Rebuilding a Dinoplex AEC103A | Page 4 | FerrariChat

Rebuilding a Dinoplex AEC103A

Discussion in '206/246' started by alhbln, Mar 5, 2010.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

Page 4 of 12
  1. AusDino

    AusDino Formula Junior

    Jul 5, 2005
    498
    Bris
    Full Name:
    Peter
    #76 AusDino, Jun 14, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Thanks Adrian.

    A few pictures of my version of your conversion. Just need a new plate for the dinoplex and to install the emergency coil (now useless , though need it for originality).

    My current setup is a Dinoplex AEC104 bw and was supplied from Ferrari as a replacement kit (with plugs, wiring diagram & coil) in 1984 - it originally had an aftermarket kit of what brand I don't remember - the first thing I had to replace.

    The original car wiring has a three pin plug, with tacho [brown], points [blue] and ignition [yellow] as do the plugs for the emergency coil and to the Dinoplex. A little bit different to your diagram.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  2. alhbln

    alhbln Formula 3
    Consultant Owner

    Mar 4, 2008
    1,749
    Berlin, Germany
    Full Name:
    Adrian
    #77 alhbln, Jun 14, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    That is interesting, by the manufacturing date your Dino should have got a six terminal adapter and a single coil setup, but it seems you got one of the last three connector setups with a dual coil.
    Good Job! Your wiring looks good (don't forget a solid ground connection to the AEC103 box), i'll have added the three terminal wiring just for completeness. Would recommend to use a set of NGK BPR7EIX or EVX spark plugs with this setup.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  3. AusDino

    AusDino Formula Junior

    Jul 5, 2005
    498
    Bris
    Full Name:
    Peter
    #78 AusDino, Jun 14, 2011
    I'm already running the NGK BPR7EIX - made a huge difference in starting !
     
  4. AusDino

    AusDino Formula Junior

    Jul 5, 2005
    498
    Bris
    Full Name:
    Peter
    #79 AusDino, Jun 14, 2011
    Adrian, just a note on the wiring. I included the tacho(brown) wire in the sheath[with blue & yellow wires] going to the 3 pin plug. This mated to the car plug which contains the tacho wire at the weber carb microswitch position. I also retained the points(blue) wire from AEC103A to car 3 pin plug - to keep things original looking. Just left blind insulated end in dinoplex and attached to & insulated in distributor.
    I have no wiring in the boot or engine bay or distributor for the microswitch and no microswitch on my throttle linkage - another anomaly ?
     
  5. alhbln

    alhbln Formula 3
    Consultant Owner

    Mar 4, 2008
    1,749
    Berlin, Germany
    Full Name:
    Adrian
    #80 alhbln, Jun 15, 2011
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2011
    Peter,

    wiring sounds good, just make sure that the brown wire is not connected to the blue wire in the future setup (dotted brown line in the chart, remove). Did a bit of research on your car, the interesting thing is that your Dino should have the microswitch for the emission control setup, as that was introduced a month or two before for RHD Dinos, together with the change to the S125C. Dino factory configurations are not an exact science though, there are out of the line setups around the time of factory changes, so nothing to worry about.
    What distributor do you have, the S125BX with one screw terminal, or the S125C with two terminals? From your photos it looks like you have an S125C.

    Adrian
     
  6. AusDino

    AusDino Formula Junior

    Jul 5, 2005
    498
    Bris
    Full Name:
    Peter
    #81 AusDino, Jun 15, 2011
    I have 2x S125C's . I picked up a new one complete with cap etc in 1985 for $125 and this is the one in the car now - installed when engine was rebuilt. The one in the pictures is the original out of the car. It has only ever (since 1984) had 1 set of points in.

    Thanks, I'll make sure the wires match up properly.

    Thanks again for you help and information. If you have anymore history of my car, could you PM me .

    cheers
    peter
     
  7. alhbln

    alhbln Formula 3
    Consultant Owner

    Mar 4, 2008
    1,749
    Berlin, Germany
    Full Name:
    Adrian
    #82 alhbln, Jun 15, 2011
    That makes sense, your Dino was indeed delivered with the standard emission control setup for RHD Dinos and had a retard microswitch and emission control, which was the standard setup with the S125C and three terminal connector. The emission control setup (microswitch and black wire, R2 set of points) was most probably removed when the aftermarket ignition was installed.

    For history information you might want to PM GermanDino, he has very deep knowledge into anything Dino and history related.

    Adrian
     
  8. AusDino

    AusDino Formula Junior

    Jul 5, 2005
    498
    Bris
    Full Name:
    Peter
    #83 AusDino, Nov 27, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Thanks Kevin and Adrian for a great thread. Just finished installing and first drive. Its great.
    Starts immediately and runs like a Swiss watch to coin a phrase. Feels to have more torque and idles better.
    The only problem I had was the leading/trailing edge triggering on the chopper and the anticlockwise direction of the rotor. I had to modify the mounting plate for the optical pickup to give enough adjustment to remedy this. I should also note, you need a fairly decent puller to remove drive flange from distributor shaft.

