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OFF ROADING WITH MY 599

Discussion in '612/599' started by George Vosburgh, Feb 25, 2020.

  1. George Vosburgh

    George Vosburgh F1 Rookie

    May 26, 2011
    2,950
    Pittsburgh, PA
    So this Saturday here in Pittsburgh it was a beautiful day, cold but beautiful. I took the 599 out of storage. I was merging on the highway looking over my left shoulder when I looked back the car had swung out to the left and was in the grass for a grand total of three to five seconds. The result is that the front valance is cracked, both wheels on the passenger side are scraped, the rocker panel is scraped, and God knows what else.
    The car is on its way tomorrow to Karoserrie in Wayne, PA. They have a first class reputation and many fine things said on this site.
    So the moral of the story is: Don't drive the perfect 599 when it's really cold out and the tires are hard! Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
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  3. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 19, 2008
    33,057
    Clarksville, Tennessee
    Full Name:
    Terry H Phillips
    George- Appears to be just cosmetic. Should be good as new after a little work and a few (maybe not so few) bucks.
     
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  4. tomc

    tomc Two Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 13, 2014
    22,287
    DFW, Texas
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    Tom C
    Sorry to see that. You're 599 is a beauty. What were the temps & what tires are you using?
    T
     
  5. Nospinzone

    Nospinzone F1 Veteran

    Jul 1, 2013
    5,614
    Weston, MA
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    Paul
    Aaaah! That sucks, just a split second of inattention and there's no forgiveness in cold max performance tires. Well hopefully there's no unseen damage.
     
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  6. flat_plane_eddie

    flat_plane_eddie F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Mar 30, 2013
    2,815
    Los Angeles
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    Eddie
    I learned when I had a Viper, if the outside temperature is under 60k you have to drive very carefully, pretty much feather foot it. Even when it's hot outside you have to take it easy until the tires are warmed up but I'm sure you knew that. Damage doesn't look that bad honestly.
     
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  8. Skidkid

    Skidkid F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Aug 25, 2005
    6,509
    Campbell, CA
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    John Zornes
    It was in the 30's for a while here and my wife couldn't understand why I would spin the tires every morning pulling away from the house. Truth, you just couldn't engage the clutch without spinning them. Cold and max performance tires make for some slick conditions. Sorry for your incident but glad it is fairly minor.
     
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  9. George Vosburgh

    George Vosburgh F1 Rookie

    May 26, 2011
    2,950
    Pittsburgh, PA
    The tires are Pirellis, temperature about 21 degrees Fahrenheit.
     
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  10. George Vosburgh

    George Vosburgh F1 Rookie

    May 26, 2011
    2,950
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Yes, I'm hoping it's all cosmetic. The car gets picked up tomorrow.
     
  11. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 19, 2008
    33,057
    Clarksville, Tennessee
    Full Name:
    Terry H Phillips
    George- Pirellis suck.
     
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  13. George Vosburgh

    George Vosburgh F1 Rookie

    May 26, 2011
    2,950
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Now you tell me!
     
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  14. George Vosburgh

    George Vosburgh F1 Rookie

    May 26, 2011
    2,950
    Pittsburgh, PA

    Should I go to Michelin Pilots?
     
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  15. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 19, 2008
    33,057
    Clarksville, Tennessee
    Full Name:
    Terry H Phillips
    Affirmative, Pilot Sport 4S
     
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  16. 599_GTO

    599_GTO Karting

    Mar 7, 2018
    172
    Full Name:
    J.S.
    Sorry George... I hope it won’t be too painful!
     
  17. George Vosburgh

    George Vosburgh F1 Rookie

    May 26, 2011
    2,950
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Thank you, we shall see!
     
  18. Nospinzone

    Nospinzone F1 Veteran

    Jul 1, 2013
    5,614
    Weston, MA
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    Paul
    Yup, I second the Michelin Pilot 4S. I was one of the first to get these on my 612. They are definitely better handling and longer lasting than the Pirellis.

    Although I will say I drove from Boston down to Daytona in one of the coldest winters with P Zeros with no problem. We actually did a rest stop in Georgia and couldn't use the restroom because their pipes had froze.

