Project-Scuderia

Subscribed....

 

freakin' awesome thread..keep it coming

 

This one's gonna be good. Love it already. Subscribed.

 

Agree the radio and speakers are useless. I have considered removing mine as well, do you have a photo of the rear firewall after removal of the subwoffer enclosure? Also assume we can source the "original" plate to replace the radio in the dash, anyone recommend a souce besides Ferrari?

 

Quick Question there is only one speaker behind the two tiny sub woofers in the front dash right and also only 1 set of wiring as I would like to add one behind the empty cover

 

Nice pics! I have the oil filter tool for the 360/430/Enzo if you ever need to borrow it. Keep up the good work.

 

Awesome thread!

 

Sorry I meant tweeters, only one of these covers actually has a speaker behind right ?
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Is that located behind the seat ?

 

Sorry for the slow reply, I have been away for a week. My definition of dry weight is the weight of the standard vehicle without fuel; but including oils, coolant, battery and everything else required to operate the car. I believe this is probably a European standard as every Ferrari I have weighed is near enough to bang on Ferraris published dry weight figure. This method would seem to be what many magazines such as EVO use in their road tests when they do full performance testing. For some reason American magazines that I have read weigh them with half a tank of fuel and sometimes add a given weight for a driver and quote that as a kerb weight. This seems to introduce some error to me and makes the figure useless for comparisons.
Kerb weight can be variable. I haven't checked what the Scuderia book suggests; but in the past Ferrari have used the dry weight plus "x" litres of fuel and "y" kg for a driver. I seem to recall this was the case for my 308 GTB; but it's a long while since I checked.

So it seemed logical to me that the easiest method was to weigh the car fully fuelled with tool kit and inflation bottle. Then you can adjust for dry weight by deducting fuel and anything else on your above list. I never thought about the washer bottle water; but as it happened it was empty when I made my initial measurements.

 

Ahh but have you compensated for the mass of the two plastic studs?

No, seriously, I like what you're doing. Keep it up!

 

That's why I'm a little confused since dry weight usually means without fluids.

Here's a quote from Wikipedia...
--

Dry weight is the weight of a vehicle without any consumables, passengers, or cargo.

It is one of the two common weight measurements included in road vehicle specifications, the other one being curb weight.

By definition, dry weight does not include any of the following:

Gasoline, diesel or any other fuel
Engine oil
Coolant
Brake fluid
Power steering fluid
Transmission fluid
Washer fluid

The difference between dry weight and curb weight depends on many variables such as the capacity of the fuel tank.

Over time, most domestic vehicle manufacturers have more commonly used the term 'shipping weight', which refers to the vehicle in as-built, no-option condition.

This would include engine oil, coolant, brake fluid and at least some small quantity of fuel, as vehicles have traditionally been driven off the assembly line and these fluids were necessary to do so. Hobbyists have debated the accuracy of these figures, as they often seem low versus occasional real world checks on the same-specification vehicle. One theory is that shipping weight was intentionally calculated on the low side to realize a cost savings in the freight transport of vehicles across the country.
--

And here's another link information

http://ateupwithmotor.com/automotive-terms/215-weighty-issue-1.html

Dry Weight
Dry weight is a vehicle's unladen weight with a completely empty fuel tank and no engine oil, coolant, or other fluids. As you can probably guess, dry weight is consequently much less than the car's actual, on-the-road weight. A gallon of water weighs about 8.4 lb (3.8 kg), a gallon of gasoline about 6.3 lb (2.9 kg), so just adding fluids and filling the gas tank can add 150 lb (68 kg) or more to a car's dry weight.

Since passenger cars are generally (though not always) shipped with oil, coolant, and other vital fluids, dry weight is not often quoted for complete automobiles, although the term is sometimes used, albeit not always correctly, as a synonym for shipping weight. However, the quoted weights of automotive engines are almost always dry weights (and may or may not include accessories or the weight of the flywheel or flex plate).

 

I agree, that's the typical definition of "dry weight". However I weighed my Scuderia on full tanks, subtracted the weight of the fuel and got 1350kg, exactly the same as Ferrari quoted "dry weight".
Having done this on a number of Ferraris over the years, the results are always the same which tells me that is the system Ferrari uses and has used for a long time. I have weighed a 308 GTB, 512 BB, Testarossa, F40, Scuderia and the results were all the same as Ferrari quoted dry weight.

In any case I will weigh the car on full tanks at each stage, so it's an effective baseline to use and the results of each modification will be easily and accurately measured.

There is a tremendous variation in possible weights of a Scuderia depending on the options chosen.
No matter what you choose, you won't get close to the weight of Ferrari press car that EVO magazine tested. They weighed it on full tanks and got 1374kg if I recall correctly. My car is "stripper spec" and that's about 26kg lighter than mine with every single one of the carbon fibre panels on the option list.
My theory is the test car had carbon fibre front and rear bumpers, as the standard ones are seriously heavy with the inbuilt crash structures. I will know how they did it by the time my project is finished.

 

Thanks for the interesting information.

I am not sure that 'dry weight' can be re-defined to not include other fluids though in the way you describe since then it wouldn't actually be a dry weight. It is more likely to be a coincidence (on the Ferrari quoted weights) due to numerous other factors which have not been included in the weight you have seen. I can absolutely see how the data you've seen could seem to fit the model but I believe there are so many other variables that could be responsible for that.

I noticed your in the Australian geography. The different geographies can and do indeed account for considerable variances in specs including the final performance and weight of cars beyond options chosen. Not just the dry and kerb weights of cars but also the acceleration, the emissions and the mpg ratings, even the handling is tweaked (softer springs, height ride heights, slightly different geometries, etc.) yet Ferrari typically quote the same stats for all geographies. This is most certainly not the case either. As an example many people already know that European imports of 360's are quicker cars than the US destined cars because they weight less and don't have header cats. Yet the official performance stats quoted don't change!

Ferrari I think tend to quote the all performance data in the best possible configuration. Not all car regions can achieve those specs due to local regulations and laws. For example 360 cars destined for the US have a lot more safety kit and emissions hardware installed to meet the tougher legislation than in Europe. This can easily add 100kg's to the weight of the car. Examples include cold start air injection, larger heavier main cats, additional header cats with integrated header air injection rails, rubber inserts into the bumper mountings, etc. etc. On the Australian spec cars I further note no part of the car body work or grilles can transmit any heat so the cars are made heavier by incorporating all the extra heat barrier materials. Furthermore in Europe we can still have the option of Lexan Side windows too and its perfectly legal to use racing harnesses and roll caged cars on the street.

From my Euro spec 360 I've been able to junk near as dammit 200kg's from the total weight of my car. That's a huge amount but bear in mind a full exhaust system alone weight is 51kg's so in titanium you can easily lose 35-40kg's in one go. Then the 20kg acid battery can come in under 10kg's in latest lithuim technology. That's 50k'g gone with just exhaust and battery. I also seem to remember that during the Scud model early cars came with different batteries than later models. In fact you can get a gel battery and I assume the Evo scud had the lightweight Gel battery fitted saving at least another 10kg's.

 

Just a question,

Why do you still need to run the 28mm GT2 air restrictors? Can you not simply replace the intakes with full size ones and get the engine remapped for the new air flow? Surely it would run over 500hp then? Or is this a racing regulations issue rather than a technical one?

 

I'm really enjoying this thread!