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Please, Please.........kill off CART !!!!!!!!

Discussion in 'Other Racing' started by FLATOUTRACING, Apr 18, 2004.

  1. FLATOUTRACING

    FLATOUTRACING F1 Rookie

    Aug 20, 2001
    2,684
    East Coast
    Full Name:
    Jon K.
    I never thought I would say this but after today's coverage of the Long Beach CART race I am begging someone to please end the misery and kill off CART !!!!!!!!!

    I was a long time CART fan from the days of Sullivan, Rahal, Unser Sr., Ma. Andretti, Fittipaldi and so on. Supported them after the split by refusing to attend any Indy 500's there after (been to 9 of them before IRL) and have been a steadfast fan of CART even through last year................BUT

    .....this years TV package is beyond all hope, the competition has become so sad that Justin Wilson (whose never run a Champ car nor been to Long Beach) got into a car that literally was built and tested 5 days ago and turned the fastest lap and placed 6th after a bad fuel strategy and to boot he complained of a misfire the entire race.

    I guess my my main grip is the aweful TV package. Here are my main gripes:

    1) No Paul Page or Bob Varsha. Jenkins is the worst motorsports announcer in the history of racing. Remember his aweful attempt at the Indy GP a few years ago with Eddie Cheever. Boy was I glad he was stuck with the IRL crowd but now even they figured out how bad he sucks. And to top it off it took him three tries to get Tarso Marques name even remotely right. He got Patrick Carpentier's name wrong half the time and also screwed up Alex Tagliani's name a few times. Sometime, just like the Indy GP, he didn't know the driver of a particular car and just said "...THAT CAR"

    2) I skipped through the commericals and calculated that of the 2 hour broadcast there was only 57 minutes of air time (the rest were commercials) and of that 57 minutes about 10-12 minutes was devoted to seeing the nice multimillion dollar spread of that 17 year olds parents, who obviously are footing his bill to be in CART

    AND

    At least 5 minutes to see Paul Tracy's Winnebago complete with secret closet being toured by Tagliani's model wife who wouldn't have a job if her husband wasn't in CART.

    So basically there was about 48 minutes of real racing, less if you count the 10 minute delay over the 1st corner maylay.

    3) Why the hell are they calling the adjustable boost knob a "passing button" and why are the making a big deal over the softer tire compound calling it the special compound.

    Forget the damn passing button I want a MUTE button on my remote where I can mute Jenkins everytime he opens his mouth.

    4) Can't really distinguish the cars and half of them have no sponsors.

    5) Why or why, do they even bother to interview Bruno when he comes in second. He never ever smiles, never ever thanks his team, never says a positive thing about CART (today he griped that the rules suck and screwed up his race). And he always has sourpuss look on his face and a zillion excuses why he couldn't catch Tracy. It's never cause Paul is faster, it's traffic, it's the stupid CART rules, it's the crappy Bridgestones, ................. face it Bruno, you'd need that passing button on the whole race to catch PT, you loser !!!!!

    6) Speaking of passing, there is none even with the special "passing button" and the even more special "passing tires". I saw one pass for position the entire race and it was for 11th spot. At least in F1 the backmarkers do some passing even if there is little done at the front.

    What a shame! I can remember driving hours to attend CART races here on the east coast at places like Mid-Ohio, the Meadowlands, the Detroit GP, the Cleveland GP, the Indy 500, Michigan and so on.

    I got to see Sullivan spin and win the 500, saw Unser and Fittapaldi go wheel to wheel in turn 3 with one lap to go at 220 mph with both touching wheels and Unser ending up in the wall, but getting out of his car and giving Emmo the thumbs up sign when he went by the next lap for the win.

    Saw Goodyear and Unser cross the finish line at the 500 1/1000ths of a second apart, Nigel Mansell take the CART title, GV's son win the 500 and the Cart title, Zanardi's famous pass against Herta through the corkscrew at Laguna in the sand, Juan Pablo passing everyone on restarts on cold tires like he had an extra 200 hp.............

    and now we have some spoiled 17 year old brat whose wealthy parents bought him a joy ride in CART, a washed up has been F1 backmarker (Tarso), and a bunch of Mexican's who are in CART because their corporate sponsors want US exposure (nothing against the great country of Mexico, but other than Jourdain, the rest should be fighting it out on Toyota Atlantic) and a few backmarkers who aren't qualified to drive the CART pace car much less a 900 hp Champ car. And then we have Bruno, who couldn't cut in with Ganassi, had to cheat like hell in F3000, did poorly in his F1 tests, and *****es and whinnes like a 4 yr old about PT kicking his %##!

