Where’s your comfort level?

Honestly, I think the technique was just performed incorrectly and overly-aggressive; akin to stripping a drain plug, because one relied on "how it feels" instead of a torque wrench. But I don't want to send you down a potentially-wrong path, nor suggest you do anything that you aren't 100% confident with. We all know these things are expensive to break, and that sinking feeling when it happens really does suck.

Scott and/or Verell seem to have a different method - maybe once they're up and have had some coffee, they'll suggest an alternative.

 

Thanks John. If it was just an item that if broken would set me back $300 I would have no problem attempting it but if it ever came to having machine work done I would honestly have to load the car and trailer it to Seattle. There’s no one around here and I would let do the work

 

Afternoon....
I've never used the cam cap shim trick. The risk is there for damaging the cap, and if that happens... It becomes a real PITA right quick. Proper repair for that is involved, aside from sourcing a new cap, the cam bore needs to be honed. There's only a handful of the reaming bars in the states. That doesn't prevent many from taking that route of using a shim, but that's a risk they accept. Comfort level and all. Having been down the road of correcting cam bores on an engine that overheated... Yeah no.. that was a hell of a job.

Granted I've had the luxury of doing all the engine work on the bench or stand so access is far greater. I've not had an issue with cams 'snapping' out of place though. They take some fore thought in approach to getting the belts on and keeping it lined up. I always start with the driven cam, belt looped onto the lower drive and held in place with a clothes pin to keep it from slipping a tooth. Then it's onto the first cam, find the pin alignment hole so that the belt on the pulley is taught, place pin, use another clothes pin to hold belt to pulley. Next cam, belt taught between them, pin in place when you find the correct alignment. Repeat on next bank.
Couple things, when I do this job I have the cams removed in order to remove the pulleys. This also allows for one to set the timing a bank at a time and check for alignment before moving to the next bank. Since there's no cams in bank 5-8 I can rotate the engine to insure 1-4 still lines up after the belt tension slack is removed via the idler pulley. If it's not aligned after a couple go arounds, then you can re-try. Once it's good, then you move onto 5-8.
Yeah, it's time consuming and why unfortunately many skip it and swap belts. It's also a great time to check valve lash.

It's really not a difficult project, just detail oriented and requires patience, mostly due to the cramped access.

Worst I've ever had to do with the engine in, we were in the middle of R&D on head gaskets, after Dyno runs it was installed into the development mule and road tested... Well, as with all R&D projects... Bumps... I got real good at pulling heads in the engine bay..3x in one week! It was a 328 project. Pulling heads and doing timing that many times in a week... Hope to never do that again!

If you can, remove the deck lid. Takes two but worth the access once it's removed.

 

Scott good afternoon! Have a couple of questions for you.
The only way I can replace the cam o-rings is to unbolt the cams correct? I misunderstood you yesterday and I thought by pulling the cam pulleys/ pins I would be able to gain access through the front to these. The O-rings still look good so I may just leave them for another day.

- I mentioned earlier that the rear bank cams look to be approximately 1/4” off factory marks. Trying to figure the best way to move each of these back into place. Do you think by moving both of these that 1/4”I would be able to do that by hand and just slip the belt back in place? Or are these going to give me grief? Trying to figure out a way to hold one in place while adjusting the other and then release both of them to put the belt on. I got nothing LOL

 

Ah, yeah the o ring I was referring to was the one on the pulley bolt to keep the oil from seeping out the front. Cams are hollow and at pressure with oil. The cam cover o ring on the aluminum puck needs to be replaced as well, they'll seep as they've been deformed from the last install. Cams must be removed to get those off.
Count yourself lucky, the engines with the back cover plate make that process a pita..

Here's the problem I see, without taking the pulley off the cam there's no way to insure that the belt/tooth alignment will occur so that the tick marks line up.

There's shops closer then Seattle if it comes to worst case. We supply diagnostic tools all over the country, there's shops in eastern WA as well. I don't know where about you are though. You don't have to share on the open forum though.

