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Need Help!!! NYC Garage Crashed My F355 Spider

Discussion in '348/355' started by pchop, Aug 13, 2004.

  1. pchop

    pchop Formula 3
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    Jun 12, 2002
    2,379
    Usually NY often elsewhere.
    Full Name:
    John
    Well, tonight has just been a sh!tty night! I'll skip the other "less interesting" events of the night and jump right to what happened:

    I left my car at a garage on 32nd and Broadway to meet up with Hubert for a drink. When I got back to the garage, there were two police officers approaching me. My first reaction was "holy crap, what did I do now". They asked me if I'm the owner of the Ferrari, and I replied "yes". They told that there was an accident. One of the attendent drove my car into the wall. I asked "how bad and if I should go down to see my car", they replied "bad" and "no, you don't want to see it cause we don't want to see you cry"...

    Well, my car is 1 of the 20 in the world in that color and I need some advice as to if I need an attorney and what I should do next to get the max value.

    P.S. - I'm attaching a link to the video I shot at the garage...please be warned that the video if not for those with a weak heart.

    http://pictures.sprintpcs.com/guest/guest_book_photo.jsp;jsessionid=aaa96LStQg31GE?machineid=pcs002&shareName=video&invite=2EP24VP0Y5UH25pa7orh&shareName=Video
     
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  3. AJS328

    AJS328 F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Apr 23, 2003
    7,520
    New Jersey
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    Augustine Staino
    That really sucks John! I'm sorry to hear it. Good luck getting legal justice!
     
  4. FLATOUTRACING

    FLATOUTRACING F1 Rookie

    Aug 20, 2001
    2,684
    East Coast
    Full Name:
    Jon K.
    With that kind of impact your box section will have to be replaced (ask me how I know). You are looking at 20K in damage minimum.

    I wouldn't let anyone but Karroserie, in King Of Prussia, PA touch the car. They are one of only 4 OEM certified Ferrari body shops (certified by the factory) in the US. The owner is Dick Von Medicus. They repaired my 355 Challenge car twice.

    I can get you the number if you need it.

    Regards,

    Jon P. Kofod
    www.flatoutracing.net
     
  5. JSinNOLA

    JSinNOLA F1 World Champ
    Sponsor Lifetime Rossa

    Mar 18, 2002
    15,081
    Denver, CO
    Full Name:
    John
    Oh NO! :(

    At least this will give you the chance to make any upgrades to the car while it is being repaired! Still a BS situation though. Sorry to hear:mad:
     
  6. zjpj

    zjpj F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    5,938
    USA
    I'm sure you will get good advice here, John. Good luck.

    To the lawyering people: what's the game John should be playing for getting money? The way I see it, this garage would want to avoid publicity, particularly if this was the result of some kind of joy ride. But, if they agree on a sum without any public court proceedings taking place, will their insurance pay for it? - something they obviously also want to have happen. What should John's argument be to them? I said that he should argue not just repairs but resale depreciation as a result of the accident, since the car will not be worth as much, even after repairs. Is this legitimate, legally?
     
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  8. Zupra

    Zupra F1 Rookie

    Mar 31, 2004
    3,649
    St Louis
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    Chesney
    That SUCKS!
     
  9. paulb

    paulb Rookie

    Oct 31, 2003
    20
    Bradley
    Full Name:
    Paul
    My brother in law had something similar occur with his C4S (he had it all of two weeks before the incident). An over zealous parking attendant took a joy ride right into the back of a Range Rover.

    He had to hire an attorney and sue for diminished value, repairs as well as compensation while the car was getting repaired.

    It took a while (>6 months) but he did win. The experience was not a pleasant one as you can imagine.

    Hire a good attorney and good luck.

    Paul
     
  10. FLATOUTRACING

    FLATOUTRACING F1 Rookie

    Aug 20, 2001
    2,684
    East Coast
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    Jon K.
    "loss of value" or "diminished value" depends largely on state law and is very hard to win in court.

    I had an incident with our Land Rover and it took two years to sort out.

