YABTP: Making the "Battery Conditioner Connected" light | FerrariChat

YABTP: Making the "Battery Conditioner Connected" light

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by wkumari, Dec 6, 2011.

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  1. wkumari

    wkumari Karting

    Jul 15, 2011
    169
    Northern Virginia
    Full Name:
    Warren
    Hi,

    So, I have a CTEK battery tender fitted -- did the standard hard-wire lugs to the battery, etc -- all works great, except that I have now managed to start driving off 3+ times with the battery tender still connected. This makes me sad...

    Page 35 of the F430 Spider owners manual clearly shows that there is an icon to let you know that there is a battery conditioner connected ("Battery conditioner connected: When the instrument panel is on, it indicates that the battery charge maintainer is still activated.") -- does anyone know what / where the sense wire for this is, and if it gets grounded or tied to +12V to make it illuminate? There is a small 3 prong (factory) connector where the manual claims the factory conditioner goes ( Page 114 of the manual), but I am not sure that this is the correct one -- it is female and looks to be a low power / a data connector?
    If this is actually the bender connector, does anyone know the pinout, who sells the male portion and whether the "extra" pin needs to be tied to 12V or ground to illuminate the warning?

    Yes, I know that I could / should just tie a ribbon the the windscreen wiper / put something on the drivers seat, etc to remind myself that the conditioner is connected, but these seem sub-optimal...

    W
     
  2. FasterIsBetter

    FasterIsBetter F1 Veteran

    Jul 22, 2004
    5,845
    NoNJ/Jupiter FL
    Full Name:
    Steve W.
    Seems like an awfully complex way of dealing with a simple problem. And you even said it yourself -- just write a note, put it on the dashboard that says "Disconnect the battery tender." Bingo, you're done. When I'm working on one of the cars and I have disabled the brakes, or drained the fluids, etc., and I stop for the day, I just take a piece of paper, write a reminder to myself, and put it on the center console or dash, someplace where I'll see it if I get into the car and decide to go. And in your case, you could just use the same piece of paper over and over; just keep it with the battery tender.
     
  3. FerrariDublin

    FerrariDublin F1 Rookie

    Jun 14, 2009
    3,453
    Dublin, Ireland
    Full Name:
    Greg
    Yup agree with above. Even easier, if you have the cable length, just loop the charging cable through the steering wheel before you connect your charging lead.
     
  4. wkumari

    wkumari Karting

    Jul 15, 2011
    169
    Northern Virginia
    Full Name:
    Warren
    Unfortunately the power-outlet for the tender is in the passenger side...

    Also, this has turned into one of those "it's the principle of the thing" type of things -- it has to just be a simple tie the line high (or low :)).

    I spent a good 2 hours or so looking though 360 service manuals and think I am getting close...
     
  5. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 28, 2003
    38,223
    PNW
    Full Name:
    John
    How about just leaving the front bonnet open when the charger is connected. You wouldn't drive off with it open would you?

    I can't really say anything bad about what you've done as I've done some not so bright things too, but now I always try to take a walk around the 308 and double check everything is in place before I even climb in to start it. This is especially true if I've done any work on it. Getting in a hurry and wanting to take it out for that test drive is probably the time I've made the most mistakes.
     
  6. ttdang123

    ttdang123 Formula Junior

    Nov 28, 2009
    706
    North San Diego CA
    Full Name:
    Tung
    #6 ttdang123, Dec 6, 2011
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2011
    I hang my car's key on the charger's wire - that is how I remind myself.
     
  7. ronrob

    ronrob Formula Junior

    Jan 15, 2007
    395
    Var, S.E. France
    Full Name:
    Ronald Brown
    So simple, so perfect!
     
  8. Darolls

    Darolls F1 Veteran
    BANNED

    Jul 2, 2003
    7,782
    Full Name:
    Sparky
    Sorry Warren, you've posted a problem that isn't a problem.

    Just think about it and I'm sure you'll come up with an easy solution! ;)
     
  9. docf

    docf Formula 3

    Sep 14, 2008
    1,375
    Florida
    Full Name:
    Gary
    I've destroyed mine by driving over it!

    Docf
     
  10. viphoto

    viphoto Formula Junior

    Sep 11, 2010
    264
    Carlsbad, CA
    Full Name:
    Mark
  11. saw1998

    saw1998 F1 Veteran

    Jun 8, 2008
    8,237
    San Antonio, Texas
    Full Name:
    Scott
  12. wkumari

    wkumari Karting

    Jul 15, 2011
    169
    Northern Virginia
    Full Name:
    Warren
    #12 wkumari, Jan 5, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    tl;dr -- fixed.

