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Silicone hoses for cooling system?

Discussion in '308/328' started by Birdman, Jun 14, 2007.

  1. RGigante

    RGigante F1 Rookie
    Project Master Owner

    Nov 1, 2006
    2,869
    Portugal
    What car is it? In my 328 the front-to-rear "hoses" are not hose, but two aluminium pipes ... only the unions were originally rubber, now silicone.
    The only hose I didn't replace is the 90º at the water pump, for lack of a good fit with Samco silicone hoses. Anyone done that?
     
  2. snj5

    snj5 F1 World Champ

    Feb 22, 2003
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    Russ Turner
    where did you find red?
     
  3. racespecferrari

    racespecferrari F1 Veteran

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    Pete.G By The Sea
  4. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

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    #29 Birdman, Jun 19, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Here is a diagram from the Mondial 8 parts book showing the cooling system. I have highlighted in red the hoses that are rubber hose, rather than pipe. All are straight sections except for the 90 degree one at the top of the radiator. Ought to be very easy to make a silicone kit for this car! Interestingly, Ferrari UK has EACH long section of hose list at £193 (around $400!) YIKES! Makes silicone look downright cheap!

    Birdman
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  5. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

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    Total:
    (8) short connectors (some a little longer than others)
    (2) long hoses
    (1) 90 degree bend
     
  6. TGF

    TGF Formula Junior

    May 1, 2007
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    Tom
    Sounds like we are looking at the birth of the next grass roots Ferrari kit in the making. Very cool. I want a set for my 308 when you guys get it all figured out! :)
     
  7. snj5

    snj5 F1 World Champ

    Feb 22, 2003
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    My engine is currently out of the car, I'm ready.
    Where do I order?
    I am going to be boring and say I would like a set in Non-Bling OEM Black.
    :)
     
  8. 350HPMondial

    350HPMondial F1 Rookie

    Feb 1, 2002
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    The 90 deg. hose is the same as one that's in a 1990's 5.0 mustang kit..

    They came in blue back then, but black would look better in a high visibility area. (IMOA)
     
  9. racespecferrari

    racespecferrari F1 Veteran

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  10. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

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    I'm going to go out on a limb and predict that MOST people will prefer a black kit that looks reasonably close to stock, and there will be a smaller group of people that would want red. Probably not many takers on "stock" silicone blue, except maybe guys with blue cars. (Like me)

    I'll be talking to Chris is VT about putting together a Mondial kit first because I have all the pieces out of my car (almost....the damned water pump has one bolt that doesn't want to come out....working on it).

    Ironically, I will not be able to use the kit since I have already sourced all the components elsewhere, but that is no reason not to make a kit. Because of the lack of the long hoses and the likely higher demand, I'll bet that the 308 will be a lot cheaper of a kit, but I have not spoken to Chris so I have no idea what kind of prices we are talking.

    Birdman
     
  11. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

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    You will notice however on that website that they sell 1 meter long pieces. Not long enough (or even close) to get from the front to the back of a Mondial. The main hoses are 61" long in my car! (almost 2 meters).

    Birdman
     
  12. racespecferrari

    racespecferrari F1 Veteran

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    Samco will supply longer no problem
     
  13. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

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    Pete, did you replace the long hoses yet? What did the inside of yours look like?

    I finally got the water pump out last night and pulled the two short hoses from under the plenum. To my dismay, they looked fine. (I hate when I go to a lot of trouble to replace a part only to find that it's fine). But at least I know I'm good to go for many more years with no worry, assuming I can put it back together. Replacing those two hoses is a b!tch!

    Birdman
     
  14. Pizzaman Chris

    Pizzaman Chris F1 Rookie

    Mar 13, 2005
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    Watch those knuckles.:)
     
  15. gdl1952

    gdl1952 Rookie

    Oct 5, 2006
    11
    For reference, I have replaced the coolant hoses in my previous Italian beauty (1974 Alfa Romeo Spider), and they worked extremely well with regular hoses. I bought them on line from McMaster-Carr, a place where I keep buying parts that are exaclty the same if not very close to original parts (door seals, hood seals), but at a fraction of the price. Also, they have a very wide selection of temperature and chemical resistance specifications.
     
  16. 78-308gt4

    78-308gt4 Formula Junior

    May 22, 2005
    735
    Memphis, TN
    ditto!
     
  17. chrismorse

    chrismorse Formula 3

    Feb 16, 2004
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    My 308 needs every coolant hose. The PO did a couple, but I want to do them ALL. I would prefer black, red just doesn't go with some of the other colors.

    If you come up with a killer Silicone kit of all the hoses, (with or without high grade clamps), sign me up.