    I was totally anti-IRL until two years ago and had nothing but contempt for Tone George, but he understands what the fans want (or at least does now) and has put CART under.

    And to think I only had one VCR tape today and skipped taping 2 hours of Grand Am Cup racing for this sad excuse for racing.

    Sad day for CART!

    Regards,

    Jon P. Kofod
    www.flatoutracing.net
     
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  3. beast

    beast F1 Veteran

    May 31, 2003
    8,965
    Lewisville, TX
    Full Name:
    Rob Guess
    WOW CART had a race this weekend. HMMMM i wonder what rock they held it under. I agree CART has been n a slide for ages And as for the IRL well i have yet to watch a single race they have had.
     
  4. WCH

    WCH F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Mar 16, 2003
    5,179
    "Nigel Mansell take the CART title"

    At Nazareth? I was there! Ridiculous place to watch a race, really, with 19 second laps.

    CART is no longer the Big Show? Used to be, you'd walk through the paddock and see the best North American teams and drivers, deep fields, of the world's best drivers. Now ... ALMS and Grand Am support races have more interesting cars and drivers, and better TV coverage.

    Maybe if they hold really big name concerts, and sandwich the race between acts, attendance numbers will improve.
     
  5. FLATOUTRACING

    FLATOUTRACING F1 Rookie

    Aug 20, 2001
    2,684
    East Coast
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    Jon K.
    Rob,

    I don't watch IRL as an alternative to CART, in fact they are so different they really can't be compared. Given the choice I would watch CART (well not after yesterday's coverage) but IRL has all the good drivers and it is exciting to watch NASCAR style racing with open wheel cars going three wide at TMS at over 220 mph.

    Just think of it as a more technologically advanced form of NASCAR with cars that don't resemble rolling bill boards.

    IRL isn't all that bad to watch. In fact from a TV viewers standpoint, CART needs to take notes from ABC/ESPN/IRL and Fox/NBC/NASCAR.

    Ironic but many of my racing buddies said the same thing last night "..........what, there was a CART race today......where???"

    Sad predicament!

    Jon
     
  6. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Dec 6, 2002
    73,162
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Bubba
    Tagliani's wife checking out Paul Tracey's secret closet?????

    Maybe they are shifting to a soap opera format! (Here baby, try on this!)

    I hate to bet against Gentilozzi, because I admire him as a racer and owner,
    but they have done so much damage with mismanagement prior to the his buy in that it make take years or more to recover, if then.

    Does this mean they won't have a fifth Houston Grand Prix????
    I doubt they have many fans left, in Dallas!!!! LOL!!!!
     
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  8. Gary(SF)

    Gary(SF) F1 Rookie

    Oct 13, 2003
    3,637
    Los Altos Hills, CA
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    Gary B.
    Jon -

    Sadly I agree with everything you say. I decided to skip buying tickets to this year's event, and almost had second thoughts just a few days ago when it was obvious the race would actually happen, but had made other commitments. Watched the tape last night and was appalled at the quality (lack thereof) of the racing. What a shame, it used to be a great series. Four or five years ago I looked forward to CART on TV more than F1.

    Gary
     
  9. kevfla

    kevfla Formula 3

    Nov 20, 2003
    1,977
    Full Name:
    gone 4 good
    "No Paul Page or Bob Varsha. Jenkins is the worst motorsports announcer in the history of racing. Remember his aweful attempt at the Indy GP a few years ago with Eddie Cheever. Boy was I glad he was stuck with the IRL crowd but now even they figured out how bad he sucks. And to top it off it took him three tries to get Tarso Marques name even remotely right. He got Patrick Carpentier's name wrong half the time and also screwed up Alex Tagliani's name a few times. Sometime, just like the Indy GP, he didn't know the driver of a particular car and just said "...THAT CAR" [end quote]

    Jenkins is better suited announcing the weather on TV in a small market like Paducah! (no offense to the residents of Paducah). He is such a snoozer. Reacts to incidents on a race seconds after witnessing them. Like bad turbo-lag and provided no insight whatsoever. Maybe he's pre-Alzheimers? Time to put this guy out to pasture!

