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Michelin on the front of a 355

Discussion in '348/355' started by lotusk, Apr 6, 2014.

  1. Steve355F1

    Steve355F1 F1 World Champ
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    Aug 26, 2011
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    Steve
    Yeah, and they also had different rim size (at least on the front) and completely different suspension components. And a different steering rack, and a different suspension ECU.

    So, just whacking bigger tyres on an otherwise standard road car is, IMO, nothing more than a cosmetic desire and has nothing to do with handling.

    In the event of a crash where, say, the car just failed to take a corner and wrapped itself around a tree, I wouldn't be at all surprised if an insurance company would zero in on non standard tyre sizes in order to avoid paying out a claim.

    I could be completely wrong, but I wouldn't want to take the risk - especially here with these cars costing well into six-figure territory...
     
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  3. lotusk

    lotusk Formula 3

    Nov 3, 2003
    1,840
    London UK


    Good one.
    Mine does not have that on its sticker.

    Thanks
     
  4. Steve355F1

    Steve355F1 F1 World Champ
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    No worries. FWIW my car was originally UK delivered so should be relevant to you.
     
  5. bobzdar

    bobzdar F1 Veteran

    Sep 22, 2008
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    Law about car tyres | AA

    Says nothing about sizes. As long as the tire is compatible with the other tires on the car, it should be fine. I think you'd run into problems if using different sizes left to right and possibly different treads/compounds on different ends of the car as they may not be compatible.

    The rear had the same exact rim size and 30mm more tread in challenge cars. The size makes a difference in limit handling based on my experience, for 99% of uses you'll never be able to tell. I put wider fronts on mine for handling purposes as I didn't want understeer with the stock 225's and it had the desired affect. Do what makes you happy.
     
  6. Steve355F1

    Steve355F1 F1 World Champ
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    Fair enough. I agree - do what makes you happy. I'd just be wary of the non-standard sizes simply from an insurance perspective if I hadn't disclosed this change to my insurance company. However, as long as you HAD disclosed this fact to the insurance company and they were happy to insure I guess there wouldn't be a problem.

    As an aside, I always wondered why Ferrari went to 215s on the front of the F360.
    Seems very narrow indeed. Surely they wouldn't have done it unless it made the handling better?
     
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  8. bobzdar

    bobzdar F1 Veteran

    Sep 22, 2008
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    Possibly weight distribution difference and the somewhat more tricky handling the 360 exhibits vs. the 355.
     
  9. LetsJet

    LetsJet F1 Veteran
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    May 24, 2004
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    If you're concerned about putting 295s on the rear, I understand. You should be careful when deciding what's best for you. Yet, I can tell you this is a size many of us have put on and noticed better handling. If you can, see if someone around you has done this so you can see for yourself. I certainly wouldn't want to go back to 265s.

    Good Luck
     
  10. bryn_p

    bryn_p Rookie

    Jun 3, 2008
    43
    West Lancs, UK
    If you haven't ordered them in 88 load rating yet, here is what you're after...

    2254018 225 40 18 225/40/18 92Y MICHELIN PILOT SUPER SPORT XL | eBay

    I just bought 2 so they only have 2 left though. I really hope it's not a typo and they are actually 92 load rating.

    Cheers,
    Bryn.
     
  11. jimmym

    jimmym Formula 3

    Sep 30, 2008
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    +1 on what John and Pete have written. Biggest issue is when mixing tires of different brands and tread compounds. If you are going to use Pilot S/S don't mix them with PS2's.

    I put the 295 Bridgestone's on my car. Kept the 225 size on the front. The only difference is the 295's are slightly wider. The car feels very stable. The tires fit on the rims very well and fills out the rear better.
     
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  13. jimmym

    jimmym Formula 3

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  14. bryn_p

    bryn_p Rookie

    Jun 3, 2008
    43
    West Lancs, UK
    Classic Internet forum action. You forgot to say why? And please back it up with facts rather than opinion.

    Cheers,
    Bryn
     
  15. jimmym

    jimmym Formula 3

    Sep 30, 2008
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    Bryn, when I have purchased tires, tire reps have always recommended going with the same brand and model of tire. I believe it has to do a lot to with how the different rubber compounds respond. Contact your tire mfg. or dealer and see what they tell you. That was what I have always heard, and that also comes from some good friends that have done a lot of racing. No specific facts so it is just anecdotal.
     
  16. jimmym

    jimmym Formula 3

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    By the way I did mention tire compounds. I don't have any specific data on this either but bald tires are more slippery when the road conditions are wet. Just an opinion.;)
     
  17. bryn_p

    bryn_p Rookie

    Jun 3, 2008
    43
    West Lancs, UK
    Totally accept what you're saying and I do agree that matching tyres all round are by far the preferred option... as you can tell from my purchasing of Super Sport fronts to match my rears today! (I will be removing 8 month old hardly worn PS3s to fit them)

    But I don't accept it's an issue to have 2 different tread patterns on different axles, it just can't be. The tyres being discussed here are not manufactured specifically for a steering wheel or driven wheel application, it is only the difference in size that makes them front or rear tyres. And as the front and rear axles have totally different functions on an F355 (or any RWD car), it just can not be an issue to have different patterns on each axle. Not the preferred option yes, but not an issue either.

    Sorry for labouring my point, but I keep seeing this written with no logical argument to back it up. My wife and I did 2500 miles round Europe with SS rears and PS3 fronts and did not spear off the road and die in a ball of flames as a result!