    So in summary, the geared starter, iridium plugs and this Bosch conversion really transforms the starting/hot starting and running. Very happy.

    Boot install and left over bits.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  9. Maeter

    Maeter Karting

    Nov 13, 2001
    136
    #84 Maeter, Jan 8, 2012
    I have noticed through the posts that you are referring to the NGK BPR7EIX spark plug being a better choice than the classic Champion. I have checked on the NGK website which does not indicate that plug as suitable the Dino 2.4 even though it does list a lot of other Italian engines, including the Dino 308.

    Could you confirm that NGK BPR7EIX is a better choice, I am already running the Superformance updated Dinoplex and coil setup?

    Thank you,

    Pascal
     
  10. alhbln

    alhbln Formula 3
    Consultant Owner

    Mar 4, 2008
    1,749
    Berlin, Germany
    Full Name:
    Adrian
    #85 alhbln, Jan 8, 2012
    Yes, i can confirm this.

    There seem to be different NGK databases, the european one (web and print) only has the 206 in the list and recommends BP8EVX (platinum, no resistor, a bit colder) but not the standard BP8ES plug. The ngk.com north america site ony lists the BP8ES - but this site is not owned by NGK but an independent reseller.

    From experience, the BPR7EVX or BPR7EIX is the best choice for the 206/246 engine with a transistor ignition (Superformance, Bosch transistor ignitions, Crane XR700/XR3000/XRi, Pertronix Ignitor, Lumenition Optronics, Black Stallion BSMpdi), as transistor ignitions have a lower secondary voltage and the plug's fine tip lowers the voltage required for the spark to happen. So fine tip plugs help considerably with hot and cold starting and full ignition of too lean or rich mixtures.

    For capacitive ignitions (original Dinoplex AEC101 & AEC103, Crane HI-6, MSD 6A/6AL, Mallory HyFire, Permatune, Bosch HKZ) standard BP's plugs such as the BP8ES are best, as CDI ignitions already have a very high secondary voltage and virtually never have a problem to create a spark at the plug.

    Sorry for the long answer :)
    Adrian
     
  11. Maeter

    Maeter Karting

    Nov 13, 2001
    136
    #86 Maeter, Jan 8, 2012
    Thank you for your complete answer, not "too long" one!
     
  12. DinoDriver

    DinoDriver Formula Junior

    Mar 14, 2005
    537
    Leesburg, VA
    Full Name:
    Bill Ebert
    #87 DinoDriver, Jan 9, 2012
    Does anyone besides me think these heat ranges on the EVX's, EIX's and ES's are too cold? For track work or extremely aggressive high rpm street driving 7,7 and 8 respectively may be okay. For normal use, I'm thinking 6,6,6, respectively, and maybe 5,5,5, if your running a bit rich and/or in traffic more than average.

    Your thoughts,

    Bill
     
  13. Jamie H

    Jamie H Formula 3
    Owner

    Aug 28, 2009
    2,425
    Puslinch,ON
    Full Name:
    Jamie
    #88 Jamie H, Mar 6, 2012
    Quick question,

    Where are you getting the pulse inverter from? I have already created my own but out of interest wanted to know if they are available commercially.

    Thanks

    Jamie
     
  14. alhbln

    alhbln Formula 3
    Consultant Owner

    Mar 4, 2008
    1,749
    Berlin, Germany
    Full Name:
    Adrian
    #89 alhbln, Mar 6, 2012
    They are not available commercially as far as i know. I can provide the eagle files if someone wants to produce circuit boards to build some pulse inverters.
    If you did a Bosch conversion, care to post some photos? Always curious :)
     
  15. Jamie H

    Jamie H Formula 3
    Owner

    Aug 28, 2009
    2,425
    Puslinch,ON
    Full Name:
    Jamie
    #90 Jamie H, Mar 6, 2012
    Thanks Adrian. I just whipped one up from some copper clad board I had lying around.

    The eagle file would be handy and probably a lot neater than my hand drawn one *lol*

    Send it over when you have a chance and I will make one up

    Pictures? Of course!!
     
