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Upping the red-line on a 360.

Discussion in '360/430' started by RussianM3_dude, May 24, 2004.

  1. RussianM3_dude

    RussianM3_dude F1 Rookie
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    Mar 15, 2004
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    Nikolai Petroff
    I know some people have raised to 9000rpm. Is it dangerous and what are the benefits?
     
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  3. GTO84

    GTO84 Formula Junior

    Dec 13, 2003
    562
    Yes and 5 horsepower and a cam through your back and a trip to the ER
     
  4. RussianM3_dude

    RussianM3_dude F1 Rookie
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    Well, I thought it could be done safely. I've seen a video with a guy racing his on a street like that.
     
  5. It can be done thru a ECU optimization but I dont think the added stress on parts will really yield all that much benifit. I know some people that did that on there stradale to upped the redline to 9200RPM.

    Was the video you seen a silver 355 and red 360 at night racing a red turbo M3 in turkey . ?
     
  6. C. Losito

    C. Losito Formula Junior

    Dec 12, 2003
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    Chris Losito
    I hope this isn't hijacking the thread, but this is something I've always wanted to know:

    How conservative is the red line on most normal passenger cars (obviously, a Ferrari isn't you everyday passenger car)? Is the engine usually capable of more?
     
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  8. Z0RR0

    Z0RR0 F1 Rookie

    Apr 11, 2004
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    In bone stock form, I think not. I'm pretty sure valves are gonna start goin' nuts soon after redline. But if we start putting harder valve springs, tougher valves, longer duration camshafts (to optimize higher rpm), free intake and exhaust, then perhaps, we'd be on our way ... :D

    oops ... are we talking redline, or cut-off here?
     
  9. C. Losito

    C. Losito Formula Junior

    Dec 12, 2003
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    Thanks, I was thinking the same thing. I was talking redline, assuming that the engine didn't go into fuel-shutdown.
     
  10. Izza

    Izza Formula 3

    Nov 3, 2003
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    The stock car can have Ferrari ECu's added to take the revs up to 9500 rpm. The fact these ECu's come from the factory would imply the engine can take it.
     
  11. ferrarifixer

    ferrarifixer F1 Veteran
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    Jul 22, 2003
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    The engine will rev as high as 10,000 without valve bounce or float or any other mechanical failure.

    Engine wear is exponential. If you're going to spend all your time at the top end, don't complain when the engine is tired or worse much sooner than you expected.

    Easy example....360 Challenge are stock standard engines with stock standard ECU's. I doubt there is a 360C anywhere that hasn't had an engine problem under 10000km. And probably 7500km. The first batches we had all had failures or major upgrades before 4000km. And with the newer style parts fitted I life them unofficially to 5000km....about 40 hours. It's average rpm is around 6750.

    Your average road car has no such problems in ten times the mileage and a hundred times the hours. It's average rpm is likely to be about 4000.

    Move the limit up to 9200rpm, and you bring the engine life way down to race car distances.

    Would you honestly want to buy a car that had someone else chip it up?

    There is power to be had within the std rpm range, with work to the reciprocating masses, inlet and exhaust systems. These will have no effect on life.
     
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  13. Ade

    Ade Formula 3

    Jan 31, 2004
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    That would sound awesume, do they do a similar ECU for the 355 do you know?

    Ade
     
  14. Izza

    Izza Formula 3

    Nov 3, 2003
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    I presume they must given there is the 355 challenge series. Speak to karl at Verdi's as he will know more than me.
     
  15. vette79

    vette79 Karting

    Nov 3, 2003
    50
    Just something to keep in mind... whenever you take a high-revving car and up the rpms, you put a large amount of stress on the rotating assembly. heres something for you to think about: the stress on a motor turning 8,000 rpm DOUBLES when you make it run 9,000 rpm. the added stress doesnt work in to be a flat equation. its compounded cumalatively(sp?). so by raising the redline even to 9k you are adding a large amount of stress to the motor. with that said, in the circle track motors i have had experience with, we've ran stock chevrolet 350 v-8 motors 10 grand all the way around the track with cast cranks, forged rods and decent forged pistons. they live like that all season, and ive seen a car with about 10,000 miles on it from one season with no ill wear. with the proper parts and the lighter weight of the ferrari rotating assembly, id truthfully beleive that you could spin it to 12k as long as the heads and intake/exhaust support power at that kind of rpm's. internally balanced raceweight forged or billet crank thats been knife edged and lightened, some good forged lightweight steel rods and lightweight pistons would do it. now as far as the top end, think titanium. it would be pricy but you could get it to rev like a crotchrocket. keep in mind that, idealy, to actually make power at that kind of rpms you would have to screw with the electronics and recam the car to kick in at a much higher rpm, so it would behave a lot more like a crotch rocket as well. just my .02
     
  16. RussianM3_dude

    RussianM3_dude F1 Rookie
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    Does anyone think Ferrari will have a street car soon with more then 8500rpm?
     
  17. F2003-GA

    F2003-GA F1 World Champ
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    Nov 2, 2003
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    The new 430 modena is rumered to have a 9000 rev limit.But I
    am sure with formula one tech trickling down to production cars
    that one day soon we will even see 10000 rpm limits attained.
     

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