    Thanks to everyone who provided suggestions -- unfortunately my OCD wouldn't let me just hang a tag on the key / wire / etc. I had to make the icon work, so...

    I found the wiring diagrams for a 360 and assumed that the cable colors likely remained the same, and where the cables run (surprisingly enough, the battery and ECU :p).
    I then removed the built in charger connector in the passenger footwell and removed the string-relief boot and checked the cable colors [ Pictures 1 and 2 ]. Sure enough, the colors matched (Red, Black and Red/Black).

    Anyway, I checked the voltages on the wires and the Red/Black (sense, pin 2) wire was close to ground, so "obviously" it needed to be raised to 12V to let the vehicle know a charger was connected -- well, there is a difference between "obviously" and actually doing it, and I *so* didn't want to fry part of an ECU... After praying, sacrificing a chicken and all the other observances needed, I hooked up a current limiting resistor and a fuse (and a second fuse just for added peace of mind :)) and bridged +12V (Pin 1) to Sense (Pin 2) -- and there was a clonk (which almost made me wet myself) and the icon lit up (the clonk seems to just be a relay or solonid engaging?).

    Luckily the connector itself has the manufacturer name visible (BURNDY, now part of Souriau) but finding exactly which one of the thousands of connectors that they make took a fair bit of time -- eventually found that it is part of the BANTAMATE II 5000 series, MBG4R1 for the female and MBG4P1 for the male. It uses the Souriau "Trim-Trio" (expensive!) contacts.

    Anyway, ordered a set of plugs (and contacts), cut the clips off a spare CTEK charger cable, crimped and soldered the contacts on, and built a cable with the "Ferrari" end on one side and CTEK on the other [Picture 3]. Unfortunately the strain relief boots (MBG4S1) are backordered at Allied, Mouser and DigiKey and so I'm still waiting for those to tidy the cable up.

    It is much more convenient to hook up ([Picture 5]) and, when connected, the vehicle won't start, and displays the "Battery conditioner connected" icon ([Picture 4]).

    If you want to build your own, the Mouser part number for the connector is 649-MBG4P1 ($3:50), you will also need Size 16 Trim-Trio contacts, a crimper, a CTEK cable (or you can just wire this directly to the charger cable) and (if you can find one in stock) a strain relief boot (MBG4S1). On the plug (charger) end, the pinouts are:
    Pin 1: +12V
    Pin 2: Sense -- tie to +12 to illuminate warning / prevent vehicle from starting.
    Pin 3: Ground
    Pin 4: N/C
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    Qavion likes this.
  13. 430tdf

    430tdf Formula Junior

    Aug 7, 2008
    278
    Canada
    Full Name:
    Brett
    Warren,

    Thanks for the great work!

    It's nice to know I have an alternative to the exorbitant price that Ferrari would charge if I ever need to replace the charger that came with my car.
     
  14. MacGeek

    MacGeek Formula Junior

    Oct 4, 2007
    368
    Torino, Italy
    Excellent work!

    Out of curiosity, have you determined what's the maximum amperage the stock charger receptacle will safely accept? Thanks to your research, we could fit more powerful and modern chargers (like the CTEK MXS 5.0), instead of the wimpy 0.8A Ferrari charger.
     
  15. mjz

    mjz Karting

    Aug 3, 2007
    163
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Michael
    Warren,

    Just to be clear on my part. Pin 2 gets connected to what on the Ctek charger side? I haven't cut the Ctek wire yet ... does it have 3 connectors or two? And then pin 1 and pin2 just tie together to +12V of the Ctek?

    Michael
     
  16. wkumari

    wkumari Karting

    Jul 15, 2011
    169
    Northern Virginia
    Full Name:
    Warren
    Oh, I'm so sorry, I hadn't seen that this thread was updated.

    I have more photos on my site at: https://www.kumari.net/gallery/index.php/Cars/Ferrari-F430/Charger-Cable

    The CTEK charger cable only has two wires, a positive (red) and negative (black).
    Here is an an example picture: http://smartercharger.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/CTEK_Comfort_Connect_Indicator_Eyelet.jpg

    So, you take an existing CTEK pigtail (such as this one CTEK Comfort Connect Indicator Eyelet - CTEK Battery Chargers -- $11.99 (assuming your CTEK has the new style connector)) and cut off the eyelets / clamps.

    You then connect the positive cable to pin 1 and pin 2 (connect the actual positive cable to pin 1, and a jumper to pin 2). Negative goes to pin 3 and you are done.