    Cheers,
    Bryn.
     
  18. jimmym

    jimmym Formula 3

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    Bryn, I agree that you can put different tread patterns on the same car. I have a GT5-S and the front tires are almost impossible to find. The originals are P7's. They are not made anymore. You can purchase the rear tires in a P Zero. I might have to do this. Not ideal. The car would be fine under normal driving conditions but when things start to be pushed to their limits that is when the different rubber compounds could effect the outcome.

    When Tire Rack does testing on their tires they have never mismatched mfg.'s or even ran different models of tires from the same mfg. on the same car.
     
  19. 601

    601 Karting
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    Dec 19, 2010
    192
    California
    Just remembered this thread after noticing something interesting on the Michelin website. We've already known that there are both 88Y and 92Y versions, but what got my attention is that the 88Y tire is listed with a weight of only 20.4 lbs, compared to 22.8 lbs for the 92Y. That's a significant difference in unsprung weight. Haven't found a store selling the lighter 88Y tire here in the U.S. though.
     
  20. bobzdar

    bobzdar F1 Veteran

    Sep 22, 2008
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    Different compounds respond differently to heat and have different levels of grip meaning the handling balance will be different than if the compounds were the same and can further change with heat. Same with the tread pattern, different patterns have a different contact patch affecting grip and can really throw the balance off in the wet. Huge deal? No, not in my opinion, but a much bigger deal than just changing sizes.
     
  21. bryn_p

    bryn_p Rookie

    Jun 3, 2008
    43
    West Lancs, UK
    All true, but as I have pointed out already only relevant if the front and rear axles perform the same function and generate the same amount of heat which we know is not the case on an F355.

    Anyway, my 92Y rated Super Sport fronts arrived this week so I'm a happy F355 owner with my preferred choice of tyre all round now :)

    Cheers,
    Bryn.
     
  22. Marcus 27

    Marcus 27 Karting

    Feb 3, 2004
    136
    #44 Marcus 27, Jun 24, 2014
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2014
    I need to get new front tyres for my 355F1 Spider and I'm thinking of getting Michelin Supersports to replace the current Pirelli P-Zeros A lot of people on here have said the Supersports give better handling, but in what respects?

    I quite like the current somewhat tail-happy handling in 2nd gear out of roundabouts, but the steering feel isn't great, and less road noise would be good. I've seen comments that the Michelins break away rather suddenly though - I would be interested to hear other comments on that.

    I am also wondering if I should get 245s instead of 225s on the front, mainly to improve the appearance. But then I'm not sure if it would actually help much - it probably needs spacers, which I have tried and rejected (due to the effect they had on the steering feel). Does anyone have pictures of a car with 245s?
     
  23. cactussed

    cactussed Karting

    Mar 12, 2008
    166
    I'm currently running Michelins on the back and some Falken 453s on the front (I think?).
    So different front to rear.
    Whwnever I reverse out of the garage, it feels like the car is going to crash into the bushes.

    Actually, wait. No it doesn't.

    It drives absolutely fine on the road and track.

    Apologies for being facetious, but really, just buy whatever decent brand you like, in a size you like, with an appropriate spped and load rating and forget about it.

    It'll be OK. Honestly.
     
  24. Garvin

    Garvin Rookie

    Jul 15, 2012
    33
    Cambridgeshire
    It took me some time earlier in the year to track down a couple of 92Y Michelin Supersport tyres for the front of mine although I see they are readily available in the UK now! I did consider the 88Y version but these are all marked as 'BMW' which usually means they have been developed in conjunction with the manufacturer and can have different handling characteristics. I did some calculations on loads and, as has been stated previously, an 88 LI is absolutely fine for 355 so would have gone for them if the 92 LI versions had not cropped up. The 92 LI version are marked as extra load which the 88 LI version is not - I presume this may account for the increased weight.

    A full set of MPSS replaced a full set of Pirellis some months ago and the most difficult aspect was experimenting with tyre pressures. When first fitted I did set the pressures to low and wondered if I'd made a big mistake as the felt decidedly 'vague' and 'wallowy'! Now running 36psi rears and 34psi fronts and they are superb - incredible grip with much less movement of the rear if I get on the throttle a bit too sharpish out of roundabouts and bends. Much quieter than the Pirellis as well. Couldn't be happier with them.
     
  25. Marcus 27

    Marcus 27 Karting

    Feb 3, 2004
    136
    Garvin, do you find there's much difference in steering feel with the Supersports, compared with the Pirellis?

    Various people have commented above that the 88 load rating should be sufficient for the 355, but I'm not sure how they're calculating this.

    When I first thought about this I just did a calculation based on the car's unladen weight and static weight distribution, but that ignores weight transfer under braking/cornering, which is difficult to predict. I wouldn't be surprised if around half the car's weight could be on a front tyre in some situations.
     
  26. Garvin

    Garvin Rookie

    Jul 15, 2012
    33
    Cambridgeshire
    Marcus, depends what you mean by steering feel? I'm not sure I detect any difference regarding steering - what I do notice is much better grip and much quieter. The previous Pirellis might have just edged it for crispness of initial turn in but thereafter the Michelins are, IMHO, far superior. I haven't driven on them in wet conditions but my previous experience of Michelin PS2s is that they were far superior to Pirelli P-Zeros so I'm not expecting the Supersports to be any different.
     

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