    I am going through the car, servicing or upgrading as i go.

    I am still undecided about coolant - Distilled & water wetter, Evans or just Havoline - but that is another story.

    thanks,
    chris
     
  18. lusso64

    lusso64 Formula 3

    Apr 12, 2004
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    I'm about to embark on an engine-out for my Mondial t, and will be replacing these hoses too.

    I'm looking at a trade account with Samco's California distributor and spec'ing some kits for various cars.

    If anyone has a complete set of hoses for any car (other than a Mondial t) and can spend some time measuring each one, I'll do these first. Obviously it's easier to measure these things off the car :)

    I'd need internal diameter, length, and for bends, the degree of bend and the bend center-line radius. Post the information here for those who want to DIY - My value-add will be to do the cutting and kitting for those folks who just want all the hoses and clamps in one box, ready to install.

    Dave
     
  19. 89vr

    89vr Rookie

    Apr 30, 2007
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    Midlothian TX
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    Chris Marotti
    if other people want to investigate this, go for it, im not going to waste my time in putting a kit together when someone else can do all the monkey work. it may sound harsh but i honestly don't have the time (i'd love to, don't get me wrong) but i've been on the road for 3 weeks straight and hometime is important. so if you want it go for it. if you run into any trouble or want some better pricing, send me the info. I can almost guarantee, I can supply the silicon for 50% less than anyone else can get.

    I deal with the largest importer in the country that directly supplies to the government, every M1 abrams tank has their silicon hose on it. I just spec'd a job for over 1000 6' 2.25" pipes for the nyc metro autority (replacement coolant hoses for metro buses) and that's an extremely small order. think about that.
     
  20. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

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    Chris, we're working on it. I PM'd you! I have all the pieces out of the Mondial now. I'll get all the sizes and you can price it up.

    Birdman
     
  21. rtking

    rtking Formula Junior

    Mar 5, 2006
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    Huntington Beach, CA
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    Bob King
    This is sounding great! I want in too! I'd love to replace all the hoses on my Mondial as well. Thanks Birdman for taking the lead on this!

    Bob
     
  22. lusso64

    lusso64 Formula 3

    Apr 12, 2004
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    Chris,

    I think I should have been clearer in what I typed. The situation we have here is that there is a lot of interest in these hoses for many types of Ferraris. I for one certainly don't expect you to sit there cutting up hoses to make "kits" for a dozen different cars. I totally agree that hometime is very important - I am lucky enough to be able to work from home and see my wife and kids anytime I want to. Being on the road for 3 weeks at a time would kill me.

    I think we (collectively) should do our homework on exactly what hoses each type of car requires, then determine a "bill of materials" for each car type. If you can then supply the uncut hoses and angle pieces, each person who wants a set can then cut their own. For those that don't want to sit there and cut them, I'm happy to do it.

    Maybe I should have been clearer.... I WAS looking at a trade account when this thread started and your very kind and generous offer was made. Based on your offer, my need for a trade account has basically vanished.

    My apologies if I seemed to be stepping on your toes or appeared ungrateful. I think that the offer you have made to us, apart from being very generous, will also be enthusiastically accepted.

    Regards, Dave
     
  23. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

    Jun 20, 2003
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    Cool, lets work on it! Based on my investigation, the 308 and Mondial 8/QV kits are pretty close except that the Mondial has the long coolant hoses front to rear while the 308 uses hard pipe for those. The 308 kit will actually have surprisingly little in it. Probably can ship it in a shoe box!

    My McMaster-sourced silicone hose showed up yesterday and I put the long runs in the car. Today I picked up some o-rings and I'm going to hopefully put the waterpump back in tonight. Hoses under the plenum are replaced (what a pain in the ass that was) and I just got a call that the radiator was re-cored and ready to pick up tomorrow. If I have the time to get everything together and flushed, I'll have a running car by early next week. I can't wait to see the results of a modern radiator on this car.

    Birdman
     
  24. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

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    #49 Birdman, Jun 22, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Here are a few shots of progress. The radiator is re-cored. Picked it up this morning. All the hoses are in, and now I must just put the radiator in, fill the system and drive the damned car! I have about 10 hours into it so far, but I do have a lift which speeds the process.

    Birdman

    Pic 1: The blue silicone hose from McMaster Carr that I used for the long runs.
    Pic 2. The hard pipe connecting to the long runs of silicone hose between the fuel tanks just in front of the engine.
    Pic 3: The rubber gunk stuck in the old radiator core. The radiator shop said that the radiator had about 50% flow...and that was after I used the hose to backflow as much out of the radiator as I could!!
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  25. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

    Jun 20, 2003
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