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Discussion in 'Ferrari Discussion (not model specific)' started by Ferruccio, Dec 16, 2003.
We all love Ferrari but what is there biggest problem that they need to solve in the near future?
15K and 30K services seemed to be a major issue and gripe with owners and potential buyers. Look at how many posts were made in regards to this matter.
dont dilute the image of the marque with low-rent trademarked "official" products... digital cameras... computers... toolboxes.. a FEW well-chosen auto-related things are fine... but going at this rate we're gonna see official Prancing Horse 512 Boxer boxer shorts in the not-too-distant future...
same with the printed material... they KNOW some schmo is gonna BUY it so lets PRINT it. Small books - pamphlets - on a specific ferrari or type of engine... regurgitated info with nothing really NEW to offer and mark up the price 300%.... If you are gonna print a book on 65 degree V12s make sure it is the BEST one out there... you can STILL mark up the price but when you get a Ferrari-quality print-job you treaure the book forever. The 50th anniversary book for example - AMAZING! Yes... expensive too... but the thing is a prized book in my collection.
sorry for the rant... just some of the things theyve produced/endorsed recently are not of the level they should be...
They should raise MSRP to market prices. 360 Spyder 225, coupe 200, Enzo 1 mil. This would add rev. (as opposed to giving it to speculators) which they could use to improve their cars, make even better ones, and return to sportscar racing.
Ferrari is too small.
Would you rather see them double their production or be owned by VW?
Sour-crout & Sausages with your fine Italian wine?
They need a Boxter like Porshce did, only it would be called the Dino $90k car. They need it to feed new blood into the company. Kids today play video games and have a lot of fun cars.... to grow up with. Ferrari is not the only guy on the block anymore. Kids are also growing up with rice cars. Ferrari had the market in the 80's - 00's all to itself except P-cars. The Ferrari "name only" will not keep the next generation of buyers as spell-bound or loyal. A kid that grew up with a ricer is not going to be so judgmental against the next NSX or Supra super-cars, like the old dogs hanging out on this board with the no soul banter. And Audi's Lambo has now got unlimited money for ("dare I say it"??) a lambo with a 90k first service and quality like a Honda.
Back to Ferrari,,,more production equals better engineering and build quality. Their runs have always been too small to work out the bugs. Rich people are tired of being test drivers or test engineers... as all the other Manufactures show the exotics don't have to be such sloppy quality. 15k and 30k is stupid in face of Viper, Ford GT, New NSX these cars have 60k to 90k for the first major service.
Yes Ferrari can stay a small little club. As long as you don't mind being owned by the Germans and having the VW Bug as your blood brother. OR they can grow.
Too much competition and change in World wide Auto industry to stay the same. They had a good run 60's -90's as a cute little gentleman's club, but now pressure is building for external change. Maybe not for another 10 years but its coming. ....unless Ferrari changes and bites the bullet like Porsche with an expansion.
Ferrari already broke the old game of Ferraris as rare cars. Since the 308 all Ferrari have been produced in too high of a number for the cars NOT to have a steady deadly depreacation until they become worth more as parts cars. Since we don't have to worry about being rare... you might as well do 20,000 cars, you're already doing 10,000 per model. Not since the Daytona, Dino, Boxer... when car were less then 2,000 for a prodution run... have you been able to call ferrari's investment cars (except F50 or ENZO special runs). Who whould sop up this extra production? Ferrari would have two or threee times the customers if they solved the quality isue...Way too many guys driving P-car only because they don't want headaches that might come with a Ferrari, which would be their fist choice.
In the poll above. I voted they need a more exotic look. Retro was fun with the 550 run, but now get back to core business….. Ferrari is an exotic sports car company.
Very good post.
I voted more HP, because that is the only single thing that I would change about my 360 Spider. However, looking at Ferrari as a whole, I think that in addition to HP increase, a more exotic look is needed. We are entering a time where there are plentiful choices in the exotic & luxury car market segment. And this will only continue to grow. This competition should be good for Ferrari, and should challenge them to build cars with even greater appeal, higher quality, continuously improved technology and outstanding performance.
Ferrari Spa sells 4500 cars per year...Max. Not 10 000. And they bought Maserati to fill the 90 000 $ market..
Selling more Ferraris would take away their uniqueness and rarity. We do see Ferraris but not its still a rare and emotional sight. Fo every Ferrari i see at least 15 porsches..and i barely notice them anymore.
They apparently need to work on Maserati because it didnt get a good review everywhere...to say the least.
IMO what they should fix is their car weight...i dont want to see a Maranello Replacement that weighs 1800 Kgs !
And the V8 needs more torque.
Disagree with Mark, Ferrari needs to be a small niche/exclusive player and use the Maserati brand for the broader market. The things I would change is to make the cars lighter and not get caught up in the horsepower wars. I would take 400lbs out of my 360 before I added another 50-75hp, it would improve acceleration and most of all improve the handling. They tried with the CS but did not go far enough. Thats my two cents..........
If you want to go with Maserati.... That might work. But it has to be a sports car. The current Maseratis are not even as sexy as a basic corvette. They are like Mercedes Benz but not quite as exotic looking.
I think you could do the Ferrari Dino and badge it a Maserati.
But the people at Ferrari chose to do 550, 612 and a bunch of Maserati's that aren't sports car sexy. That Long-Term Top decision is something they are stuck with right now.
