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Tire change on the road

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by ArtS, Sep 23, 2004.

  1. ArtS

    ArtS F1 Veteran
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    Nov 11, 2003
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    Now that I've just gone through my second experience with changing a flat tire with a knock-off, neither experience being particularly smooth, can someone suggest a better way to do an in the field tire change on an old Ferrari? Is a lead hammer (or a regular hammer and a piece of wood) the best that's out there? Does anyone carry those devices that Jim G. has with them?

    Regards,

    Art S.
     
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  3. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Falcom (sp) makes a hammer with one side hard delrin to shock it loose and the other side to non mar remove it which works well. My tool is a bit big to lug around. That said remove your KO's often and coat the stub axle with anti sieze white lithuim grease. This makes a huge difference.
     
  4. dretceterini

    dretceterini F1 Veteran

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    There are also other companies that make mallets with one hard rubber end and the other end soft metal. These work well. I very much agree with Jim on removing the wheels at least twice a year and coating the threads with lithium grease .
     
  5. dm_n_stuff

    dm_n_stuff Global Moderator
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    http://mossmotors.com/

    Search using hammer

    They have about a half dozen varieties, weights, etc. Copper, lead, all types.

    And, because they sell them for little British cars, they are much less expensive.

    DM
     
  6. Simon

    Simon Moderator
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    You should be able to get a hard rubber hammer for about $15 from most hard ware stores... It will only last 1 or 2 years but will not damage the knockoffs. Beware placing wood between the knock off and the hammer. I tried this initailly with my Healey and nearly knocked my head off when it rebounded...dooohhh

    As a side note, do you guys with vintage fcars with knock offs find that the front wheels are much harder to remove than the rear? The rears are a piece of cake on my healey but the fronts after a few 100kms driving are like they're welded on. The only explanation I could come up with was that the driving torque on the rear wheels was such that the knock offs didn't tighten any further, while on the front the resistance torque somehow works make things tighter.

    Cheers
    Simon
     
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  8. dretceterini

    dretceterini F1 Veteran

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    I think it has more to do with the side loads put on during cornering, but yes, the front wheels ALWAYS seem harder to get off than the rears.

    Removing the wheels, cleaning the threads and greasing them at least twice a year really helps....not only with knock offs, but with bolted on wheels too.

    Also make sure at least every couple of years that the studs aren't coming loose from the backing plates.

    I learned this some 35 years ago, when I broke a wheel stud loose from the backing plate, and had to cut the stud to get the damn wheel nut off....
     
  9. Simon

    Simon Moderator
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    Funny you should mention checking the studs. Accelerating onto a motorway in Belgium about 8 years ago (about 90-100kmh) I heard a funny noise from the rear left. A split second later the nose of the car was in the air and the arse of the car was gouging grooves into the tarmac. There are only 4 studs on the rear of my car (the design was changed after the first 1000 or so cars)...one broke and the other three followed very quickly.

    The wire wheel went bouncing past me still attached to the rear hub. The brake drum then detached, went in the other direction and upset some old lady in a new Mercedes...."you don't see that very often" was her only comment.

    Since then I check the rears regularly....

    Cheers
    Simon
     
  10. dretceterini

    dretceterini F1 Veteran

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    That must have been frightening. The worst thing I had happen was an older 165 x 400 mm tire explode and the entire sidewall seperate on a left rear at about 80 mph on one of the Alfa 2600 sprints I had. Fortunately no one was next to me, as the car immediately side-steped an entire lane. I don't know how the car didn't spin, but I guess I was smart/lucky enough not to touch the brake pedal and to actually depress the clutch pedal. When the car came to rest, the brake drum was flat spotted about 1/4 inch and a rather big gouge was in the road surface...
     
  11. Colin Angell

    Colin Angell Karting

    Jun 17, 2004
    84
    Having tried most hammer options, including casting lead hammer heads etc, I now only use a rubber dead blow hammer, which has the head filled with lead shot. No rebound, no damage, no problem.......
     
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  13. ArtS

    ArtS F1 Veteran
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    I would like to thank everyone for their advice. I will try one of the hard/soft hammers that Jim and others recommend.

    Colin,

    Normally I would agree with you, but I had a dead blow and it did nothing. In fact when I switched to a regular hammer and wood, I made quite a bit of kindling before it finally began to move.


