The BORA

Thanks for the prompt reply. Who would you recommend for doing a conversion from "green" to a "normal" brake system in Europe and how could be the hydraulic seat adjustment converted ?

 

Walter it's well documented that they did in fact come with the LHM system.
Ask Marc. I think we've been through this once before no?

 

the red bora at Monterrey (RM auctions Lot #106) just sold for $55,000

 

Spoke to a friend that is there and saw the car. Described it as a nice used car undriven. Mauchs auction claim of 1 owner since 70s with 24k miles

 

http://www.mecum.com/auctions/lot_detail.cfm?LOT_ID=CA0811-113445&entryRow=202

Sold at Mecum for $41,000

 

Unfortunately Mecum doesn't list vin numbers. They also sold a Barn Find 900 mile Bora for 92k
That car along with a Dino & Daytona were part of a group that had a lot of publicity around them for most of the year.


http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=332386&page=2

 

Walter,
As much as we love Boras (and Maseratis for that matter) the rest of the world doesn't feel the same way. Things still haven't changed Maserati's are still only worth about 1/3 as much as similar condition comparative Ferrari model.

 

Thats very true. Maybe things will change in the future?

For example, will the GS MC Victory be a classic because it was produced in limited and numbered cars? Or how about the MC12?

I know that my normal GS will never be a classic or worth any real money in the future, but I don't really care about that because I bought it to drive it. My Merak SS may be another story but I didn't buy it as an investment, I bough it for the same reason I got my GS, to drive it and enjoy it.

 

The pale blue Bora I would expect will become a museum piece. It's a stupid purchase if you want to drive the car as it will need complete dis-assembly of a lot of things after sitting all that time. I'm kind of surprised they drove it at the auction. They had to have gone through the LHM system to check for any leaks at least.

A big green puddle definitely would have been very bad form. Though you can certainly drive it with flat spheres for an auction.

I wouldn't expect this car ever to be driven very much so whether it had LHM or standard brakes is kind of a moot point. I know the guy I bought mine from when it had less than 3000 miles specifically wanted a Maserati with all that neat stuff on it because he thought it was just so cool. I guess what I'm saying is that collector who primarily displays unusual and rare cars (the Bora is both) isn't going to be that concerned with how it drives all that much. Besides, it does drive very nicely.

Bora values when adjusted for inflation are kind of depressing. That other red 75 that sold earlier at RM might have been the better car for someone who wants to drive one. It all depends on if that owner keep it in continuous good condition.

BTW, I thought the comments from the Mecum announcers about all of these "barn find" cars was humorous and idiotic. Especially the Webers comment.

 

Sorry, Walter, to disagree: When I inspected #890 in Dec. 2005 in Grenoble @ our friend O.B. (apparently before she left for Russia), she clearly had the hydraulic brake system with LHM in place and operating.

Regards,
P

 

Yes, not only did 890 have hydraulics but so did the two Thepenier Bora Group 4's.

I have stated it here several times after doing exhaustive and complete research for my book that both were born with it, 3001 still has it while 3000 was modified many years after leaving the factory and the hands of Thepenier.

For some reason Walter continues to propagate the incorrect view that this is not the case but there is no doubt: I have spoken to everybody involved at the time, drove 3001 briefly in July of 1995 with the hydraulic brakes and 3000 more extensively for the book in June of 2009: this is the one which had its brake system modified by a Dominick Ellenrieder -making the system very inefficient- and Jean Guikas after racing it like that a couple of times modified it to a more efficient system in time for our test drive day at Paul Ricard June 2009.

These are the facts. Anything else is not.

best regards,

Marc

 

Good morning Walter:

I fully trust what poster Vignalespyder states so the records you have were wrong but as you have said yourself these records be they from the factory or private sources have been wrong in the past.

Yes Dominick Ellenreider decided he did not have the sensitivity to drive fast with the hydraulic brakes so had them modified to a set up which required no sensitivity and was very weak. As my recorded interview of Guikas states, Ellenrieder crashed -without too much damage-in the first corner of the first lap he did after the modification was carried out! This was at the Grand Sambuc circuit, a small private track near Aix en Provence.

Within a year or so D.E. decided the car was too fast for his ability level and wisely did a partial swap with Guikas for a 275.

I hope we have now put the matter to rest: have a good day.

Marc

 

Then there's 3001.

I'd be curious to know about the Bitsa-Bora at the Pannini Museum though. That's the one cobbled together by Maserati as a museum entry starting back in 1986 and I think it was finished by 1991?

If that has no LHM is it just the brakes the have been deleted or is the entire system missing. If the later is the case then how are they operating the headlight buckets, moving pedals and seat height?

 

Ah thanks we know how reliable auction catalogs can be cf Christies at Retromobile 2007 writing that the khamsin spyder had hydraulic...suspension!

On the matter of the Bora #948 since I was communicating with Matteo Panini this morning on another matter he confirmed that his Bora has the normal Citroën hydraulic system and expressed surprise that you would think otherwise.

best regards,

Marc

 

Hello Walter:

I just had a nice chat with signor Cozza and he emphatically stated that:

"No Bora was ever made by Maserati with non Citroën brakes, no prototype, not a single one. Perhaps some private people have done this but it has nothing to do with Maserati."

End of quote.

So there you have it: glad to help and to resolve this matter, funnily enough I am working on the book most of today so very satisfying.

I will add one thing I have already stated as I have realized that it will need to be stated numerous times before it sinks into the general perception of that generation of Maseratis: it was not Citroën who imposed the hydraulics (they had far more important concerns) it was Giulio Alfieri who was a Citroën enthusiast liked their technological advances and saw in the LHM system a way to fit powerful and enduring brakes and have assistance that made the brakes stering and clutch light to operate. Therefore he asked for it and got it.

best regards,

Marc

 

Wow!

Ciao,
George