Why so 'mysterioso' with Enzo production?

Did ferrari say they were only making 399 cars, or did they specifically put in writing in a contract that they guaranteed they would only make 399? My guess is the former. How successful were those people who bought the "last cadillac convertible" boss Hog style eldorado convertible in the 70's suing GM when the Allante came out? They were not. If they made 400, 500 or 600 Enzos, the market value is the same- a rare high priced halo car- and to be a halo ferrari is why they go for what they go for and will always be worth more relative to other comparable period ferraris.

 

There is a German book with all the chass.nr. of production cars.
What does this book say?

I don't have it.

here is the book:
http://www.amazon.com/Ferrari-Handbuch-Seriennummern-Numbers-1947-2007/dp/3898807118

Xander

 

Just get a Mondial Cabriolet if you want a more exclusive car

natant

 

Really interesting thread!

There is one silver Nurburing Enzo available in Europe, here is the link:
http://www.autoscout24.ch/as24web/Detail.aspx?from=list&wl=1&lng=fra&id=6363284&qs=from%3dDefault%26zipcountry%3dCH%26make%3d27%26modellike%3dEnzo%26cur%3dCHF%26sort%3dtopl%26total%3d4%26eftotal%3d4&page=1&row=1

Looks really good btw..

 

it seems evident.

 

I believe that they all have a plaque that says 399 limited production, and not the actual number in the series that the car is. I was able to get this shot of the plaque in TaxDr's Enzo at the Alpine show this month.
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Friendly reminder that the initial announced production run was 349 and I recall some uproar when they raised it to 399.

 

It would be funny to see the plaintiff's response when the judge offers them a $650000 refund in exchange for their Enzo . Regardless of the production numbers I doublt if any Enzo owner would be ticked off when their car almost doubled in value in the first 10 years, unlike any car ever manufactured by a U.S. auto maker.

 

From a business standpoint, the above statement makes perfect sense.

I look at it like this. Whether Ferrari produces 399 Enzos as advertised, or if the end result is that Ferrari actually produced close to 500 cars, the owners still have purchased a limited production vehicle. The cars were produced to be "driven". Ferrari doesn't want these cars to sit and accumulate in value, although that is what some do.

I could understand the false advertising issues, false production numbers and the want to appeal these issues in legal ways, but I don't think any of it would hold up in the courts.

Many products are brought out for a limited production run, and when the market shows a demand it's not uncommon that you see another limited production run and so on and so on.

 

I don't know about the legal side but if you buy something that has a plaque saying "limited 1 of 399" in the case of the Enzo or "limited 1 of 499" in the case of the 16M and you're actually buying the 450th Eno made or the 550th 16M then that is fundamentally dishonest. It wasn't really a limited edition at all. It was a questino of making pretty much as many as they could sell. Of course, since Enzos are worth much more now than their original purchase price owners don't have much reason to complain but even so it is a dubious practice.

Jonathan

 

I hope I am not going to sound very ignorant and this is not my area of expertise. But 1. I am intrigued to know/see the evidence that there were more than 400 made. I know, from my own research into Zondas, that tracking down cars is very hard and the differences between Enzos are less than those of Zondas. I also highly doubt that someone has seen all the serial numbers as my friend's Enzo's number is unknown by the databases and there will be so many more Enzos that have not had their Vins verified. So where does this information come from? A list of serial numbers? If this is the case then 2. What about the Maserati MC12 that were all made on Enzo chassis? Could this account for discrepancies in numbers? These are just some of my thoughts!

 

It is combined information from various sources. I'll lay pretty good odds that the serial number of your friend's Enzo is already in my database. PM me if you want more information.

Maseratis have entirely different VINs.

Jonathan

 

As Jonathan has said, Maseratis have totally different VINs. And FXXs are not included in the number of Enzos either. The number arrived at in this thread is through a series of people who are plugged into a network of information. Not some kid with a magazine at a candy store; and not some guy at a car show who heard something at another car show. The information is valid and very few pieces of it can escape verification.

And just as you've said, there will be so many more Enzos that have not had their VINs verified. So the number could realistically be north of 500.

I, too, would be interested in your friend's Enzo serial number. I imagine it's already known, but I'll refrain from assumption in the spirit of verification.

 

NNO and jtremlet:

Just looking for a total number here.

How many Enzos are in your database?

 

+1.

 

Do you think if the market tanked and the Enzo depreciated in value that more owners would dispute the production numbers?

 

The question in post 65 was asked in this thread a couple of months ago already (post 11) and the best answer was that Mr Sheehan & others were aware of not less than 446 and probably 491 (post 21) - try reading the whole thread !

 

Conservatively, 480.

 

Exactly...

Irrespective of the number of cars produced each owner has made a vast profit on his/her purchase, therefore I'm not sure what they would be filing a law suit against Ferrari for?...only making 50% profit on their purchase?

Unless the purchaser tried to prove that the huge profit they made could have been even higher were the number actually 399 not 450+?

I just can't see it happening.

If this practice was repeated and it could be proved that over production seriously devalued a car and it can be proved beyond doubt the manufacturer lied about production numbers.....that would be different.

 

I agree with this and that's exactly the reason why there are probably even more than the 491 noted.. also agree that Enzo owners are not really bothered.

 

Well, since your post indicates that you are a smart a$$, let me provide you with some guidance.

First, I read the whole thread. Perhaps you should review my question.

Second, the question is posed in post #10, not post #11.

Third, my question was aimed at NNO and jtremlant, and requested a specific number in their database. Asking a question about something specific to two posters is not the same as getting an answer from Joe Sackey or Gerald Rousch. I was not looking for a "range" but rather a number--which can be found on NNO's database. No offense to Joe S. or Gerald, but Carbon is obsessive with his information and I trust it to be very precise and specific. Also, Mr. Sheehan's quote is from 2007, and I believe that NNO and jtremlant have made some better progress in the intervening years.

Fourth, there was a specific reason I asked NNO and jtremlant instead of the others, but apparently that distinction is lost on you.

And, Fifth, why be so snippy?

 

Thank you very, very much.

 

You know the beauty of it is it's a win-win. Ferrari says it's a limited edition of ONLY 399 cars built, you're very lucky to have been chosen. Meanwhile, they build an extra 100 to sell to those who beg for one. We may all sit around and say shame on them, but a) they're making more money and b) the owners certainly don't want to admit there's more than 399 of them. So who's really going to complain?

 

None taken!