    Regards,

    Art S.

    PS. does anyone know how to correct the thread title? I wrote it last night when I was tired and didn't pay attention to typos.
     
  14. El Wayne

    El Wayne Global Moderator
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    Done.
     
  15. rob_lewis

    rob_lewis Rookie

    Sep 17, 2004
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    Could also be related to heat from the front brakes. Since the fronts do most of the work, the rapid heating up and cooling down probably contributes to the siezing.

    -Rob
     
  16. ArtS

    ArtS F1 Veteran
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    Thanks Wayne!

    Art S.
     
  17. tritone

    tritone F1 Veteran
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    Just curious:

    why has no one mentioned the cast socket sold by someone on FChat (Hill Engrg?)?

    I have one for my 330; seems like the best solution? no beating, just a nice twist of the wrist?

    james
     
  18. ArtS

    ArtS F1 Veteran
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    James,

    This was initially my first choice, but Jim G. said that it was too bulky to carry. Do you keep it with you when driving?

    Art S.
     
  19. tritone

    tritone F1 Veteran
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    too bulky? what are those Le Mans-spec "suitcases" on the back of the P4 for anyway?? he could carry 2 of them!

    yes, mine is always in the trunk, in its cast-off velvet lens bag!!

    james
     
  20. Bob Zambelli

    Bob Zambelli F1 Rookie
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    In the mid 70's, I bought a hammer from Wilco made by Thor. It had one nylon face and one copper face. I removed the copper and re-cast that face in lead. I have put well over 100,000 miles on my GTC and have had the wheels off more times than I dare to remember. With the car on the ground, I give it a few whacks with the lead face and then jack it up and use the nylon face. The knock-off ears are like NEW - never so much as a scratch.
    I used this same hammer on hundreds of customer cars and track cars including the 250 GTO, the Dino prototype and the 412 MI. Once again, NEVER so much as a scratch on any knock-off.
    After the lead face gets all distorted, I simply recast it and it's like new. I really don't understand all this fear of lead hammers and having to have complicated tools when something as simple as a lead hammer will serve the purpose perfectly. And, it fits in your tool bag.
    Also, every few years, I give the drive splines, threads and centering cones a coating of grease
    Just my 2 cents.
    Bob Z
     
  21. ArtS

    ArtS F1 Veteran
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    Bob,

    Thanks for the input.

    For me a lead hammer in the car would be a good start. I have some problems with my hands, so a tool attached to a breaker bar would make my life easier.

    Regards,

    Art S.
     
  22. Bob Zambelli

    Bob Zambelli F1 Rookie
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    Hi, Art - understood!!

    Bob
     
  23. ArtS

    ArtS F1 Veteran
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    Happy Ending!

    I got a new inner tube, mounting and balancing for $25 and I'm back in business. By the way, how tight is tight enough for the knock-offs? I think the one I struggled with was on too tight.

    Mind you, driving on a 40 year old Pirelli with bald spots and flat spots gives new meaning to 'altered handling characteristics'.

    Regards,

    Art S.
     
  24. donv

    donv F1 World Champ
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    I had a flat in my garage once. I wrapped a thin towel around the knock-off ear and hit it with the lead hammer in the jack bag. Came right off... of course, this was a rear wheel, so maybe that made a difference.
     
  25. ArtS

    ArtS F1 Veteran
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    Don,

    Mine was a rear wheel also. That's what surprised me.

    Art S.
     
  26. bill365

    bill365 F1 Rookie

    Nov 3, 2003
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    I prefer to use the lead hammers, I have had a number of cars w/knock-offs and they always seem to do well, you just have to recast them or get new ones once in a while. Most of the British car have cast brass knock-offs and they never seem to get damaged by the lead hammers, so on the F-cars steel KO's I imagine that it would be much safer. For over 30 years, I have used a grease heavily rich in Moly disulphide to lube the threads and splines, I have never had a problem with spline wear or seized KO's. (315K miles on an MGB without problems).

    Regards,
    Bill
     
  27. Bryanp

    Bryanp F1 Rookie
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    Bill - 315k on an MGB???! that's love, man.
    I only put about 40k on my MGBGT . . . I still miss it.
     

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