    As far as the garage avoiding publicity, in NYC city I would venture to guess this isn't even a liability with the limited parking available.

    I would at the minimum require them to pay for all repairs and a replacement car (assuming you need one) and ONLY PICK THE BEST FERRARI BODY SHOP.

    In your area I would pick Karroserie or Classic Coach......NO ONE ELSE.

    Regards,

    Jon
     
  11. titanium360

    titanium360 F1 Rookie
    BANNED

    Nov 10, 2003
    3,371
    Where is Bill Hart when you need him?
     
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  13. whart

    whart F1 Veteran
    Honorary

    Dec 5, 2001
    6,485
    Grandview NY
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    Herr Prof.
    I would have the police report in hand, and find out what their view is; i would have your lawyer determine if there is a basis for criminal prosecution of the actor: was it an accident or a joyride gone bad?
    Your lawyer should find out who owns the garage:- the actual owner is probably well-shielded through corporate layers, but worth finding. The lawyer should also find out if there have been other, similar incidents at this garage or any others that are owned by the same outfit. (Even if not negligent, though liable, for having an employee go off on a lark with a customer car, the garage is in much worse shape if there is a pattern of such behavior that they have tolerated).
    I would get the car to a first class shop, and "hold" for the time-being; first, you want it out of harm's way, and you want an expert to examine the damage and tell you what's really up with the car. But, if the shop starts working on it before the "adjuster" for the garage's insurance company does his evaluation, you could have issues.
    I would probably take the position that you want the car replaced, not repaired. The garage, its attorneys and their insurance company will probably dick you around.
    The best way to force a quick resolution is to get behind the corporate shield and get at the owners- this will require your attorney to hire a private investigator.Often an investigation will turn up vulnerabilities that you can use to your advantage, but its better left to the lawyer to deal with these issues. (It also ostensibly cloaked in a privileged relationship to protect against disclosure to the other side).
    You are not allowed to threaten criminal prosecution as a means to get a civil remedy: that's considered extortion, but your lawyer will know how to deal with that. As to negative press, i doubt that will move anybody to part with any money quickly, and once you do it, you have shot your wad. (The threat is often better than the actuality, but unless the garage depends on a number of regular monthly slot holders, the transient nature of their customer base won't make much difference- did you inquire to see if anybody was murdered in the hotel you last stayed in? Exactly).
    I can refer you to a few lawyers in the city if you need representation; you want a bulldog. Sorry this happened for your sake.
     
  14. atheyg

    atheyg Guest

    You need a lawyer, the garages insurance company is going to fight you every step. The garage is out of it anyway, any threat to post their name is useless as they have no say in how the insurance company will handle this.

    Since it was hit so hard maybe you can prove criminal negligence and get more money from the garage, I would have them replace the whole car. Hopefully the cop gave the guy a ticket for clearly reckless driving.

    Too bad what happened to your Ferrari
     
  15. Joe G.

    Joe G. Formula 3
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    Dec 9, 2003
    1,077
    Los Angeles
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    Joe Gazzani
    sorry
    that's horrible

    we should never let any parking attendant under any circumstance park our Fcars

    this has happened before to Fcar owners
     
  16. titanium360

    titanium360 F1 Rookie
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    Nov 10, 2003
    3,371
    Wow, bill your ears must have been ringing. that was fast.
     
  17. whart

    whart F1 Veteran
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    Dec 5, 2001
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    Herr Prof.
    My ears have been ringing since that Little Feat concert in '72.
     
  18. LetsJet

    LetsJet F1 Veteran
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    May 24, 2004
    9,238
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    Mr.
    That's funny? I thought I posted to you last night.... now I don't see it.

    Oh, I see, you started a new thread in a diff area. I posted here....

    http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=27661

    Anyway, SORRY Still.......

    -------- From other thread----

    John,

    Sorry about your ride......... you have just convinced me to never valet the car.

    I see a 360 spider in your future. No?
     
