.

    fast forward to 1 hour 21 minutes.

     

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