It's really not a difficult job, just time consuming for your first rodeo. Pictures, notes and patience.. You'll make it.

 

Understood. Not feeling warm and fuzzy about removing the cams however. Would feel differently if I had someone with experience close by. Have this feeling I’m digging a deeper hole .BUT, Theoretically.. the cam belts SHOULD line up correctly with the pulleys if in fact this **** show is all a product of a lazy earlier belt service correct?
I live 70 miles from Missoula Montana on flathead lake, 50 miles from glacier national Park. From reading prior threads, sounds like there’s a guy in Coeur d’Alene Idaho that has experience with 308/328. Name escapes me at the moment but I Think I’ll give him a call tomorrow. Still 200 miles away. As always, thank you for your help!

 

After considerable thought, decided to part out the car. Seats, euro mirrors and right rear axle spoken for. Just kidding. Man needs to know his Imitations and I’m not the guy at this point to be using a dial indicator, degree wheel and resetting cam timing in a Ferrari. Actually don’t see this in my future either.There are things I truly excel at, like making coffee! This was not one of those cases and I could see myself getting in some real trouble shortly. Car was shipped to Coeur d’Alene Idaho early this morning after speaking with Mark, owner of Marks automotive at length Monday. Want to thank all of you for your encouragement and knowledge shared in dealing with this situation in which Mark echoed the same sentiments about using a dial indicator and degree wheel to set this up properly. Will take some time but will have documentation and a clear baseline start for maintenance.With someone such as myself doing this work it would always be suspect to quality of work and honestly to myself. Would rather maintenance be performed by someone with solid experience and I, being able to thumb through maintenance records and know with confidence it was handled properly. Doesn’t mean I won’t attempt to tackle other 308 projects, Just need to be a little less costly should I mess up.

 

Although there's a whole bunch of us here that work on our cars and are happy to help, there's absolutely nothing wrong with that decision and will buy a whole lot of peace of mind.

 

While I suspect you could have handled this, it's not a poor choice in the least. Sometimes it's best to realize when something is outside your confidence level, and find another solution. For all the cars I've worked on, there are still a few procedures that make me nervous to consider. Sounds like you found someone that knows what they're doing - which is definitely a win!

 

I’m sure it would have ran afterwords, it runs now, so what’s to be gained if I didn’t do it properly? This after purchasing a degree wheel, dial indicator, and numerous other specially items I’m sure. Sitting down for a few nights learning how to use these items along with do’s/don’ts Specific to a Ferrari four valve engine for this one time event. Tying the shop up for 2 weeks (Best case scenario) Etc,etc. and end result would be suspect quality workmanship even given my best intentions. Not sure everyone knows this but here in Montana I can’t just drop into our local independent Ferrari technician and have him visually show me what I need to understand. And finally what did it for me was to have maintenance records that substantiate this was in fact handled correctly.
Comedy wise.. this would be the exact same scenario if I decided to pull my wisdom teeth. Sure I know what teeth are! Haven’t a clue how to use the tools but I’m sure I can get them extracted. Now to get the infection under control!

 

Good choice Kim. I spoke to Mark a couple of years ago myself and he sounded like he knew what he was doing for sure. I will need to set the timing myself in the near future and will be interested in hearing about your experience with Mark. Till then I will just do a belt swap.

 

Called Botzans in Spokane Wa. But they we’re too busy to give me more then 5 minutes. Said they could get me in mid November and to call back if that worked for me. So I placed the next call to Marks Automotive with the same expectations of mid November appointment. Said “ hey I know you’re really busy and if possible could you give me a call back in the next day or so when you would have 15 minutes to spare?“ his response was “ it’s always busy, how can I help you?” Mark spent probably 35 or 40 minutes with me during that phone conversation. Definitely came away with a feeling he knows his stuff and no stranger to Ferrari. Got the car loaded on the trailer Sunday night I met him first thing in the morning. Very nice guy with a lot going on in his shop. Came away with feeling my cars and very competent hands.