  19. SefacHotRodder

    SefacHotRodder F1 World Champ

    Dec 20, 2003
    10,918
    NJ
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    Chris
    that sucks big time. I'm sorry, hope it gets fixed soon.

    What was the name of the garage so we can stay away from it?


    Btw, this might be the wrong time but i LOVE the color.
     
  20. scycle2020

    scycle2020 F1 Rookie

    Jan 26, 2004
    3,458
    potomac
    never,never ever ever give youyr ferrari keys to a parking attendant..park it your self or dont park it there... i dont know about ny garages...anyway i am very sorry... this sucks big time.....if i was carrying heat, that garage attendant would have been in big trouble... a capital offense!!!!
     
  21. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
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    Dec 6, 2002
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    Bubba
    Little Feat...LOL! I was there too!

    You're something Mr. Hart...thanks for your help......

    Man this is TERRIBLE...condolences...

    Heed this advice...and go get 'em.....
     
  22. Zupra

    Zupra F1 Rookie

    Mar 31, 2004
    3,649
    St Louis
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    Chesney
    Poor F-car.
     
  23. Gary Res

    Gary Res Formula Junior

    Apr 23, 2004
    573
    Long Island,New York
    Full Name:
    Gary
    Guys,
    I immediatley tell the attendant that I'm parking the car in the best spot. I give him $20.00, and I take the keys with me. I tell him that when I leave I will see him again. Usually I give another $5.00. If there are cones in the garage, I have the attendant put it by my car. I also tell them, nobody is to go near the car. I never let a 18 yr old park my car!. Some people say between the garage cost ($30.00) and the $25.00 that I give, I'm crazy. Maybe, but I don't have any dings on my car, and no crazy parking guy is slamming my car in a wall! You live and learn.
     
  24. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
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    Dec 6, 2002
    74,136
    Houston, Texas
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    Bubba
    I don't valet at all, or let them take it out of sight...

    But that's not what our friend is asking here........

    Dang it whart, ...now I've got "Fat man in a bathtub...with the blues" in my mind's ear..........where's that vinyl.......
     
  25. Schatten

    Schatten F1 World Champ
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    Apr 3, 2001
    11,237
    Austin, TX
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    Randy
    pchop - best of luck on a speedy recovery.

    I'm interested to know what the police were doing there besides an accident report and what it says - if you can disclose that information.
     
  26. alx355gt

    alx355gt F1 Veteran

    Feb 3, 2004
    9,494
    Belgium
    Full Name:
    Alexander
    :(:(
    I'm very sorry to hear about your situation. Horrible!
    Good luck in sorting things out. Hopefully the poor Spider will be ok soon.
    I hope the one who did this will never be in any Ferrari again...!
     
  27. zjpj

    zjpj F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    5,938
    USA
    Also, some of us are theorizing that this did NOT happen in the garage but, rather, on a joy ride:
    1. The was lots of blood in the car, (in a low speed crash in a parking lot???)
    2. The damage to the front looks like he did not hit a flat wall but rather something jutting out, like a poll or another car. If they are lying about where the accident happened, what can that do for John's action?

    After thinking all these things through, would it not be a good idea immediately to get the garage's security camera footage? This would obviously show exactly what happened, one way or the other. I'd get it before it "mistakenly" gets recorded over.

    whart:
    in a case like this can you get attorney's fees awarded? I know you almost never can in the USA.
     
  28. whart

    whart F1 Veteran
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    Dec 5, 2001
    6,485
    Grandview NY
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    Herr Prof.
    Z- somebody else also made the suggestion about the garage security camera tapes and i agree. John should also check to see what damage is evident in the garage at the alleged point of impact.
    As to attorney's fees, the "American Rule" is generally no fees awarded unless specifically authorized by statute. In some cases, the courts have the inherent power to deal with abuses of the system, but in this kind of case, unless a state statute authorizes it (or the lawyer can get very creative with federal law), i doubt attorney's fees are recoverable. (Oh, there are exceptions in the case of disputes over failure to insure, but that's another issue and one i am no expert in). Hope I answered your question.
     

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