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Track Pads

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by pma1010, Nov 21, 2003.

  1. pma1010

    pma1010 F1 Rookie

    Jul 21, 2002
    2,559
    Chicago
    Full Name:
    Philip
    #1 pma1010, Nov 21, 2003
    As an extension to the discussion on track brake fluid, I'd also like to understand experiences with track pads.

    My experience:
    Stock: useless at the track.
    Porterfield R4S: down to backing plates after one weekend at Road America.
    Carbotech 1108 (race pad). Good performance. Better wear characteristics.
    Carbotech 1109XP (current - race pad). No fade, higher initial bite. Good pad life. Not too hot on a cool or wet day with occasional use

    The BMW guys seem to swear by Hawk pads. Certainly the M3 lightweight I rode in around RA (2:35 laps) braked extraordinary well.

    I'm tempted to try the Hawk pads next season.

    Experiences?
     

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  2. Hubert

    Hubert F1 Rookie

    Jan 3, 2002
    2,642
    The Left Coast
    #2 Hubert, Nov 21, 2003
    you summed it up well.
    the r4S is just a more agressive street pad, nothing special, imo.
    i like both carbotech pads, but the dust is god aweful to get off the wheels after the weekend, and the modulation / application of braking torque (in my experience) is not as linear as it could be; they're more of an on/off switch, but in terms of initial bite, they're fantastic.
    hawk pads are very hard on rotors (which is why I don't use them).
    I recently went to cobaltfriction spec VR pads (highest mu out there 0.68 --IIRC-- and a 1550 F op ceiling).
    i like the modulation better v. the carbotechs, but b/c the spec vr's come on at a higher cold temp than any other pad i've used, and stay cool exceptionally well, therefore, in my hands, they're not providing me adequate initial bite; the upshot is that i've never faded them, ever. in a faster car, or better driver, they'd be perfect, but i'll have to downgrade to the spec B's next time , to get a pad that will stay hot under my conditions.
    i've also heard excellent things about the ferodo ds2500 and 3000 series pads.
    you shuld give the guys at cobalt a call, they can help you out as they sell the hawks, ferodos and their own compounds.
    hth's,
    hubert
     
  3. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    19,837
    socal
    #3 fatbillybob, Nov 21, 2003
    pma1010 what car are you running and is the car stock/lowered/lightened/race rubber?
     
  4. pma1010

    pma1010 F1 Rookie

    Jul 21, 2002
    2,559
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    Philip
    #4 pma1010, Nov 21, 2003
    Billy
    77 308 "B".

    Engine: Has upgraded cams and carbs (lots of posts elsewhere on this). K&N. Tubi.

    Chassis: All suspension bushings replaced, ARB bushings, new shocks, rack bushings replaced, uprated ARB on rear, Kumho v700 225/50x16F, 245/45x16R. Stock alignment. Pressures dependent on track and conditions - typ. 34F, 34R

    Brakes and pads: posted elsewhere. Have cool air ducting to fronts. New (end of last season) rotors.

    Other: race seats and 5 pt. belts.

    Otherwise stock ride height, stock weight except for euro bumpers.

    (Pic is Rob S. providing chassis advice at Gingerman)

    Looking at fatter ARB on front to reduce body roll.
     
  5. f355spider

    f355spider F1 World Champ
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    May 29, 2001
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    Hugh G. Rection
    #5 f355spider, Nov 21, 2003
    pma1010, the car looks great!

    Dave
     

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  6. maranelloman

    maranelloman Guest

    #6 maranelloman, Nov 23, 2003
    Here's my $0.02:

    I agree with Hubert: I also use Cobalt's Spec VR full race pads on my M3, and LOVE them. They last forever, take very little to warm up, and are relatively rotor friendly (for a race pad). I have also used Ferodo DS3000's, and they also work well, but ate the rotors faster, IMO. Both dust heavily at street speeds. Ferodo DS2500's are nice for a hybrid pad; I use them in my 550 for street & track. Relatively dust-free, and very good...but not a race pad. R4S's suck on the track--I had the same results in my M3 when I tried them.
     
  7. pma1010

    pma1010 F1 Rookie

    Jul 21, 2002
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    Philip
    #7 pma1010, Nov 23, 2003
    Thanks for all the input. Where do you find the Cobalt Friction pads?
     
  8. maranelloman

    maranelloman Guest

    #8 maranelloman, Nov 23, 2003
    www.cobaltfriction.com
     
  9. Dr Tommy Cosgrove

    Dr Tommy Cosgrove Three Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    May 4, 2001
    31,066
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    Tommy
    #9 Dr Tommy Cosgrove, Nov 24, 2003
    I use Carbotech 1109. They are VERY kind to expensive rotors.
     

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  10. Mitch Alsup

    Mitch Alsup F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    7,311
    #10 Mitch Alsup, Nov 24, 2003
    I have been using Ferrodo DS2500s since last December. These bads have good initial bite, require less pressure, are pretty rotor friendly, don't fade, and (for a pad of the aforementioned qualities) don't create excessive dust. I have gone through 4 sets of these pads this year (19 track days and 10,000 miles).
     
  11. pma1010

    pma1010 F1 Rookie

    Jul 21, 2002
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    Philip
    #11 pma1010, Nov 24, 2003
    Mitch, Maranello man
    Thanks for the responses, helpful.
     

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