    So they can be driven in the cold, however, you do have to tread lightly (pun intended :D).
     
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  19. flat_plane_eddie

    flat_plane_eddie F1 Rookie
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    Mar 30, 2013
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    Eddie
    From what I understood, Pirellis are better at the limit but the Michelins are better all around.
     
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  20. George Vosburgh

    George Vosburgh F1 Rookie

    May 26, 2011
    2,950
    Pittsburgh, PA
    I just got the estimate on the repairs. Would you believe 18K? I'm stunned. Of course I'm going ahead with it, I just can't get over the cost.
     
  21. 19633500GT

    19633500GT F1 Veteran
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    Nov 9, 2010
    7,828
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    Muffin-Tops
    WOW. sorry George. Happy it'll get fixed though!
     
  22. Qksilver

    Qksilver F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 11, 2005
    3,731
    Philadelphia
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    Joe
    Yikes. I'm local to Karoserrie. They do superlative work and can be trusted with anything. They are, however, definitely more of an outsourced factory repair shop that manufacturers would use for insurance claims than a place most individuals go for work.

    It will be flawless, that's for sure. The state of the virus is a real shame... would have been a great trip to fly out and drive it home.
     
  23. George Vosburgh

    George Vosburgh F1 Rookie

    May 26, 2011
    2,950
    Pittsburgh, PA
    This is an insurance claim.
     
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  24. Cobraownr

    Cobraownr Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 6, 2008
    875
    Edgewater, MD
    Full Name:
    Donald Silawsky
    Quoting from TireRack.com:

    Summer performance tires feature tread compounds engineered to provide traction in warm to hot ambient temperatures. They were never intended to experience near- and below-freezing temperatures, nor the wintry driving conditions that often accompany them.

    As ambient temperatures get colder, typically in the 40-45° Fahrenheit range, summer performance tires lose a noticeable percentage of traction as their tread compound rubber properties change from a pliable elastic to inflexible plastic. The tire industry uses the term "glass transition" to describe the temperature where a summer performance tire's grip/slip performance changes dramatically. This means the summer performance tires that provide predictable traction in warm to hot conditions will be found to be very challenging to drive in cold to freezing temperatures. This is especially true when the tires first begin to be driven or if the driver aggressively applies gas pedal pressure with today's turbocharged fours or high-torque sixes and eights. Fortunately, glass transition is a reversible condition that allows the tires' normal traction to return as the ambient temperatures climb.

    If ambient temperatures drop to near- or below-freezing, driving or rolling a vehicle equipped with summer performance tires risks the possibility of tread compound cracking. Tread compound cracking is a permanent condition that requires the tires to be replaced. The other condition that can be caused by running summer performance tires in cold temperatures is the possibility of chipping away the edges of the tread blocks.

    Since both of these conditions only occur as the result of what's considered improper use or storage, they are not typically covered by the manufacturer's warranty.
     
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  25. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 19, 2008
    33,057
    Clarksville, Tennessee
    Full Name:
    Terry H Phillips
    Summer tires work acceptably in cold weather after they warm up if the roads are dry. With reduced traction, of course. The biggest problem comes if there is near freezing rain or slush that prevents the tire from getting warm. Tire compounds have improved since TireRack wrote that CYA piece on summer tires.
     
  26. Cobraownr

    Cobraownr Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 6, 2008
    875
    Edgewater, MD
    Full Name:
    Donald Silawsky
    Quoting from live chat with rep at Michelin.com @11:00 a.m. today (3/20):

    "We do not recommend using summer tires when the temperature drops below 40 degrees Fahrenheit or 5 degrees Celsius."
     
  27. George Vosburgh

    George Vosburgh F1 Rookie

    May 26, 2011
    2,950
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Well all I can say is I learned my lesson and no one got hurt. The car will be better than when I gave it to them, as long as it's there they are doing all the wheels over which I'm looking forward to!
     
  28. Skidkid

    Skidkid F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Aug 25, 2005
    6,509
    Campbell, CA
    Full Name:
    John Zornes
    Yep. That is because they are downright exciting at those temps. Traction is terrible when cold.
     

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