    KevFla
     
  10. Senna1994

    Senna1994 F1 World Champ

    Nov 11, 2003
    12,796
    San Clemente
    Full Name:
    Anthony Tonokaboni
    This was my last time attending the LBGP, I have only missed it once in the passed 18 years. It was extremely pooring and the once great quality about it was missing. I remember how exciting it was in the 90's. I hate to say this, but I agree with Jon, I hope they kill off the series or merge it with IRL.
     
  11. rob lay

    rob lay Administrator
    Staff Member Admin Social Subscribed Miami 2018 Owner

    Dec 1, 2000
    50,818
    Southlake, TX
    Full Name:
    Rob Lay
    Wow, I didn't see the race, but from the Speed TV article today I was going to apologize to everyone for bashing CART the past year. Maybe I should hold back that apology. The article made it sound like everything was great with 18 entries and 65,000 people attending.
     
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  13. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Dec 6, 2002
    73,162
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Bubba
    That was CART's problem, they believed their own press releases! I stood around with those guys, in tuxes, as the ship slid beneath the waves.

    Sounded like the Trans Am race banged some fenders anyway. Gentilozzi is like that Remington shaver guy, ......"I liked this so much I bought the company"

    That said, I'm glad they got 18 cars. We'll see. This whole thing has killed the sport in the US. Public attention has wandered away!
     
  14. jj2728

    jj2728 Karting

    Jan 19, 2004
    194
    Ontario
    fully agree with what's been said.....the race was a total snoozefest....sad to say, but until there is one and only one top flight open wheel series in north america it'll be awhile before we see a return to the glory days.....almost seems to me to be a formula spec series....lolas (bar 2 reynards) powered by ford....sorry, but it's second rate at best anymore.....
     
  15. lawwdog

    lawwdog Formula 3

    Dec 4, 2002
    1,178
    Northern California
    Full Name:
    Mario
    I hate to say this but I actually dozed off watching the race...and I was sitting in grand stand 24 at the hair pin!!!!!!!!


    The Long Beach Gran Prix has been an anual boys trip for some years now and I/we always look forward to it. The weather, the girls, the racing, the girls, the atmosphere and the girls always keep us coming back.

    This years race was boring! I'm sad to say it but I hope F1 goes to long beach and the Champ Car series resurects itself with big names and more race cars. The 17 year old kid in Car number 17 missed the track line for 60 + laps and missed shifts consistently as he ran down the straight!

    Good for Paul Tracy who put his balls on the line at the start...only problem...the race ended after the first lap.

    Bruno and Alex have a personallity like a rock. I watched them judge the Tecati girl pagent Saturday afternoon and they didn't even pay attention...and they should have.

    Anyway, I like the venue, I like racing, the series has no soul.....
     
  16. F129b

    F129b Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 6, 2004
    460
    oc, calif.
    Full Name:
    Robert
    YES to ALL.
    Sadly I have watched CART go from being more exciting (to me in the 90's) than F1 to what it is now- a spec. series with second, if not third-rate drivers and teams.
    I used to love this series and didn't used miss a race. Now I have zero interest or enthusiasm. Sad, sad , sad.
    Fuk that Tony George. His greed knocked over the first domino that sent CART into it's demise. Bastard!
     
  17. sduke

    sduke Formula Junior

    Mar 10, 2003
    825
    The Hub City, Texas
    Full Name:
    Steven D
    John

    I am so disappointed in CART. I really wanted them to make IRL look stupid. I hate open-wheel NASCAR. To only turn left is a travesty.

    The LBGP was one of the worst races I have ever tried to watch. I actually left the house for a while. I had watched the Moto GP on Speed earlier, so maybe that affected my outlook (Rossi is a god). But the CART situation is appalling. Is Tracy staying because he has no place else to go? The Bridgestone option tire was a joke. I had hoped for a lot more after the PR Bridgestone pumped out regarding the tires. Not only was there no additional passing due to the tires, it was obvious the teams thought very little of the option tires.

    I hate to agree with John so completely.....but this incarnation of CART must die. I would like to think that an open wheel series that combines road racing and some ovals would be a viable series. The IRL is NOT the answer, and certainly CART is not the answer.

    If only F1 would add a second US venue!
     
  18. Mark(study)

    Mark(study) F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Oct 13, 2001
    5,913
    Clearwater, FL
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    Mark
    Its time for cart to die and go away.

    Fuk Tony for killing it! But at this point it needs to die and go away.

    Will Paul T have a ride at the Indy 500?
     