    I've had a number of people asking for more information / sounding a little scared of building this themselves.
    If I were to build a bunch of these cables and sell them for around $125 would folk be interested? I'd *prefer* that folk build them themselves, but realize not everyone is comfortable with doing this....
     
  17. parkerfe

    parkerfe F1 World Champ

    Sep 4, 2001
    12,887
    Cumming, Georgia
    Full Name:
    Franklin E. Parker
    So you drove off with your battery tender connected...twice...really?
     
  18. mjz

    mjz Karting

    Aug 3, 2007
    163
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Michael
    Thanks, Warren, for the clarification.
    In my case, I have the OEM connector from Ferrari's CTEK 800 charger. The charger failed (too small for AGM batteries) and I bought a new CTEK 7002 that has a specific mode for AGM and has been working great. What I intend to do following your posting is to cut the old connector off and cut the new connector off as well. And then splice the wires together following your suggestions (pin 1 and pin2 are 12V+; pin3 = 12V-). And that should do it. It does mean I would not be able to use the 7002 for other cars, but then I don't use it for my other cars anyway. I just use Battery Tenders.
     
  19. wkumari

    wkumari Karting

    Jul 15, 2011
    169
    Northern Virginia
    Full Name:
    Warren
    Yup, at least... Each time I'd start reversing out of the garage and hear the charger sliding along the ground, and stop before the charger pulled from the wall...

    But, the most annoying bit was knowing that there was some functionality (the "Charger Connected" icon and engine lockout) that I couldn't access...

    :p
     
  20. mjz

    mjz Karting

    Aug 3, 2007
    163
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Michael

    So I did it. I bought a Ctek pigtail and cut off the eyelets. I soldered the black Ctek 7002 (-) wire to the pin 3 black wire of the Ferrari three pin connector (which I cut off from the failed OEM Ctek 800). I then soldered pin 1 (+) and pin 2 (+ sense) to the Ctek 7002 red wire (+).

    First moment of truth came when I plugged the OEM connector (which is now connected to the Ctek 7002) into the Ferrari plug by the passenger foot wall. The Ctek worked normally progressing the lights to finally green.

    Second moment of truth came when I tried to start the car. This is where it is different from the 360's apparently. When I turned the key to "on", everything lit up as normal, but when I tried to start the car (push the start button), the car starter clicked as if too little power to the starter. There was no icon lighting up on the console. The car wouldn't start, but it seemed like it wanted to.

    No matter, I shut everything off, disconnected the charger (at the passenger foot wall) like I used to do before the OEM charger failed, and then re-started the 430 just fine. Full power, fully charged battery. Started instantly.

    So I assume this is normal for the 430 to light up the console and appear to start - including starter solenoid clicking. Is this true for others?

    Thanks, Warren.

    Michael
     
  21. wkumari

    wkumari Karting

    Jul 15, 2011
    169
    Northern Virginia
    Full Name:
    Warren
    Just to be clear, my vehicle was an F430 -- I was only using the 360 wiring diagrams because I had them handy...

    I have no idea why you didn't get the "Charger Connected" icon -- you just got the standard icon?

    Yup, that's what mine would do (solenoid clicking, just not turning of the starter motor), but I'd also get the icon...

    No worries. Glad it's working for you...

    W
     
  22. ferrari f1 360

    May 5, 2013
    2
    london.uk
    Full Name:
    shaun
    great post mate

    im converting a ferrari 430 trickle charger to fit my 360. i bought the components and putting it together is there any thing different with the wiring? also will it show on the dash that the battery is charging?
     
  23. Crowndog

    Crowndog F1 Veteran

    Jul 16, 2011
    7,042
    Fairfield,Pa
    Full Name:
    Robert

    Wouldn't recommend using a trickle charger it will in time fry your battery. Instead use a "tending" type device to properly keep the battery topped off. Cetek devices also have a anti sulfation mode for lead-acid batteries.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  24. ferrari f1 360

    May 5, 2013
    2
    london.uk
    Full Name:
    shaun
    im only using as its an original charger just to maintain the new bosch battery i have installed, i also like the fact it displays the icon on the dash. if the charger fails i will defo buy the ctek charger as they do have good reviews about them. i will try and take some pics of my wiring in case any one wants to do the same thing but all credit goes to wkumari for idea.
     
  25. BigJay2050

    BigJay2050 F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    May 27, 2014
    7,152
    So that adapter cable looks like a female end going into another female end. Do the pins in the adapter cable "pop out" when it is inserted to make contact with the charger port under the dash?
     

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