  16. afer

    afer Karting

    Jun 4, 2009
    122
    Uruguay, S. America
    Full Name:
    Alvaro Ferraro
    #91 afer, Mar 7, 2012
    In January this year I wrote to NGK USA about the spark plugs. Jason Norwood answered me and told that the stock plug is BPR8ES but you can also use the BPR8EIX Iridium plug without problem.
    Alvaro
     
  17. alhbln

    alhbln Formula 3
    Consultant Owner

    Mar 4, 2008
    1,749
    Berlin, Germany
    Full Name:
    Adrian
    #92 alhbln, Mar 7, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  18. Jamie H

    Jamie H Formula 3
    Owner

    Aug 28, 2009
    2,425
    Puslinch,ON
    Full Name:
    Jamie
    #93 Jamie H, Mar 7, 2012
  19. daviekj

    daviekj Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    May 9, 2008
    470
    UK
    #94 daviekj, May 27, 2012
    Thought I would drop a status report on Adrian's Bosche ignition conversion. It's been about 18months and 1000 miles since installation. I am very happy to report there have been no issues. I have not had to touch any part of the ignition system. More to the point, in today's UK 27degC heat I went for an energetic drive and stopped for a re-fuel in the way back. Engine started without problems after two or three starter motor turns. All this with an original starter too. Still a highly recommended conversion.
    Kevin
     
  20. alhbln

    alhbln Formula 3
    Consultant Owner

    Mar 4, 2008
    1,749
    Berlin, Germany
    Full Name:
    Adrian
    #95 alhbln, Nov 22, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    The first of the Bosch conversions now runs since +4 years, happy owners and no failures so far, good :)

    Attached are two pictures of the current conversions for a Lumenition optical pickup, they don't require an additional heatsink or fitting panel anymore. For the newer AEC103 (smaller box) this might be the best choice as a repair of the AEC103 is virtually impossible. For the older Dinoplex C AEC101 (larger box) a repair is easy but if the transformer is broken or the original BZR205A coil is missing, the Bosch conversion can be used to keep the original look.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  21. marianosciacca

    marianosciacca Rookie

    Dec 20, 2012
    18
    #96 marianosciacca, Dec 21, 2012
    Dear Sirs Adrian,
    I have a Lancia Stratos genuine car, with the Ferrari Dino 246 Engine, and AEC 103 A ignition.
    I bought this my car in !)/& in Torino Italy.
    Now I am living in Pantelleria island, Italy.
    Now I purchased a Lumenition OS 50 optical pick Up, and a FK Lumenition 124, as I seen in Dinoplex.org
    I have also the BOSCH Coil 0221122334 and Bosch Module 0227 100 137
    And I have also the Distributor Marelli S125 BX and a S125C
    I need Your Aid and Your Help about only the following:
    Do You can please explain me how I must mount and make the TIMING of Engine and of the Distributors, with this OS 50 Optical pick Up?
    Now with the AEC 103 A the Timing and the running is OK.
    I need detailed Istructions for the above my new modified set up.
    I have also the Wiring scheme of Sir Adrian in His very god site, but I do not have the above instructions.
    Awaiting I remain Yours Fan, mariano sciacca
     
  22. marianosciacca

    marianosciacca Rookie

    Dec 20, 2012
    18
    #97 marianosciacca, Dec 26, 2012
    In my Lancia Stratos as above, I removed the retarded set of point in the S125C and related wiring all.
    And the car go fine.
    Also I wish be advised if You Think pr believe this ok or no.
    Also I have a beatiful S125BX and I wish mount this distributor instead of S125C, because the S125BX has 3 lobe Cam, wich is better of the 6 lobe cam of the S125C.
    What's Yours advise?
    excuse my english...no god but I love English..
    Yours Fan
    mariano
     
  23. Jamie H

    Jamie H Formula 3
    Owner

    Aug 28, 2009
    2,425
    Puslinch,ON
    Full Name:
    Jamie
    #98 Jamie H, Dec 26, 2012
    Mariano,

    Remove the retard set of points will have no overall effect on the performance of your Stratos. The purpose of the retard point set was to change the ignition timing at idle to help reduce hydrocarbon emissions.

    Why do you believe that the 3 lobe cam is better than the 6 lobe cam? You have to deal with 2 sets of points vs the single set in the 6 lobe distributor.
     
  24. marianosciacca

    marianosciacca Rookie

    Dec 20, 2012
    18
    #99 marianosciacca, Dec 27, 2012
    Dear Sir,
    several years ago an Italian Magneti Marelli engineer informed me that the 3 lobe cam in this Distributors family have the principal advantage to eliminate the "saltellamenti" (italian word) at high revolutions....
    I will reply better in a next post.
    Kind Regards
    mariano
     
  25. marianosciacca

    marianosciacca Rookie

    Dec 20, 2012
    18
    #100 marianosciacca, Dec 27, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Dear Sirs,
    in this attachment I am posting several images of my material for my Lancia Stratos, equipped with DINO FERRARI 246 GT Engine genuine.
    purchased in Italy in 1976 from LANCIA.
    I wish optimize the actual AEC 103 A with Lumenition Optical Setup and I have the following spare parts.
    I wish locate the Lumenition OS 50 in the S125BX distributor, and the module BOSCH as the following photos with the genuine Bosch Coil, as You can see in the photos.
    BUT...........
    I am not very able to make the complex work...
    Also I am not able to set the Distributor's Timing
    I will post other images in the next posts.
    Excuse me
    This work will Only a Dream?........
    Yours fan
    mariano sciacca
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
Page 4 of 12

Share This Page