  19. Senna1994

    Senna1994 F1 World Champ

    Nov 11, 2003
    12,796
    San Clemente
    Full Name:
    Anthony Tonokaboni
    Mark, I don't think Tracy wants to race at the 500 since what happened to him there in 02. I was in Grandstand 30, and I had a much better time at the Yardhouse instead of at my Seat. How unfortunate that CART has slipped so bad. Very Sad.
     
  20. aawil

    aawil Formula 3

    Aug 10, 2002
    1,279
    NJ
    Full Name:
    Aaron
    I didn't think the racing is the problem.Road racing has never been overly exciting.The coverage as everyone said is horrible.I have hope that it will get better.The people they got doing it have no racing experience.What's interesting is even in the ESPN days cart coverage was excellant when it came to camera views and such.Hopefully they learned a few things.
     
  21. DMC

    DMC Formula 3

    Nov 15, 2002
    2,360
    WI/IL
    Full Name:
    Dean
    Wow, all that we went through to get to this season, and you guys want to kill it off right away.

    Sure it was a boring race. Most street races are these days. I think there are some funamental aero issues that need to be addressed before the option tire and push to pass really make a difference. You have to be able to set up a pass by sitting on your target's gearbox for a couple of laps. My guess is that the front end washes out too much for anyone to get close. Given the disparity in lap times througout the race (Junky did manage to catch up to Tracy, but not close enough to pass), you'd think there would have been more action.

    The lack of yellow flags in a street race shows that there is some talent out there. Except for Gonzales and Sperafico, this is a very deep field, better than last year.

    Most of this should be ironed out by Cleveland. If it's not ironed out by Road America, I may join in with the bashing. The new owners have shown that they are willing to listen to the fans and make changes. Don't expect everything to be perfect right away.

    I'll be waiting for Rob's apology. And everyone else's. :)
     
  22. DMC

    DMC Formula 3

    Nov 15, 2002
    2,360
    WI/IL
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    Dean
    Tracy will never drive in the Irrelevant 500 again.

    Junky will this year, giving him something else to whine about. "Oh, that Sam Hornish, I tell you, he should not be on the track with me..."
     
  23. FLATOUTRACING

    FLATOUTRACING F1 Rookie

    Aug 20, 2001
    2,684
    East Coast
    Full Name:
    Jon K.
    DMC,


    Some of my gripes I will give them time one, but the TV package is something they could've gotten right from the start. Things like getting sponsors, changing aspects of the cars design to make things more exciting take time and I am more than willing to sit back and wait BUT...........

    ........the TV package was negotiated months ago and THIS IS WHAT WE GOT?????????

    Bob Jenkins? what were they thinking. It's not like this is a commentator that some like and some don't. Find me on person or one postive comment on Jenkins not associated with one of his family members.

    Hell, you could simply have put Calvin Fish in the booth with Tommy Kendal, or any other number of people (Varsha, Page, Daly, Derek Bell, Johnny O'Connel, you name it......).

    Jenkins has never raced anything in his life bar his wife's minvan, all the people I listed above either raced at very high levels or have been successful parts of the motorscecne for years.

    If the other people couldn't get involved because of contracts with competing TV networks at least put Calvin Fish in the booth.

    This is afterall a man who beat Ayrton Senna in F3 in England on several occasions....he might know a thing or two about open wheel cars.

    My main point is that if they couldn't get a simple thing like decent TV coverage right with three or four months time everything else is going to be a whole lot harder.

    "Give em a chance, give em time, wait until mid season....................."

    I've heard this each of the past 4 season when new owners, like the grand Mr. Pooch have taken over. In each case the people at the top made a lot of money and bailed before bankruptcy.

    The only good thing about the current setup is that if CART does fail those at the top like Paul G. stand to lose a lot of money.

    Of course I'll be able to buy a nice Lola with some Ford engines for track days!

    Regards,

    Jon


    PS: As far as the abscence of yellow flags, that has more to do with the abscence of wheel to wheel racing and the huge gaps between all the drivers than anything positive related.
     
  24. FLATOUTRACING

    FLATOUTRACING F1 Rookie

    Aug 20, 2001
    2,684
    East Coast
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    Jon K.

    Can you image if that had been Junky that got shafted at the 500 instead of PT. We'd still be hearing him cry and whine through every broadcast.

    Can't stand the guy despite the fact that is a world class driver.

    Jon
     

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