parking brake caliper to compliment big brake conversion | Page 2 | FerrariChat

parking brake caliper to compliment big brake conversion

Discussion in '308/328' started by wildegroot, Jun 22, 2008.

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  1. regisgtb4

    regisgtb4 Formula Junior
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    After reading all your posts I was reminded of reading in Fitzgerald and Merrit of the 50s and 60s when Works and customers Cars ran side by side.The Factory Cars had stuff the customers couldnt have. Your ride looks like a "Works" model,loaded with cool go fast goodies that are beautifully done and would cost a fortune if billed out hourly,so N/A for all intents and purposes.Thanks to you and the other rodders for great ideas on making 308s "go like hell".
     
  2. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    #27 wildegroot, Jun 28, 2008
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2008
    Well, thanks for the complimentary words and you are right about the costs. I've had several people ask what it would cost for us to do it on another 308 and I just told them to forget about it. I stopped counting a long time ago but the price would be more than the value of the unmodified car. Speaking of modified: I've been careful to keep most (99%) of the work reversible back to stock. The remaining 1% is where you can't see it and can be changed back with a little fabrication work.
     
  3. Protouring442

    Protouring442 F1 Veteran

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    The thing that makes your car so cool is that it looks like it could be stock. In fact, someone not familiar with Ferraris might actually conclude that it "came that way." Sometimes when modifying a car, people get into doing a lot of modifications simply because they can, and miss out on the subtleties that make a job like the one you have accomplished look so amazing. In the case of a well done car (like yours) you need to look carefully to try and see where the modifications stop and stock begins.

    Shiny Side Up!
    Bill
     
  4. regisgtb4

    regisgtb4 Formula Junior
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    I have been studing your e brake which I think is the way to go and a solution I would never have thought of when I noticed that your upper a arm appears drilled for lightness. I have seen tubular arms offered for racing and I wonder if you could comment on the stiffness of OEM and the possible advantage of tubular replacements or drilling the OEM? thanks again
     
  5. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    Tubular A-arms would definitely be stiffer than the OEM open channel construction. The problem,as I see it though, is that the rear sub-frame on a 308, which the A-arms connect to, is not as rigid as it can be and the rear stub-axles are known to fail under racing-type loads. I don't intend to ever run this car on slicks, which can generate significantly higher cornering forces, so hopefully everything will survive. If you're going to strengthen links in the chain you've got to look at all the links.

    I did stiffen the arms a bit by welding-in triangulating links here and there between the U-channels and the center pans and I drilled lightening holes in parts which I figured would be under less stress. Under a steady cornering load, the lower A-arm at the outside wheel is under a compression load while the upper arm is under tension but to a lesser degree.

    Among other modifications in the plans are a "strut tower brace" between the upper shock/spring mounts to help stiffen the rear sub-frame.
     
  6. luckydynes

    luckydynes F1 Rookie

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    #31 luckydynes, Jul 25, 2008
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2008
    Awesome work mate!

    FYI Prototrak mills just rock for this kind of stuff . . . you and MKE should both have one :).

    edit: I have full CNC but use my 2 axis Prototrak with manual Z for 99% of my work . . . they are incredible machines for protoyping and runs less than 10 pc.
     
  7. luckydynes

    luckydynes F1 Rookie

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    I dig your grill too . .. I knew I'd seen that on here somewhere . .. you got any other pic's of that or point me to a thread? What/where did you get the material? Mcmaster Carr item?

    Thanks,

    Sean
     
  8. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    Right now I'm in the process of trying to get us into a bigger building so that kind of shoots the machine toy budget but I'm very interested to see what you have. Can you post pictures and a link? Thanks in advance.
     
  9. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    Yeah, it's funny - with all the work I put into that car I get the most positive comments about the grille. No I've never posted anything about the grille in particular.

    Actually, we get a McMaster-Carr delivery almost every day and most likely they sell the material but it's 1/2" (12mm) stainless steel screen (hardware cloth) from Pegasus racing, wrapped around a frame made of 3/8" (10mm) round aluminum rod (#3003 "alloy" I think).
     
  10. luckydynes

    luckydynes F1 Rookie

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    thanks for the info and another pic would be nice :)

    I'll get you more info on the Prototraks (no affiliation, etc.) . . I can't say enough good things about 'em . . . I luv the manual Z for ramping in vs. having to program everything . .. I'd had my machine shop/design biz for 8 years and no one pushed 'em on me . .. I bought one used in 2002? for like $8k with an automatic drawbar tightener (the 3/8" air ratchet setup on top of the drawbar . .. another thing I thought was cheezy at first but are priceless for $800).

    The manual machinist that taught me (English guy who did an apprenticeship . . .. he's 60'ish) even uses 'em now :) . . .. just being able to repeat hole patttens paid for itself . . . then I started engraving parts on 1 and 2 pc's just 'cause I could and it's that easy :) . .. was having to pull the quill up for each letter but it was good paying work :).


    Cheers
     
  11. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

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    Nice looking set up Wil. I bought a pair of mechanical wilwood calipers I'm going to try to use on mine...but might end up just scrapping them and doing something like you did.