We need more horsepower,and torque the horsepower war is just beginning. Also imo the 575 replacement should put the motor back where its supposed to be, and pump its output to around 600. Unlike alot of people on this board I do feel that the 575 is a direct competitor of the murcielago as the testarossa was for the contach and I for one have not even considered owning a twelve cylinder fcar for the simple reason that the 360 is imo better looking and that means alot. I have my third 360 variant coming a 360cs in March and it will be my last as I will be switching to another mark if it ends up that the 360 replacment 420 or whatever they call it is going to get trouned my cars costing half as much, whether our competitors lack passion or not, they are afterall performance cars and Ferrari better start worrying a little about puting cars out there with 100 hp or more less then the competition.
i really agree with the weight thing and not joining in on the hp wars. the CL65 has almost as much hp as the enzo but the thing weighs in at 2.5tons. it's getting ridiculous.
isn't the reason they purchased maserati was so they could get some cash to start racing in a GT series? if that was the case why didn't they put more effort into masser?
i don't think they should increase the production numbers though. sure it might solve the problem of reliability, but i've always seen ferraris as a rarity. i didn't like the idea that any schmo on the street could pick up the car.
What people do not understand is that just because a car has more hp than another, it doesnt necessary mean that that car is faster. People need to realize that a thing called "weight" is involved.
Ferrari makes cars ,ie. the 360, that weigh less than any other cars in its class and go just as fast or even faster because they are sooo light. Wait till Ferrari makes the car that will replace the 360. Even if they just bump up the hp to 450, this car will burn all the others in its class!
" And they bought Maserati to fill the 90 000 $ market.."
They didn't make it exotic or sexy. And it hasn't worked because of that.
I personnaly love the Maserati look both the coupe and the Spyder.I think it was let down by a bad reputation from the De Tomaso years and also by the fact that its main competitor is the 911, a tough rival.
"If they doubled or tripled.... I still wouldn't see one per week. Would that really hurt as bad as seeing the company OWNED buy the Germans?
If they get it right with Maserati and if Lucas wish to incorporate Alfa,Maser and Ferrari in one group only , i dont see VW buying them, esp seeing how Bad VW venture into luxury has turned..the Phaeton is a failure , the GT isnt profitable...With the new chairman, i think VW will focus on its true roots again.
If the Ferrari 420 takes that path it'll be great, car should have more feel.
The next NSX is also working on a 450hp V6 for the lightest weight car and the most torque for 2006 model year.
It'll be fun..... just like 1991 when it was NSX vs 348.
Bring back a mid engine 12 cyl.
Definitely some interesting comments in this post.
As for the 360 replacement, if it has only 450HP, I'd be pretty disappointed. Unless they could somehow improve the torque substantially.
Decreasing weight is a good idea, so long as it doesn't make the car unsafe for driving on public roads. I've seen a few 360's sheared in half, and I think that it's light enough already. We have to remember that these are street cars, not cars that are solely destined for track racing.
And the comment about the mid-engine 12 is a great idea. Bring it back. High-strung 8's are fun, but the torque of a 12 is more fun.
My ideal Ferrari:
Gobs of HP and torque (600HP minimum)
Reasonable weight (3200 lbs +/-)
Exotic styling (akin to the Enzo, Murci, Konigsegg, etc.)
Improved build quality & reliability
Interior that is luxurious but still has a racing feel to it
Exhaust note that shatters windows (well not quite, but you get the idea)
$300K price tag
The only problem is that if Ferrari built this car, the price would likely ring in around $400-500K (depending on their production capacity/output). Which, in my opinion is too much to spend for something that I'd drive maybe 3000 miles per year. Of course, come talk to me after they build it, maybe I'll change my mind.
1. raise prices, lower production.
2. styling needs to be updated. i love the 575 but what about the cars looks is exotic? i know we all have our tastes, etc., so styling is an endless debate, but maybe a bit more kick to it would be nice!
Ferrari is talking about sending 15% of their cars to China's new market in the next few years. You like the 4 year list for a spider 6 speed now?
Why do you guys want so bad for ferrari to raise the prices ?
Dammit ! Wait till i can afford one !
Bear in mind that I am from a humble background and do NOT fart $100 dollar bills so that's the perspective you'll get here.
1. How's about an entry level model. Yeah, I can hear the so called wealthy purists whining already. Tough crap, it's called market share and whoever mentioned how the kids of today will stick with Supras and NSX's is 100% correct. Why buy a clapped out 308/328/348/360 when for the same(sans 360 for now) or less you can have a Supra that will blow it away performance-wise and still start every morning? Yeah, WE know the difference, but they don't!!!
1a. Oh yeah, the entry level car I speak of would be around $55K to $65K. It could carry the Dino monikker or Mondial or whetever. Give it a nice V8, keep the mid-engine layout and use styling cues from the museum-quality 308 series. They'll sell every one they make. And NO, you will NOT see 5 of them a day either so relax!!!
2. Re-think styling and get back to the roots of beauty that IMO have since passed. Dare I say the Enzo is quite dorky? Go ahead, say it "the only people who knock it are those that will never have one." Fine, that still doesn't make it any prettier. I think most people feel forced to like the styling because...well.... it's the flagship model and it's performance is space-ship like. Good, the faster it is, the less time I have to spend looking at it! Go hire Giugiaro and let him pen something for you. He's only the best designer EVER!
3. Get year-2000 service intervals. I mean...it's time to get slightly high-tech here. Again, to some it may not matter but plenty of potential( read: the future owners and maintainers of the marque ) don't want to hear about valve-jobs every 15K and all of the other absurdness. Engine out of the car at 30K? What the hell for????
4. Stay as independent as possible. The thought of some German or any other country having their mitts on decisions makes me nervous!
5. Create a "certified" pre-owned program for decent examples. Again, I'm not trying to get mainstream here but it boosts new buyer confidence along with showing people that you're not any more afraid of the car than they should be. You simply must cater to the enthusiasts as much if not more than collectors. Cars stored in hermedically sealed Sears-sized garages makes for a cool display, but the car just sitting is killing it.
OK, go ahead and grill me...