    We have prototracs at work and the guys seem to like them. I also most bought a used one when I bought my mill but some other expenses popped up and I couldn't justifiy it since I didn't have any big projects planned anyway :)
     
  12. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    I actually googled that set-up last night. It's basically a retrofit kit for a Bridgeport and it's clones. I like the fact that it apparently comes with new ball screws for the X and Y table feeds. My machine's feed screws are getting sloppy. Without a DRO they'd be close to useless. Yeah any information would be appreciated. The website didn't tell much. I have no CNC experience but I once looked at a small CNC mill that had pre-programmed shapes like a cube, a hemisphere, half an egg, etc that you could change length, width and height on. That was pretty interesting but the guy changed his mind about selling it and I moved on. My DRO will guide you through circular bolt patterns by the way.

    I'll take some pictures of the grille and post them here.
     
  13. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    Thanks Mark. I generally don't like sliding-pot brake calipers but I was half way through with these and decided I should have made these parking calipers sliding-pot. Having too much work into them to just start over, I continued with the design I had. The calipers I made work very well but they could have been even better and even lighter.
     
  14. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    #39 wildegroot, Aug 1, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Sorry to take so long but here are some photos of my 308 grille. In the close-up you can see very small stainless alen-head machine screws, to the left of the parking lamp, that attach the grille to the car via specially made brackets. Like I said before: The stainless hardware cloth is wrapped around a frame made of 3/8" (10mm) aluminum rod. The lights are generic sealed, throw away, truck/trailer lights. I wanted long narrow vertical lights so the air to the inter-cooler heat exchangers would be blocked as little as possible.
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  15. regisgtb4

    regisgtb4 Formula Junior
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    #40 regisgtb4, Aug 1, 2008
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    Whats she weigh now and then? Was that a consideration? Honestly when I saw the first post and that grille I thought you may have played for the Lakers,bling,bling, but the grille is just like my momma likes her filets,well done.
     
  16. chrismorse

    chrismorse Formula 3

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    Hi will,

    I did a big brake & oil cooler upgrade and always kept in the back of my mind, keep it reversable. I am totally behind the big brake upgrade, the car really stops, less than zero fade, ( is that possible), and the oil cooler is cheaper than stock, hoses less expensive than stock and the thermostat makes the car more driveable by geting the oil temp up to spec quick.

    recoverable costs - fugattaboutit. I put 7 k into used calipers, front discs, custom hats, new rear discs, custom caliper brackets and hats and about a k into making a wilwood mc work.

    recoverability- zip.

    Would i do it again? IN A HEART BEAT.

    Does it stop?? yes.

    Is it running cool?? yes.

    + for brothers in arms,
    chris
     
  17. regisgtb4

    regisgtb4 Formula Junior
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    I really dig your binders,FORZA,Chris
     
  18. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    I have no idea what she weighs at the moment. I have a set of race car scales and used them to set corner weights a while ago but didn't really pay too much attention to the total weight because it is is what it is. I'll have to check it out one day. I reduced weight here and there but also increased it here and there. The car has no spare tire, an aluminum radiator, lighter fan, no more carburetors, no distributor, a lighter exhaust system, a lighter AC compressor, etc but the super-charger and the bigger brakes are not exactly light weight. I want to make a carbon fiber engine cover a front trunk lid. The steel engine cover weighs a ton and sits up high and in the back where you don't want weight.
     
  19. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    #44 wildegroot, Aug 1, 2008
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2008
    That's funny, I bought used calipers too. I bought the the front and rear calipers and 4 front rotors for a Porsche 996 (I think) Turbo at Porsche Recycling in LA. The stuff came off of low mileage wrecks and was good and not too expensive. I made the hats from aluminum billet. My master cylinders are Tilton but I bought them new.

    Speaking of budget brake systems, I scratch built a sports car using Maserati Quattroporte III mechanicals and I'm upgrading the brakes on that right now. I inherited a set of Brembo calipers that came off of a customer's Diablo after installing even bigger brakes on that car and I'm mounting them over Wilwood racing disks with Wilwood aluminum hats on custom made 7075 aluminum hubs. The Wilwood hats came with a 4.5" wheel bolt circle that fits right over the Maserati 115mm wheel stud circle.
     
  20. luckydynes

    luckydynes F1 Rookie

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    #45 luckydynes, Aug 13, 2008
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    I did a couple of these on my prototrak . . I wouldn't even try it on my regular CNC . .. being able to adjust the quill on the fly and have your face right there is priceless on projects like this :)
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  21. chrismorse

    chrismorse Formula 3

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    Hey Sean,

    This really looks like the way to go.

    What do you use for a gasket/o ring material???

    Could you be persuaded to do this to another set of cam covers???

    Hopefully,
    chris
     
  22. luckydynes

    luckydynes F1 Rookie

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    kinda like Wil on that one and cost . .. it's not just the o-ring groove . . gotta stand 'em on end and re-cut the seal c'bore half . . . I don't think it's worth doing unless you want to take the cam cover off as much as I do . . . cheers to you if you do mate :).

    Sean
     
  23. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    What, you cant do that with hand cranks? Just kidding. That's great!
     
  24. luckydynes

    luckydynes F1 Rookie

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    um . . dude . . change where you buy your gaskets if you're getting hammered for $75 ea . . ouch!

    the place you got your gears from shouldn't be doing that to you are they?
     
  25. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    You can buy O-ring string in all sizes from industrial suppliers. The best is Viton. It's usually brown.
     

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